I don't think it's the car companies that are the problem. They can hire the best and most creative in the industry. Their biggest problem the dealership model. Dealers make money off of service. EV's have very little routine service. Why would they want to sell an EV? Their second biggest problem is new models every 3-5 years that add desirable "features". Tesla just adds (and subtracts unfortunately) features via software. It's like selling an iPhone. All Apple really does is change the shape of the phone and the speed of the processor (yes, cameras change but do they really need to so often?). The software can be upgraded for new features constantly until the phone gets too slow. Tesla resale acts more like an iPhone than a car. Manufacturers and dealers need to completely rethink how they sell cars, price cars, service cars, incentivize salespeople (are they even needed for everyone?), etc. When they sell both ICE and EV, they may have to have a hybrid model where the strategies are different. That's both confusing and undesirable to the owners in a legacy industry. Why shouldn't car buying be more like other retail industries? I walk into the Gap to buy a shirt and may or may not need help. Should I be required to "use" someone's help if I already know what I want or just want to browse (which can be and is done online). So much change needs to happen before legacy automakers can compete, for reasons other than the cars themselves. Full disclosure, I don't currently own any EV but have owned a Model 3 in the past and think the driving aspect is unmatched. I also appreciate what a good dealership can do if something goes wrong with your car. It's their local reputation so they should go to bat for you. I think a sales model in between Tesla and legacy could work.
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Mach-E and my Y. Side by Side pics
- Thread starter runningdenver
- Start date
I personally admire Ford's push into BEV territory - they are certainly taking this sea change in the automotive sector very seriously and are betting the bank on their transition into BEVs over the next several years and are one of the leaders in so far as legacy automotive companies are concerned. I like the look of the Mach-E personally, we actually considered the Mach-E briefly given my wife and I both like the look and feel of the vehicle, but at the end of the day it's not as efficient as the MY, and the Mach-E was really Ford's first foray into mass production BEV territory, so it's effectively their version of the Tesla MS back in 2012. Granted, it's much less expensive - and Ford is losing money on every BEV they are selling right now - but I for one wouldn't want to buy version one of anything when it comes to BEVs. While the MY is only a few years old itself - it built on a decades worth of experience that Tesla has accumulated before coming to market. It's the BMS/battery chemistry that matters the most with these vehicles - especially over the long term - and that's not something Ford has much experience with. The recent battery fires with the F150 Lightnings are essentially proof of their relative inexperience with mass production BEVs, at least in my assessment. That said, to each his own of course. 
Woah woah woah! I know you're kidding but I never said it was better than the keypad! I actually liked the keypad - I didn't need my phone if the car was locked, it was a backup if PAAK failed, and you could use it to open the frunk or lock the car.
Ford's PAAK is just unpolished. I always had to open the app first, then I'd still have to wait outside the door for 2-3 seconds before it connected to my phone (3-5 if I didn't open the app). Every now and then, it also wouldn't let you start the car even though it let you open the doors and android auto connects properly. It doesn't seem like much but it wears on you, especially 100% of the time, rain or snow. Tesla's PAAK just works like it should.
Brian-MS90D
Member
"Woah woah woah! I know you're kidding but I never said it was better than the keypad! I actually liked the keypad "
Ah, there we go. All is right with the world now
"Woah woah woah! I know you're kidding but I never said it was better than the keypad! I actually liked the keypad "
Ah, there we go. All is right with the world now
Apparently I'm too new to like your post... So I'll just add that I'm not a MME fan boy or a Tesla fan boy, I'm an EV fan boy. If they were the same price and I didn't have any kids, I probably would have kept the MME.See the links below for why you should not buy a Ford Mach-E.
insideevs.com
insideevs.com
insideevs.com
Mustang Mach-E Battery Charges Slowly, Overheats Quickly: Why?
Through extensive research and modeling, we dive into the Mach-E's battery issues. We also compare it to the Tesla Model Y and Volkswagen ID.4.
insideevs.com
Mustang Mach-E Fails Moose Test: Tesla Model Y & Ioniq 5 Ace It
The Mustang is known for its athletic handling, but the Mach-E's ESC seems to hinder it in this moose test. The Model Y and Ioniq 5 behave much differently.
insideevs.com
Watch How Ford Mustang Mach-E GT Suffers From Power Limitations
The Ford Mustang Mach-E GT is the top version of the Mach-E, envisioned for performance driving. However, it notes some noticeable power limitations.
insideevs.com
laservet
Member
The WannaBeMustang look and skinny tires doesn’t do it for me, I think the MME is not attractive. The Y is OK, simple design, not ugly IMO. The problem I think I have with how the MME looks, both outside and inside, is that it doesn’t know what it wants to be, a modern EV or a classic car. So it tries to do both and it doesn’t work for me, seems like a modern steampunk design. The Y knows what it is and looks and acts like it.
The main reason I would choose a Y over an MME again is with the Y I’m getting the state of the art, cutting edge EV. While a new Y looks like my 2020 on the outside with Tesla’s constant changes it is an entirely new animal under the skin. The MME is yesterday’s technology. Poor BMS resulting in it throttling back after 5 sec full throttle to prevent heat problems and same with charging speed (even in the Shelby GT cladding offered in Europe). Rudimentary high voltage electrical system, cooling system. It works, but isn’t a polished design. Its design and engineering aren’t refined. Farley just said their EVs weren’t good enough, they need a new platform. And they had a horrible Q1 on the EV side, that prompted his comments.
