FSD features to start rolling out in August...

[d21mike]

This would enable FSD equipped cars to possibly also change lanes automatically on the freeway without the driver having to use a turn signal. This seems like one of the lower hanging fruit in the FSD world. I would imagine that in order to be safe, these early FSD features might be geofenced to only work on actual freeways.

I understand why you would say this but I believe this is a documented feature of EAP. I.E. On Ramp to Off Ramp. It does not say but you have to manage all of the lane changes yourself.

I am thinking that most of FSD Features will happen for surface streets since EAP is handling most of freeways (on ramp to off ramp).

Example for me would be to stop for stop signs and traffic lights. I would be happy if first stopped then required me to press the accelerator to continue. And next would be to do this while following Navigation.

 

[RTPGiants]

Like it or not, Tesla will start rolling features out that will be gated to FSD. Some people will argue that these features are really EAP and complain about it. This is part of the reason I opted for FSD at the start.

 

[daniel]

That's just plain silly... you think they'll just flip a switch at some point and BOOM your car is immediately FSD? Surely they'll slowly be adding functionality over a period of time (I'm guessing years). If I were to guess I'd say they'll start with the car being able to see speed limit signs, perhaps stop at traffic lights and start going again on green, stop at stop signs, stop for pedestrians, see school zone signs, etc etc. In pieces. It won't go from NO FSD to FULL FSD overnight.

Of course I don't expect them to throw a switch and go from not FSD to FSD. But there will come a point, maybe ten years from now, when the car becomes certified as a Level 4 or Level 5 car. Until then, the car is not FSD

Don’t be dense and keep up.

Everyone - even non Tesla owners know what is being discussed.

A feature, some feature describe in the $3000 checkbox is getting activated.

I don't remember any specific features being described in the $3,000 check-box. Elon has talked about the car being able to be sent off on its own to pick up a rider, take that rider to a destination, and return. It's obvious that now Elon is saying that Tesla will begin to roll out some of the features that will eventually be part of an FSD car. I'm asking which features are coming this August.

And, incidentally, will they be BETA features that still require full driver alertness and readiness to take over, like the EAP features? Some folks have mentioned the possibility of the car being able to stop at stop signs and traffic lights when there is not a car stopped ahead of you. There are corners where the stop sign is not so easily visible. In my neighborhood I know where these are. How well will the car handle these, if indeed this is one of the features?

I don't think it is "dense" or unreasonable to ask which features they're getting close to releasing. So far I've seen speculation but nothing from Tesla. I suppose we won't actually know until those features appear in cars that have paid for FSD. I also think it's misleading to call them FSD features since they don't make the car full self driving until it has the full suite of features installed, tested, and certified.

Just as Enhanced Autopilot is not an autopilot in any reasonable sense of the word since the driver needs to be alert and ready to take over at an instant's notice, so the FSD package people are paying $3,000 for is a misleading name until the full package is ready and certified.

Kind of like labeling a carton of eggs "One dozen chickens." They're not chickens until they hatch. And it's not FSD until it can drive itself. I'm ranting about this because I've seen people shouting about Tesla's "self driving" cars get into accidents, and I have to explain that "autopilot" does not really mean autopilot. It's just a name Tesla has given to some driver-assist features. Now Tesla is going to introduce some more driver-assist features, which is excellent. But calling this "FSD" is going to come back to bite them on the ass the first time one of these cars is in an accident.

I love my Model 3. And I loved my Roadster before that. These are fabulous cars. But let's not call an egg a chicken.

 

[MXWing]

I don't remember any specific features being described in the $3,000 check-box. Elon has talked about the car being able to be sent off on its own to pick up a rider, take that rider to a destination, and return. It's obvious that now Elon is saying that Tesla will begin to roll out some of the features that will eventually be part of an FSD car. I'm asking which features are coming this August.

And, incidentally, will they be BETA features that still require full driver alertness and readiness to take over, like the EAP features? Some folks have mentioned the possibility of the car being able to stop at stop signs and traffic lights when there is not a car stopped ahead of you. There are corners where the stop sign is not so easily visible. In my neighborhood I know where these are. How well will the car handle these, if indeed this is one of the features?

I don't think it is "dense" or unreasonable to ask which features they're getting close to releasing. So far I've seen speculation but nothing from Tesla. I suppose we won't actually know until those features appear in cars that have paid for FSD. I also think it's misleading to call them FSD features since they don't make the car full self driving until it has the full suite of features installed, tested, and certified.

Just as Enhanced Autopilot is not an autopilot in any reasonable sense of the word since the driver needs to be alert and ready to take over at an instant's notice, so the FSD package people are paying $3,000 for is a misleading name until the full package is ready and certified.

