High Power Home Charging Package worth it?

[jerry33]

The HPWC won't help you on the road. The twin chargers might, but not for long.

This is the only one I can't agree with. Even when the dots on the map are all red, there will be plenty of places that will not be covered. To take my personal example:

I often drive 377 to 177 to 77 for about 650 miles. No SCs planned ever along that route. So when they eventually get built (not before 2016 as the map is optimistic by at least six months) I will have the choice of:

1. Driving on the Interstate and going many miles out of my way (not to mention the crummy Interstate experience).

2. Driving my normal route, then going out of the way to the Supercharger and then back to the route. I'd probably still have to get at least one non-SC charge. This will likely add more distance to the trip than the Interstate route but at least I would be spared driving on the Interstate (mostly anyway).

 

[Puyallup Bill]

For what it is worth, I emailed Tesla telling them the bundle was a really poor idea. Maybe if they hear it from enough folks, they will back off. Damn, getting just like the old car companies - you want this option? Then you have to also take this one.

Received the following in response to my email:

Hi William,

I received your note this morning regarding our new option to bundle the High Power Wall Connector and Twin Charger feature.

We made this decision in clarify for customers the benefit Twin Charger feature offers, and what it requires. Fortunately, under the circumstance that a customer cannot install the Wall Connector, we will accept a return of the device. This is the only work around we have currently, but I’ll investigate if we can add the Twin Charger into the configuration manually, without addition of the Wall Connector.

Thanks for sending us the suggestion. If you have any other questions, feel free to contact me.

 

[evmile]

"What matters is how many miles you drive, not how big the battery is."

The bigger the battery the larger the difference between the 10 kW and 20 kW HPWC. For example to charge the 100 kWh battery it would take ten hours with the 10 kW charger and five hours with the 20 kW HPWC. For Time of Use power rates the 10 hours would exceed the 7 or 8 hour window as well


"For living in CA like you do, there are far more numerous and more convenient J1772s for trips than boring, inconvenient RV parks. Unless I'm traveling to a friend's house and intend to use their dryer connection, I don't take the UMC with me ever."

I don't feel secure driving without my UMC in the car in case something happens and I need to find a charge somewhere.


"You can't charge your Leaf with the HPWC."

The point is if have invested in providing for the infrastructure for first EV the second EV is easier to support if you planned ahead.


"The HPWC won't help you on the road. The twin chargers might, but not for long."

Do you think people will remove 70 Amp J1772 EVSEs and replace them with 30 Amp J1772s?


"Again, the HPWC won't help there. The twin chargers might, assuming you're on the road and need to charge up and the Tesla stores/service centers are open."

You can also use "Plugshare" to find other Tesla owners with a HPWC that they are willing to share.

 

[jerry33]

You can also use "Plugshare" to find other Tesla owners with a HPWC that they are willing to share.

That would be cool except that there aren't any along (or even within a reasonable distance) of my normal route.

 

[AmpedRealtor]

You can also use "Plugshare" to find other Tesla owners with a HPWC that they are willing to share.

Yes!

I just added my home in Buckeye, AZ as a residential HPWC location on PlugShare.com. I want to help out fellow Model S owners as much as possible! I am 125 miles east of Blythe along the I-10 and can provide you with an 80A charge. Blythe itself has only 110v hotel outlets and an RV campsite where you can charge at 40A as far as I can tell.

 

[sp4rk]

Whoever bought the HPWC on Ebay sure got a good deal at $750!

Where'd you see that? I checked completed listings.
Do we know for certain that you cannot buy the TC now without the HPWC. To me they're mutually exclusive.

 

[jerry33]

Do we know for certain that you cannot buy the TC now without the HPWC. To me they're mutually exclusive.

Yes. We know that for certain. However, Tesla has sent an email (posted on another thread) saying that you can return the unwanted HPWC. Of course, you won't get sales tax back.

 

[brianman]

I don't think I've mentioned it before, but one of the reasons I wanted the HPWC with the vehicle because (originally) I wanted the Sig Red faceplate. They killed that dream long ago. Unless I steal it from the Fremont Service Center that is.

They still have it painted on the walls in the Bellevue store, in a pamphlet about HPWC use, and on the web site, and.... /sadface

 

[pilotSteve]

Received the following in response to my email:

Hi William,

I received your note this morning regarding our new option to bundle the High Power Wall Connector and Twin Charger feature.