I hope Ford sells a bunch of them. The more the merrier. Ford was planning on making EVs on VWs new Trinity platform but after Deiss was booted his replacement Blume delayed both the platform and the new factory from 2025 to late in the decade. I think the next two EV models out for both Ford and GM will go a long way in determining their future.
WRT GM’s dropping Apple Car Play, I read they were dropping Android Auto, too, and are going with a Google automotive system like Volvo’s. IIRC, Google owns the content on the screen in the Volvo/Polestar system.
The main reason I would choose a Y over an MME again is with the Y I’m getting the state of the art, cutting edge EV. While a new Y looks like my 2020 on the outside with Tesla’s constant changes it is an entirely new animal under the skin. The MME is yesterday’s technology. Poor BMS resulting in it throttling back after 5 sec full throttle to prevent heat problems and same with charging speed (even in the Shelby GT cladding offered in Europe). Rudimentary high voltage electrical system, cooling system. It works, but isn’t a polished design. Its design and engineering aren’t refined. Farley just said their EVs weren’t good enough, they need a new platform. And they had a horrible Q1 on the EV side, that prompted his comments.
I hope Ford sells a bunch of them. The more the merrier. Ford was planning on making EVs on VWs new Trinity platform but after Deiss was booted his replacement Blume delayed both the platform and the new factory from 2025 to late in the decade. I think the next two EV models out for both Ford and GM will go a long way in determining their future.
WRT GM’s dropping Apple Car Play, I read they were dropping Android Auto, too, and are going with a Google automotive system like Volvo’s. IIRC, Google owns the content on the screen in the Volvo/Polestar system.
Ford had better come up with something like the GM Ultium platform or the board of directors are going to have to chuck Farley.
My friend has a lightening. I told him before he ordered that Ford has a terrible track record on new model launches. Ie new bronco, gt etc etc etc. His lightening giving him massive problems on the tech side. Ie charging, a module not working correctly etc. The dealers are clueless and when he calls they have to call the cia people at ford to discuss the issues. Given today earnings and ev losses i would say they have a ton of catching up to do into a credit crunch and likely recession. So be happy you went with lead dog now…
I'm not sure if you are serious? Ultium hasn't exactly been super successful so far.
I m sure the .gov will give them a tax credit or some accounting loophole which cost Ford nothing
That's true I think they get 5B or something
Sadly I don't think the dealerships are always in the ideal places for road tripping but I suppose more DCFCs couldn't hurt
TomB985
Member
I’ve never understood the haters.
The MachE has won several competitive comparisons against the Model Y, and lots of happy owners are enjoying them. It’s pretty obvious that members here prefer the Model Y, and I’m no exception to that. I’m a value buyer who’s after the best value for a car that meets certain criteria, and the Model Y easily accomplishes that. That was true for me when I bought before this latest round of price cuts, and I couldn’t imagine buying the MachE the way things are currently priced.
But what’s wrong with those who do? More EVs on the roads will make things better for all of us. Cleaner air, more support for charging infrastructure, and greater competition to push Tesla and others to keep improving. I want Ford, GM, VW, and the rest to succeed because it’s a win for all of us. Even though most of us would keep buying Teslas.
The MachE has won several competitive comparisons against the Model Y, and lots of happy owners are enjoying them. It’s pretty obvious that members here prefer the Model Y, and I’m no exception to that. I’m a value buyer who’s after the best value for a car that meets certain criteria, and the Model Y easily accomplishes that. That was true for me when I bought before this latest round of price cuts, and I couldn’t imagine buying the MachE the way things are currently priced.
But what’s wrong with those who do? More EVs on the roads will make things better for all of us. Cleaner air, more support for charging infrastructure, and greater competition to push Tesla and others to keep improving. I want Ford, GM, VW, and the rest to succeed because it’s a win for all of us. Even though most of us would keep buying Teslas.
laservet
Member
GM isn't very excited about the Ultium platform, either, they are cancelling the build of an Ultium factory in favor of new cylindrical batteries.
Ultium hasn't served them well so far, a friend purchased a Hummer EV (of which they made exactly TWO in the first quarter of this year) but can't pick it up because there is a full stop sale order due to leaks in the Ultium battery allowing air and water intrusion. And in China, where they use a different battery, GM produced ~2400 Lyriqs in 2022 but in the US using Ultium only about 200 for the entire year. The only GM EV that sells in any quantity at all is the Bolt which doesn't use Ultium and is being discontinued by GM.
Unless I am reading the wrong thread who are the haters? Some have outlined specific things they prefer for certain reasons which are fair from both sides and up to the consumer. Shopping or deciding primarily based on “value” or price in my view is the foolish view. What is more important a cheaper car or a Better car? I personally prefer a better car and network offering over saving a few bucks. You will celebrate your minor savings on day one but Always remember the cost of that savings for many years owning that product.
I agree. The Mach E is actually a really nice vehicle. Its not the one that I'd choose, but having more people asking for chargers doesn't hurt us at all. Having more demographics fighting against stupid punitive EV fees won't hurt us either.
I'm happy to see Mach E owners asking hotels and other establishments to install and maintain L2 units. They make all of our lives easier.
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