Wiki Everything you wanted to know about Intelligent Octopus But Were Afraid To Ask

Why write this post?
A lot of people are starting to get interested in IO. I don't think Octopus do a very good job of spelling out the benefits in their website. They have some FAQs, but the same questions keep coming up over and over on the forums.

What is it?
In a nutshell, IO is a split tariff that gives you a cheap off-peak rate for charging your EV and other electrical items in the household, including home batteries.

Isn’t that the same as Octopus Go or Go Faster?
The principle is the same, but in exchange for some benefits which we’ll explain, you allow Octopus to control the timing of your EV charge, so they can choose low carbon intensity and/or cheap wholesale priced time slots.

So I’m not in control of my charge? I don’t like the sound of that!
Well yes…and no. You’re in control of how much to charge and when you want the car to be ready, just like you would be normally. Within those parameters, you’re allowing Octopus to control which half-hour slots the car chooses to get to that target % charge. And you can always override IO if you want to “bump charge” through the day.

OK, but what are the benefits you mentioned for this trade off?
First of all, you get a larger guaranteed off-peak window for using household appliances and charging home batteries, etc. It’s six hours between 23:30-05:30. Go, for example, is a fixed 4 hour window.
In addition, when IO schedules your EV charging slots it sometimes creates schedules that fall outside of the fixed, six hour window. If that happens your EV charging and all your household use in these extra-slots is also charged at off-peak rates.
I have frequently had schedules give me seven or more hours of off-peak rates. On one occasion, I had a total of ten hours of off-peak rates.

Am I eligible?
You need a smart meter and a compatible car and/or charger. Since you’re reading this here, I assume you’ve got or are thinking of getting a Tesla. IO works with the Tesla API to create the charging schedules. The advantage of this is that IO will work with any* home charger. If you have a charger with smart features, you need to disable them so that the charger acts as a dumb switch. IO will control everything via Tesla’s API to start and stop your charging.
*Even your granny charger - but you need to tell IO what the max throughput is when you go through setup so that it can work out your schedules properly.

Some of this sounds too good to be true.
Phantom drain caused by having smart charging enabled in the Octopus app has been fixed as of 30th August 2022. One small side effect appears to be that schedules sometimes take longer to appear in the app after plugging in.

Further questions (to be updated in the main thread body once the edit timer on this post expires)

I have two EVs, can I charge the other while on IO?
Not with IO scheduling the charging, but you can charge any other car in the fixed 23:30-05:30 off peak window or at any other time at peak prices.

What are the rates etc?
Octopus do a decent job of explaining the peak and off-peak rates along with contracts etc. Head over to their pages to discover that.

I asked for a target % of x, but I got less than x.
There are two or three reasons for this.

The first, most common reason, is that Tesla reports battery % differently depending on where you look. The API (that IO uses) reports the gross battery %. This is generally fixed but can fluctuate very slightly. The Tesla app shows usable %. Apps like Teslamate and Teslafi can display both. Quite often, there is a delta of 2-3% which may be down to battery temp or other factors. This usable % will often be recovered as the battery warms up during a drive.

Some users have reported charging % being way off, perhaps 10% or more. This could be down to an error in the onboarding process. Some of the charger database entries incorrectly assume the charger you are onboarding is the 11kW version, without actually saying so in the charger description. The Andersen A2 was an early example of this. If you suspect this may be the case, the easiest thing to do is go through the on-boarding again and choose "Generic 7.4kW charger". It won't affect your functionality on IO in any way.

Lastly, it has to be mentioned that occasionally IO just craps out. It may be down to a comms error, a server error at Octopus' end, or just reasons. IO is a beta product and it's wise to expect one or two quirks from time to time

 

[RedMod3]

but in this case:
1) he fully charges during day with Solar, for free.
2) plugs in with 80% SOC and target of 80% SOC at 5 pm.
3) IO schedules no charges outside periods. It schedules no charges at all. because - welp, no need.
4) He charges power wall during off-peak 23:30 - 5:30 as anything anyone would do.

So all in all, he acts in whole spirit and letter and Ts&Cs of IO yada yada yada.

where's the problem?! I do not understand.

Precisely, and when I do need power for the car for when solar is not available, I let IO charge it when t wants to as it does not matter to me.

Also, I would not let IO charge the Tesla, even if the state of charge was less than 80%, if I did not need a charged car.

You are correct yessuz, what you are suggesting is completely normal behaviour.

 

[browellm]

I let IO charge it when t wants to as it does not matter to me.

The fact you've said this again tells me you still don't understand how it can schedule outside of the fixed period, and you won't be able to stop your PW from feeding the car. By all means go for it, it's not as if your solar won't top the pw back up (in summer).