We made this decision in clarify for customers the benefit Twin Charger feature offers, and what it requires. Fortunately, under the circumstance that a customer cannot install the Wall Connector, we will accept a return of the device. This is the only work around we have currently, but I’ll investigate if we can add the Twin Charger into the configuration manually, without addition of the Wall Connector.

Thanks for sending us the suggestion. If you have any other questions, feel free to contact me.

Interesting, this is how I understood the bundling of HPWC and TC when I went to the new web site to check the pricing this morning. It made sense to me as posters here continue to be confused about TC/HPWC/SC setup and what is needed/useful under various scenarios.

I'm probably warped because I bought twin chargers and hpwc from day one.... and love the 55MPH (80A) charging that they offer.

My favorite quote from a previous poster: "80A charging is *not* fast charging.... SuperCharging is". I agree in that I have no range anxiety with my home HPWC knowing that I can (a) always charge in 5 hours or less and (b) can normally charge to 200 miles range, then have a trip pop-up and complete a full range charge in under 1 hours 30 minutes.

 

[100thMonkey]

I'm still a relative noob to EV's but I have owned one for 2.5 years and now, with the S own two. I have a few thoughts for you:

1. twin charging, even super charging is still slow compared to filling up on gas. in 2.5 years with the Leaf and even with the Tesla S, I'm willing to pay a premium to avoid any time sitting around waiting for the car to charge, this gets old, especially with a family of 4. IMHO, definitely get the twin chargers!

2. I wouldn't bother with the HPWC, it's sexy but so far it doesn't strike me as the most robust nor versatile. bottom line, when it comes to charging, reliability is the sexiest thing around! I'd highly recommend, as stated by another gentleman, the Clipper Creek CS100. an earlier version, the CS90 has been used for the Roadster Tesla highway along the west coast and all across Canada along the Sun Country highway... they are super sexy robust and reliable!

3. for those going solar, have all future additional loads accounted for when you redo your electrical panel, this is the easiest and most economical time to add to your service. we did and it made the addition of the high powered circuit relatively inexpensive!

4. highly, highly recommend assuring tripple redundancy! we have a 14/50 coming off the 125A sub panel for the Clipper creek, that way, if/when the clipper creek is down, I can plug the UMC into it and still get decent speed charging. a third option is good since, you may not know it now, but you will likely want to get rid of your other gas car shortly and want another EV and the option to plug them both in at the same time... a dedicated 20A standard outlet is even a bonus. to take it easy on the battery, I leave mine at around 50% most time and charge off of the 40A 14/50. the clipper creek is at the end of the driveway and will usually charge the Leaf. having access to faster charging helps me bring the Tesla up from 50% easily on the off chance I need more of a charge than usual quickly.

5. consider being apart of plugshare/recargo. having a 14/50 helps increase your ability to be of service to someone in a pinch, a clipper creek CS 100 is even better, allowing most EV's to charge since it's a J1772, it's the highest powered J1772 on the market. so far, I've seen charging rates of 60 mph, which seems higher than most are reporting with the HPWC. if you have some roadsters in your area and little additional infrastructure for them to rely on, consider going with a CS 90 so they can use it too... for some reason the Tesla Roadster is the only EV that can not charge on a charger that allows up to 70+ A charging rate. In any case, while I love Tesla, I very much appreciate being able to contribute to the larger EV community through plug share with a high powered J1772.

 

[AmpedRealtor]

You are saying not to bother with the HPWC which costs $1,200 and charges at 80A, yet recommend the Clipper Creek CS100 which costs $2,195 and charges at 75A?

 

[Crispix]

He's saying that because of #5 above: Clipper Creek charges more than just Teslas.

 

[Lloyd]

Where'd you see that? I checked completed listings.
Do we know for certain that you cannot buy the TC now without the HPWC. To me they're mutually exclusive.

TEG said it finally went for $866 I believe plus $100 shipping.

 

[DRK]

Just keep in mind the CS-100 wont charge the Roadsters.

