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FSD vs. AP latest updates compared.. Is it worth it?

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Hello everyone, please forgive the topic that might have caused a few eye-rolls. But FSD has gotten better/new features. I have a current pending M3 order with FSD, and I am on the fence. I want help deciding if I should cancel FSD or not with the option of buying later. Please list what I won't have if I skip FSD, or list the AP features you absolutely love that is all you need in having AP only. And opinions if I should keep my FSD order, skip it all together, or wait and possibly buy later. I know it's ultimately my decision and my personal situation. But considering all that, please educate me and tell me with your experience what you'd do if you could do it all over.

Hoping to decide on going with the current order I have or hitting the cancel button on FSD...

FYI: For those of you that are going to want further details about me, I am not a software tech nerd but I love new fancy gadgets and tech, I can afford to get FSD but I don't have extra money to just blow, ie... it will push me from paying off the car in 2.5 years to a little over 3. Low interest loan makes it not worth worrying about interest charge difference.
 
Have you tried any of the FSD features in a test drive? Navigate on Autopilot for example?

personally, the only FSD feature I am currently using is auto lane change. The rest of it is too dicey (Summon and Autopark) and Navigate on a AP isn’t generally needed for my commute. So, if I was buying today, I probably wouldn’t pay the extra as 95% of my AP use is just basic AP.


If you skip FSD, you get traffic aware cruise control, and lane centering (Autosteer). To change lanes, you will need to disengage AP. You will not get auto park, Summon (dumb or smart), auto lane change, or navigate on Autopilot.
 
Have you tried any of the FSD features in a test drive? Navigate on Autopilot for example?

personally, the only FSD feature I am currently using is auto lane change. The rest of it is too dicey (Summon and Autopark) and Navigate on a AP isn’t generally needed for my commute. So, if I was buying today, I probably wouldn’t pay the extra as 95% of my AP use is just basic


If you skip FSD, you get traffic aware cruise control, and lane centering (Autosteer). To change lanes, you will need to disengage AP. You will not get auto park, Summon (dumb or smart), auto lane change, or navigate on Autopilot.

Thanks for sharing your advice Az. Seriously though, to change lanes I have to disengage AP? Then turn it back on again in order to lane keep and have smart cruise control etc..? Sounds tedious.

I think I would use NOA about 20% of my total over all driving at least, most driving is city but at least some highway nearly daily.

And no, I have not tried FSD. I did a test drive about 12 months ago and fell in love. I was blown away that the car stopped and auto accelerated at city traffic lights but wasn't given the option to NOA, and summon was just a rumor then. My fully loaded 2017 infiniti didn't even have the smart cruise option on it which surprises me so I was super impressed with the aforementioned smart cruise.
 
AP lane change isn’t bad.
While AP is engaged set directional on. AP will maintain until you steer the wheel into the new lane. TACC will remain on. Push the Auto Pilot down once to reengage auto steer.

it’s slightly annoying but not $7000 annoying.

I am always amazed at the amount of people that say that what basically amounts to automatic lane changes is worth $7,000. Sure there are other features you get with "FSD" but generally speaking, they don't work very great and are useful under limited circumstances. I have asked several people on Reddit if they thought it was worth that much money for lane changes and almost all of them said yes and they would do it again. Like holy cow people, it isn't hard to change lanes and it takes like 2 seconds.
 
tesla has made rear visibility so much harder than older cars used to be - that its not quite a pure luxury (auto lane change).

previous 2003 vw - no problem seeing and doing confident LCs.

this car - I struggle all the time and never am truly sure I'm open when I try to LC.

having the system scan many 10's of times faster than I can would sure be useful.

but its unfair that that's the ONLY real goodie left in fsd above regular ap, and I'm not paying $7k for it. regular ap is 90% of what I would want in my daily drive. (hopefully they don't remove more from ap, over time!)
 
Have you tried any of the FSD features in a test drive? Navigate on Autopilot for example?

personally, the only FSD feature I am currently using is auto lane change. The rest of it is too dicey (Summon and Autopark) and Navigate on a AP isn’t generally needed for my commute. So, if I was buying today, I probably wouldn’t pay the extra as 95% of my AP use is just basic AP.


If you skip FSD, you get traffic aware cruise control, and lane centering (Autosteer). To change lanes, you will need to disengage AP. You will not get auto park, Summon (dumb or smart), auto lane change, or navigate on Autopilot.

Personally I’m finding NoA to be patently problematic and erratic on my most regularly traveled roads. The car seems to hold lane better in “dumb” AP with less ping pong. It also wants to get over either way too late or way too early to make its exit. Don’t even get me started on the phantom braking and speed limit reset events..

Auto lane change is great and in most cases usable.

Summon is a fun party trick.

I don’t trust self park.


All of these issues led me to opt out of FSD on our LYD order.
 
I can't believe I'm taking the time to do this, but yes you want it. The main issue right now is NOA, self-driving on freeways. I've been using it for a year. I can say "navigate to XYZ" and as soon as I'm onto the freeway on-ramp it drives, makes lane changes, gets on the next freeway(s), all the way to the final exit - I supervise. Sometimes I kick it to manual for a specific situation, say a very sharp curve cloverleaf, unexpected stuff, maybe 5% of the itinerary, but tap right back into NOA. No question, 95% of my freeway/highway driving is automated.