 

[yessuz]

Look, stop "contributing" if you want to keep coming up with stupid edge cases that don't apply for 5 months a year and are nothing to do with the tariff anyway.

butt hurt a much? or what's your problem?!

I am not coming with excuses. I just modeled redmod3 with solar and power wall situation. why are you so sensible?

in the end of the day, if I have option to charge somewhere else, arrive with full battery and do not charge my car at all - am I not allowed to use my off-peak rate for whatever reason I need? I still get 6 hrs off-peak.

I kind of struggle to understand your position here and why are you so bloody aggressive

 

[yessuz]

The fact you've said this again tells me you still don't understand how it can schedule outside of the fixed period, and you won't be able to stop your PW from feeding the car. By all means go for it, it's not as if your solar won't top the pw back up (in summer).

I think you just do not understand redmod3 question and/or situation

 

[browellm]

I think you just do not understand redmod3 question and/or situation

I understand it perfectly

 

[Mrklaw]

I suppose this is a little like a reverse 'fair usage policy' we'd get with internet. How 'little' can you need to charge an EV before you're not holding up the spirit of the agreement?

There is a built in assumption that you'll need 'some kwh' for your EV. Octopus want to adjust that demand and in return they offer you a longer window off peak. Win-win right?

But if you barely charge, all the benefit is yours. They partly want to do this to learn about effective demand management and if you don't demand, they can't manage and no data is gathered.

I assume thats the basic point being argued here.

Now you can of course get into the weeds. Since wfh I maybe charge once a week (almost entirely on IO). But if I drove 10x as many miles, and used solar a lot, along with some rapid and maybe charging at work - I might have the same demand on IO even though 90% of my charging is not with them.

I guess the question is how much is 'enough'? And there is no clearly defined amount with IO so its guesswork from us.

 

[yessuz]

I understand it perfectly

it doesn't look like that.

He explicitly mentions how his usage would be which 100% falls within spirt, letter and Ts&Cs of IO.

 

[yessuz]

I suppose this is a little like a reverse 'fair usage policy' we'd get with internet. How 'little' can you need to charge an EV before you're not holding up the spirit of the agreement?

There is a built in assumption that you'll need 'some kwh' for your EV. Octopus want to adjust that demand and in return they offer you a longer window off peak. Win-win right?

But if you barely charge, all the benefit is yours. They partly want to do this to learn about effective demand management and if you don't demand, they can't manage and no data is gathered.

I assume thats the basic point being argued here.

Now you can of course get into the weeds. Since wfh I maybe charge once a week (almost entirely on IO). But if I drove 10x as many miles, and used solar a lot, along with some rapid and maybe charging at work - I might have the same demand on IO even though 90% of my charging is not with them.

I guess the question is how much is 'enough'? And there is no clearly defined amount with IO so its guesswork from us.

well, exactly.

IO does not demand minimal usage or something.

it's basically transaction of your vehicle data for more off-peak rates. that's all it is, really. Questions might be asked on what are they going to do with that data, how use it etc, but in tcs it's all what is requested - access to API and car data.

 

[chwe]

Not wanting to take part in any arguments, but FWIW I think Octopus are probably well aware that their tariff will be 'gamed' and this is all probably part of the data and analytics they'll be doing on how to manage smart grids. Their tech is now used all over the world and 'playing the system' will always be something that is done.... They'll be interested in how the product is used in real life my real people and as a result I wouldn't expect them to be kicking people off the tariff if they aren't in flagrant breach of the T&C's.

I'll probably be signing up to IO when my MY arrives, but will also not be using it as intended until they sort out the phantom drain issues because that's just causing energy waste which is exactly what they are supposed to be all about avoiding...

 

[Drew57]

I'll probably be signing up to IO when my MY arrives, but will also not be using it as intended until they sort out the phantom drain issues because that's just causing energy waste which is exactly what they are supposed to be all about avoiding...

The cause of phantom drain is well documented. No energy waste need occur as It's our choice whether we take the simple step of switching on & off.

 

[chwe]

The cause of phantom drain is well documented. No energy waste need occur as It's our choice whether we take the simple step of switching on & off.

I realise it's a simple task to turn it off, and I understand when it occurs, but it's still a design flaw in their code. And it's equally easy to forget to turn it off and find that you've lost 4% charge in 24 hours. For my circumstances, it would be easier to keep the smart charging off and just schedule a charge for 6 hours overnight. I shouldn't need to have to remember to turn it off when the car is not plugged in.