 

[evme]

There is also the EMW JuiceBox that is 62A and goes for $139 for the DIY option, $249 for the premium DIY option and $359 for the assembled option. And it does 60A @240V with [FONT=Arial, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif]J1772(15kw). I think this is the cheapest option there is at the moment.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif]Though I really hope Tesla reconsiders the bundling. The advantage to not having it bundled is we can get the twin charger option but if we at some point feel we need more to upgrade at any time. Unfortunately from what I understand,it is impossible to upgrade the car itself once it is shipped.[/FONT]

 

[Banahogg]

Though I really hope Tesla reconsiders the bundling. The advantage to not having it bundled is we can get the twin charger option but if we at some point feel we need more to upgrade at any time. Unfortunately from what I understand,it is impossible to upgrade the car itself once it is shipped.

Not true - it just costs over twice as much as the old twin charger cost: Shop Tesla Gear Twin Charger with Installation

I agree that it would be nice to have an option for just the on-board charger with the order, but I can kind of see why they're doing it - I've seen tech-savvy people get confused by their explanations of number of chargers on the car, UMC vs HPWC, and supercharging (I can usually correct them if I have a whiteboard handy)

 

[evme]

Not true - it just costs over twice as much as the old twin charger cost: Shop Tesla Gear Twin Charger with Installation

I could have sworn I read somewhere that it was not do-able, thanks for the correction.

I agree that it would be nice to have an option for just the on-board charger with the order, but I can kind of see why they're doing it - I've seen tech-savvy people get confused by their explanations of number of chargers on the car, UMC vs HPWC, and supercharging (I can usually correct them if I have a whiteboard handy)

Yeah I get it, but I think they can get around it with a simple popup warning explaining that your not going to be able to take advantage of the charger without the twin charger. Or maybe some code we can type in to remove it for people who know what they are doing.

 

[smorgasbord]

"What matters is how many miles you drive, not how big the battery is."

The bigger the battery the larger the difference between the 10 kW and 20 kW HPWC. For example to charge the 100 kWh battery it would take ten hours with the 10 kW charger and five hours with the 20 kW HPWC. For Time of Use power rates the 10 hours would exceed the 7 or 8 hour window as well

You're missing the point. If you drive 50 miles a day, then the single charger will give you a full charge in less than 2 hours no matter big your battery is.

"For living in CA like you do, there are far more numerous and more convenient J1772s for trips than boring, inconvenient RV parks. Unless I'm traveling to a friend's house and intend to use their dryer connection, I don't take the UMC with me ever."

I don't feel secure driving without my UMC in the car in case something happens and I need to find a charge somewhere.

You're probably pretty new at this. You'll quickly find that J1772s in CA are far easier to find and use than 14-50 outlets.

"The HPWC won't help you on the road. The twin chargers might, but not for long."

Do you think people will remove 70 Amp J1772 EVSEs and replace them with 30 Amp J1772s?

The HPWC is installed in your house. It doesn't help you on the road. You do understand the difference between the twin chargers and the HPWC, right?

- - - Updated - - -

Even when the dots on the map are all red, there will be plenty of places that will not be covered.

Does your route have high-power Level 2 chargers?

If not, do you know of plans to have them installed?

If you're expecting people to make their HPWC's available and this is a frequent route for you, do you think that's really viable?

 

[Denarius]

HPWC and twin chargers saved my bacon the other day. I didn't insert my HPWC fully, so when my scheduled charging started the car only charged at 16 amps. Fortunately I checked my car in the morning and was able to reinsert and crank it up to 80amps. I had enough range by the time I needed to leave.

I've also had instances where I went to work, using about 80 miles of range. Upon getting home I needed to replace the miles for a trip with the family that evening. Being able to leave that much quicker was helpful.

I think they are worth it, but I have an unpredictable schedule and don't want charge anxiety. If I had a 30 mile commute that never changed I may have opted for the single charger and no HPWC.

 

[100thMonkey]

the CS 100 is now full 80A capable. being able to charge both the Leaf and the S as well as have it on plugshare is of high value to me... and it's also future proofed as other EV's come out with faster on board chargers.

You are saying not to bother with the HPWC which costs $1,200 and charges at 80A, yet recommend the Clipper Creek CS100 which costs $2,195 and charges at 75A?

one more general comment, for anyone considering how valuable high speed charging would be, I believe it's important to look beyond how often you travel beyond X number of miles in a given day. I find that averages don't tell the story very well. I've found it's the occasional, really inconvenient situation due to slow charging that weighs heavily in the equation.