It takes some time to get comfortable with it, it's a very different way to operate. A few hours with it isn't enough. Initially most people are either over-nervous, and they focus on the negatives, then come around and say it's wonky. No it isn't. Or they're dumb and happy and expect it to do everything like a chauffeur, until (doh!) they realize they DO have to supervise, and then they come back and say it's scary. No it isn't. I'm so tired of all the short traders and others who keep putting it down. It's hard to believe they've actually used any of the recent versions and WANTED to. There are imperfections, so what, it's like any tech that we use all the time.

My personal nightmare is this maze at the East end of the SF Bay Bridge. You get crazy drivers changing their minds and coming at you in your every blind spot as your head spins trying to change lanes to get on the right freeway. I just let the car do it now, I almost close my eyes. I got the dashcam front camera video of the process, working its way around cars cutting in. I need to take the time to post it at 3x playback, it's pretty amazing.

Screen Shot 2020-01-02 at 01.29.07.png


I've never had a "phantom braking" over the last year, I've had a couple of slowdowns, but some people report their car has reacted to obstacles that aren't there. Well, if my car did that, I'd be ready and override it. You get to know it over time, when it's best to disengage, for how long, how to ride WITH it. It took me like 3 months to really flow with it, I was skittish at first, and it wasn't as advanced a year ago. Now I ride it like it's part of me, and I wouldn't give it up for anything. All those freeway miles? It's almost like riding the train, for me that's easily worth 1/3 of the car price.

Off the freeway? I love requesting a lane change and letting the car choose the right moment. Now, for someone who doesn't have to deal with any multi-lane freeways and highways, say living in the countryside, NOA isn't relevant, the simple AP is perfectly adequate, you can do your infrequent lane changes in manual.

Summon in parking lots is a feature I seldom use. When I do it's funny, the car is very cautious. The other day some people kept loading stuff in their SUV, and every time they'd walk around their car, my car would stop again and wait. After a while they noticed there was nobody behind the wheel, they stopped moving to stare, so the Tesla resumed coming to me. Self-parking comes in handy, I'm not great at parallel parking.

As to street level, simple AP mode is fine, stop and go, it covers a lot of nuisance driving. But in NOA on the freeway in rush hour it does everything including changing lanes, taking the right exit. There won't likely ever be a "today = complete divine FSD". It will gradually take on more street level self-navigation.

If you can afford it, it's a no brainer, why get half a Tesla? Putting it off will require a cash outlay to get it later, and that always comes at the worst moment. Just finance it and know you've got it covered, you've got the best computerized car in the world.
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You don't buy FSD for today, you buy it for tomorrow.

I thought it was worth it.

I hope it works out for you and other people in your same position. I have never been one to buy vaporware. If it worked well enough for me to take a nap on the way the work, I *might* be willing to spend $7k on such a system. If I have to sit there and diligently babysit it, no way I would spend that kind of money but that is just my opinion.
 
I am always amazed at the amount of people that say that what basically amounts to automatic lane changes is worth $7,000. Sure there are other features you get with "FSD" but generally speaking, they don't work very great and are useful under limited circumstances. I have asked several people on Reddit if they thought it was worth that much money for lane changes and almost all of them said yes and they would do it again. Like holy cow people, it isn't hard to change lanes and it takes like 2 seconds.
I'm with you on this one. We had our Model Y locked in with FSD for $6K. I'm a HUGE tech nerd and love all this, but I just couldn't justify spending that for automatic lane changes and NOA so we dropped it and picked up the Performance for that extra cash.

Yes, I know that "new features" will be coming out soon, and I will make that decision then. For now, its really nothing fancy that the car is doing besides checking the radar and initiating a lane change or exit.
 
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"Full self driving" is a misnomer and is actually just a bunch of features thrown on top of standard autopilot at this point. Summon and self park are party tricks if you ask me. Basically you have to ask yourself if you want to buy into or support the idea of one day having a real autonomous car and hope it becomes reality before you sell or trade in the car, because it's not transferable to your next tesla.
 
Just a quick minor note, as per the Q1 2020 earnings call, autopilot users will get a discount on their tesla insurance. Also note that depending on the state your tax on the $7k will be at a lower rate when you include fsd to your build. And they are working on extending tesla insurance to other states as well.
 
Don’t get me wrong. I’d totally get EAP if offered today for $5K over basic AP $2-3K but $7K on top for FSD when I’m already paying full boat for the current feature set is just a bridge too far.

To say one gets it for the future and not for today is fine and dandy if you want to throw Tesla an interest free loan but if you work for your money then hopefully you value it more than that.
 
Don’t get me wrong. I’d totally get EAP if offered today for $5K over basic AP $2-3K but $7K on top for FSD when I’m already paying full boat for the current feature set is just a bridge too far.

To say one gets it for the future and not for today is fine and dandy if you want to throw Tesla an interest free loan but if you work for your money then hopefully you value it more than that.

I did ordered (and waiting) FSD knowing fully well that Tesla's high margin sales comes from FSD orders. The thought of dropping $7k+tax or whatever its going to be for FSD in the future on a credit card is not something I can afford, its like a paycheck. Now it gets rolled into my auto loan and I wont hurt paying for it, also in the coming months FSD will improve to a point that the issues and annoyances that people are experiencing now will be fully addressed.