Kind of like labeling a carton of eggs "One dozen chickens." They're not chickens until they hatch. And it's not FSD until it can drive itself. I'm ranting about this because I've seen people shouting about Tesla's "self driving" cars get into accidents, and I have to explain that "autopilot" does not really mean autopilot. It's just a name Tesla has given to some driver-assist features. Now Tesla is going to introduce some more driver-assist features, which is excellent. But calling this "FSD" is going to come back to bite them on the ass the first time one of these cars is in an accident.

I love my Model 3. And I loved my Roadster before that. These are fabulous cars. But let's not call an egg a chicken.

Wondering if Musk is late on his ambitious is wondering if the Pope is Catholic. Complete none story, and not a surprise to anyone. I think they are working on dialing down expectations. Also, Tesla works on software builds for a very long time before its on general release. Internal firmware was working with extra cameras over a year ago.

Will still be BETA. Unfortunate, but better than the alternative which is no Tesla.

We can only theorize at this point on the specifics but we can make highly educated guesses. Reading data from the the extra cameras and expanding on existing EAP features seems to be low hanging fruit.

Stopping for stop signs / stop lights
Scanning and automatically changing lanes

What was dense is you expecting ALL OR NOTHING for FSD which owning a Tesla and being here on TMC which you know is absolutely is not going to be the case. It's going to be a gradual roll out with two steps forward.. one step back.. two steps forward.. one step back.. long time with no steps. Some moron killing themselves.. two steps back. The Tesla drill.

When I took delivery of the first AP2 Tesla pretty much I had
- No cruise control. My 1987 Nissan Maxima had working cruise control

Patience... don't like Tesla find a better company in this space. You won't - so give them some room and trust the process.

When you buy a dozen eggs you are buying a dozen Volts.

Those dozen Volts are going to be the same dozen Volts until they are junked. They are never getting better and they have no hope of growing to Chickens.

Poor analogy when discussing Tesla's.

 

[tmoz]

I'd like to know if he is talking only about AP2 or if this means AP1 will see the improvements too.

 

[Nick's Life]

My guess of the features will include:
- Better recognition of speed limit signs
- Auto stopping at Red lights and Stop signs, users will still need to start up
- Self parking in parking lots
- Auto lane change based on slow traffic in the lane your in.
- Detection and alert of oncoming traffic in your blind spots
- Full exit and entrance on/off highways with merging
- Merge on local roads in AP

 

[ToddRLockwood]

That's just plain silly... you think they'll just flip a switch at some point and BOOM your car is immediately FSD? Surely they'll slowly be adding functionality over a period of time (I'm guessing years). If I were to guess I'd say they'll start with the car being able to see speed limit signs, perhaps stop at traffic lights and start going again on green, stop at stop signs, stop for pedestrians, see school zone signs, etc etc. In pieces. It won't go from NO FSD to FULL FSD overnight.

I believe you are correct on this. It looks as if the news media missed the words "begin" and "features." They may be adding some incremental capabilities that were originally intended to be part of FSD.

 

[tmoz]

Telling people the car will stop for stop signs is more dangerous than reading stop lights in my opinion. I've seen too many stop sign intersections where even humans have trouble with seeing the stop signs. I think a look up table of all known stop lights and stop signs would be a good double-check for any self driving system. I'd hope that any new stop sign or stop light construction would have to register their location in a central data base some day - pretty sure the data exists today, but I'm guessing it is in various formats and stowed away in various locations depending upon the city.

1st baby step would be to let the car drive itself to a tesla service center and then drive itself back to your house.

Final step, for me, would be when I could go to sleep in the car while it took me on a 200 mile trip.

I think that last step is more than 5 yrs away.

 

[daniel]

What was dense is you expecting ALL OR NOTHING for FSD which owning a Tesla and being here on TMC which you know is absolutely is not going to be the case.

I was not expecting, and I do not expect, and never have expected "all or nothing" FSD in the short term. I was criticizing Tesla for using the name "FSD" as a marketing ploy for a system that is not FSD.

Full self driving is a term that has a well-understood meaning. It means the car does not need a driver. Tesla is using this well-understood meaning to sell a suite of as-yet-undeveloped software features that are not by any stretch of the imagination full self-driving. And the first time there's an accident in a car with features Tesla groups under the marketing term "FSD" the cranks will come pouring out of the woodwork crying about how self-driving cars can never be trusted because look at the accident this one was in.

When Musk promoted the $3,000 package as FSD he stated that the car would drive itself. This year's upcoming updates will not enable these cars to drive themselves. It's misleading advertising.

Rather than saying that Tesla was about to release "FSD" features, he should have said that Tesla was about to release some new driver assist features to owners who have paid for the FSD package, as a first step toward the long-term goal of realizing the promise of FSD. He also should have told us what these features would be, but that's just my preference.

 

[chronopc]

My guess of the features will include:
- Better recognition of speed limit signs
- Auto stopping at Red lights and Stop signs, users will still need to start up
- Self parking in parking lots
- Auto lane change based on slow traffic in the lane your in.
- Detection and alert of oncoming traffic in your blind spots
- Full exit and entrance on/off highways with merging
- Merge on local roads in AP

I thought these were all considered part of EAP and not FSD.