 

[Mrklaw]

I realise it's a simple task to turn it off, and I understand when it occurs, but it's still a design flaw in their code. And it's equally easy to forget to turn it off and find that you've lost 4% charge in 24 hours. For my circumstances, it would be easier to keep the smart charging off and just schedule a charge for 6 hours overnight. I shouldn't need to have to remember to turn it off when the car is not plugged in.

with the current situation with Tesla - I agree you shouldn’t feel remotely bad if you turn it off and just use the 6 hour period until they fix the issue. I’ve forgotten multiple times and its probably eaten an entire battery over the last few months. So its costing me real money

 

[page3]

Can I just check I’ve got this right-

* when Tesla not plugged in make sure intelligent is off.
* when Ioniq is plugged in make sure intelligent is off. Use it’s onboard timer to charge 11:30-5:30am
* when Tesla plugged in, enable intelligent and let it schedule things. Check app for time slots allocated to see if other household usage can benefit.

 

[yessuz]

Can I just check I’ve got this right-

* when Tesla not plugged in make sure intelligent is off.
* when Ioniq is plugged in make sure intelligent is off. Use it’s onboard timer to charge 11:30-5:30am
* when Tesla plugged in, enable intelligent and let it schedule things. Check app for time slots allocated to see if other household usage can benefit.

yes... but IO affect Tesla only, so when Ioniq is connected, means your tesla is not connected - it should be off by default for you

 

[Drew57]

yes... but IO affect Tesla only, so when Ioniq is connected, means your tesla is not connected - it should be off by default for you

Not necessarily. If the Ioniq is connected to a different charging means (ie granny charger) then both can be charging at the same time. We occasionally do this with our two EVs

I sometimes see an IO schedule that does not exactly match the actual charging when I check the following day. Her's a strange one from earlier this week where one of the actual slots was only 01.25 - 01.40 am whereas the schedule itself is always shown in multiples of 30 minutes or greater and actually had different time slots to those used. This is an image from the PV inverter web browser:

There could be an issue if the same thing happened outside of the 23.30-05.30 period so it may be risky to programme other high usage devices for extra slots in case they change overnight.

 

[Garry TheBiz]

There could be an issue if the same thing happened outside of the 23.30-05.30 period so it may be risky to programme other high usage devices for extra slots in case they change overnight.

I have had exactly this happen. I scheduled the tumble drier for one of extra the slots, only to wake up and see the slots had changed.

 

[page3]

I have had exactly this happen. I scheduled the tumble drier for one of extra the slots, only to wake up and see the slots had changed.

Oh, that puts a different spin on it. Everyone has said one of the main advantages is that you get additional low-rate charging periods, but if you can’t benefit from them as they can change I don’t see much advantage over Go to offset the added complexity.

 

[yessuz]

Not necessarily. If the Ioniq is connected to a different charging means (ie granny charger) then both can be charging at the same time. We occasionally do this with our two EVs

I sometimes see an IO schedule that does not exactly match the actual charging when I check the following day. Her's a strange one from earlier this week where one of the actual slots was only 01.25 - 01.40 am whereas the schedule itself is always shown in multiples of 30 minutes or greater and actually had different time slots to those used. This is an image from the PV inverter web browser:

View attachment 826276

There could be an issue if the same thing happened outside of the 23.30-05.30 period so it may be risky to programme other high usage devices for extra slots in case they change overnight.

* when Ioniq is plugged in make sure intelligent is off. Use it’s onboard timer to charge 11:30-5:30am
This is the only thing which I was commenting. State of Ioniq is irrelevant to IO

 

[browellm]

Oh, that puts a different spin on it. Everyone has said one of the main advantages is that you get additional low-rate charging periods, but if you can’t benefit from them as they can change I don’t see much advantage over Go to offset the added complexity.

Important not to overstate how often they change. By late evening the slots are pretty stable. Using my calculation further up the thread, you can see how much benefit just having 6 hours over 4 gives you, before even any additional slots are granted.

What's "complex" about it? I've never known anything generate so much unjustified hand-wringing. You all drive Teslas, chaps.

 

[yessuz]

Oh, that puts a different spin on it. Everyone has said one of the main advantages is that you get additional low-rate charging periods, but if you can’t benefit from them as they can change I don’t see much advantage over Go to offset the added complexity.

You CAN but it is not necessary the fact that you will have slots

Standard Octopus Go off peak is from 0:30 to 4:30 - 4 hrs
IO off peak is 23:30 to 5:30 - two additional hours. IF you are lucky you might get more. But any time, if you charge your car or not, connect your car to the charger or not, you get scheduled slots or not, you ALWAYS get off-peak 23:30 to 5:30.

I struggle to understand how some people fail to understand this very simple concept

You cannot see the benefit of at least 2 more hours of off-peak vs regular go!? How does that math works!?