 

[tmoz]

My guess of the features will include:
- Better recognition of speed limit signs
- Auto stopping at Red lights and Stop signs, users will still need to start up
- Self parking in parking lots
- Auto lane change based on slow traffic in the lane your in.
- Detection and alert of oncoming traffic in your blind spots
- Full exit and entrance on/off highways with merging
- Merge on local roads in AP

Add to the list - Avoid junk in the road like boards, blown tire shreds, etc.

 

[Jeff Hudson]

That's just plain silly... you think they'll just flip a switch at some point and BOOM your car is immediately FSD? Surely they'll slowly be adding functionality over a period of time (I'm guessing years). If I were to guess I'd say they'll start with the car being able to see speed limit signs, perhaps stop at traffic lights and start going again on green, stop at stop signs, stop for pedestrians, see school zone signs, etc etc. In pieces. It won't go from NO FSD to FULL FSD overnight.

Insofar as "they'll start with the car being able to see speed limit signs" my Autopilot 1 Model S can see speed limit signs as can all later Tesla's. I think you meant to say Tesla might have Autopilot programming that reacts to speed limit sign changes.

 

[effiephd]

I love using autopilot. Was one of the first beta testers to drive using autopilot and I use autopilot almost always when I drive, I have driven across America and back and to Canada and used autopilot. August is a couple months away. I disagree with what Elon said. TIME OUT ELON.

 

[tmoz]

Insofar as "they'll start with the car being able to see speed limit signs" my Autopilot 1 Model S can see speed limit signs as can all later Tesla's. I think you meant to say Tesla might have Autopilot programming that reacts to speed limit signs.

Yes, that is a good point. Autopilot only reacts to speed limit changes when it detects no barrier in the middle.

 

[effiephd]

Autopilot and autonomous is advancing at a slow and safe pace. Elon says too much at times.

I love using autopilot. Was one of the first beta testers to drive using autopilot and I use autopilot almost always when I drive, I have driven across America and back and to Canada and used autopilot. August is a couple months away. I disagree with what Elon said. TIME OUT ELON.

 

[Jeff Hudson]

I don't use my Autopilot much around town. However I just went on vacation where I drove ~800 miles on the Interstate and I can say with great candor that Autopilot used properly is a real stress reliever. With the past year of reported Autopilot accidents I have gone back and read the Owners Manual and feel much more confident in my use of Autopilot. There were a few times when I deliberately cancelled Autopilot because I was 1) paying attention - think road work zones, 2) wanted to avoid rough patches of road and 3) knew Autopilot might/could/would react unpredictably. All in all I think my Autopilot 1 system acquitted itself quite well and eagerly look forward to reading more reviews of the upcoming AP2 software improvements.

 

[adaptabl]

They are still killing people with AP. FSD will be a nightmare. I would hope the first computer to kill a person would demand a lawsuit large enough to bankrupt any company that put it on the road. We can not accept machines killing humans.

 

[Bebop]

What does he mean by "full self driving" features? Either the car is FSD or it isn't. It already has some self-driving features in EAP: It can control its speed and it can steer within its lane and it can change lanes on the freeway.

What features will the car have for those who paid for FSD that EAP cars won't have? To my way of thinking the car does not have FSD features until you can take your hands off the wheel and close your eyes. But maybe there are features that Tesla will group into the FSD category (i.e. for people who paid the extra money). Features that will not make the car FSD but that Tesla will withhold from EAP cars.

IOW, there's Full Self Driving, for which they're not going to get regulatory approval any time soon, and there's the package of features that Tesla will call "FSD" even though they do not make the car an FSD car.

You can have FSD features in batches. It’s not a binary thing. I mentioned in the other forum that it would be awesome if park seek mode was released. That is a FSD feature and would be really neat to have and try out. Maybe a more advance summon feature too. The car will park itself in your garage in the exact pinpoint location you want it to, instead of only going in a straight line forward and back.

I don’t expect full level 5 go to sleep in your car in August.

 

[diplomat33]

I was not expecting, and I do not expect, and never have expected "all or nothing" FSD in the short term. I was criticizing Tesla for using the name "FSD" as a marketing ploy for a system that is not FSD.

We have not even seen the first FSD feature yet. So how can you possibly know if the name is appropriate or not? The "FSD package" is intended to some day be L5 autonomy at some point. So, the FSD features we get will work towards that goal. So what's wrong with calling it FSD since FSD is what it will be when it is finished?

 

[Knightshade]

They are still killing people with AP.

I mean...at a much lower rate than humans are doing it, but sure...

FSD will be a nightmare. I would hope the first computer to kill a person would demand a lawsuit large enough to bankrupt any company that put it on the road. We can not accept machines killing humans.

So...only humans are ok to kill other humans?