Model 3 Highland Performance/Plaid Speculation [Car announced 04.23.2024]

[P-Lo801]

I can say without a doubt tire compound matters the most for efficiency below 70 mph. I have done extensive testing on this with different size diameter and width wheels/tires. Changing dimensions does make a difference. However, switching to the Hankook iON EVO AS tires alone made the biggest difference.

I have tested a RWD with 18" Aeros on my 25 mile test loop and it did 191 wh/mi. However, I was able to do 194 wh/mi with my 2022 Model 3 Performance on the same loop with the same 59.9 mph GPS measured average speed with 235/35/20 Hankook iON EVO AS tires.

To be able to match RWD 18" Aero efficiency with 20" Aero wheels on a Model 3 Performance is game changing. With a new 82.1 kWh(79 kWh usable) battery I am looking at 400+ miles of range at 60 mph. Even at 70+ mph I could achieve about 340 miles of range. I even did 299 miles on non Aero 18" wheels and summer tires on my Model 3 Performance once.

Switching tires is critical for someone who lives in a colder snowy climate and needs to go on 330+ mile commutes and still wants some wheels and tires for the track a few times a month. The stock wheels and tires will be my track setup. The All season tires will be my long commute tires.

Thanks for sharing this. I like to blend a bit of both form and function. I'll likely never track my car, but I can expect to take it canyon carving occasionally, and overall want to maintain its oem driving dynamics feel. So while I know any mods in the wheels and tires can affect driving dynamics, i'm looking to maximize range while also having a more flush look in the rears without having to add spacers.

So i'm thinking i'll stick with the oem 20s, and eventually change it out to 19s. I personally think 19s provides the best benefits of range and form. So I have the Hankook ION EVO AS tires on my radar now. I also plan to lower mine ever so slight by another half inch. So i'm waiting for aftermarket options that will be compatible with the electronic dampers on this car.

 

[Izzyz28]

It comes down to efficiency and range vs grip. Sure, you can spend all day obsessing about wheels and wheel covers and tire sizes and compounds, but at the end of the day, do you want an energy efficient pooch on some 500-600 treadwear tires, or do you want a performance car with proper tires and all available grip? From reading the comments on here, it seems like some want every tenth of a second and hundredth of a G out of the car, but are willing to completely neuter it with shitty tires because they can't stand "losing" range. This is about as absurd as putting some 245 Ling-Longs on a Plaid.

 

[Lolo780]

It comes down to efficiency and range vs grip. Sure, you can spend all day obsessing about wheels and wheel covers and tire sizes and compounds, but at the end of the day, do you want an energy efficient pooch on some 500-600 treadwear tires, or do you want a performance car with proper tires and all available grip? From reading the comments on here, it seems like some want every tenth of a second and hundredth of a G out of the car, but are willing to completely neuter it with shitty tires because they can't stand "losing" range. This is about as absurd as putting some 245 Ling-Longs on a Plaid.

Are Ling-Longs better than Ding Dongs?

 

[mpgxsvcd]

It comes down to efficiency and range vs grip. Sure, you can spend all day obsessing about wheels and wheel covers and tire sizes and compounds, but at the end of the day, do you want an energy efficient pooch on some 500-600 treadwear tires, or do you want a performance car with proper tires and all available grip? From reading the comments on here, it seems like some want every tenth of a second and hundredth of a G out of the car, but are willing to completely neuter it with shitty tires because they can't stand "losing" range. This is about as absurd as putting some 245 Ling-Longs on a Plaid.

There is a time and a place for performance and a time and place for efficiency. I love that this car can do both just not simultaneously.

There is no need to just piss away efficiency if all I want to do is cruise down the highway. Also, there is no need to cripple performance at the Track to save a couple of watt hours on the way up and back.

You don’t have to make sacrifices at all if you simply optimize the car for the current situation. Nothing requires the car to be a static configuration. All of the fun is in tinkering with it to be optimal for whatever I desire at that particular moment.

 

[Lolo780]

There is a time and a place for performance and a time and place for efficiency. I love that this car can do both just not simultaneously.

There is no need to just piss away efficiency if all I want to do is cruise down the highway. Also, there is no need to cripple performance at the Track to save a couple of watt hours on the way up and back.

You don’t have to make sacrifices at all if you simply optimize the car for the current situation. Nothing requires the car to be a static configuration. All of the fun is in tinkering with it to be optimal for whatever I desire at that particular moment.

Do you think the 3P would gain much from a front runner drag setup?

 

[White_Walker]

	Old P3D	2024 P3D	2021 MSLR
0-60 (no rollout)	3.28	2.99
1/8 mi	7.34	7.06
1000ft	9.57	9.2
1/4 mi	[email protected]	11.03
60-130		9.74
0-130		12.73

This is the best of my 3 runs stock. 2023 M3P. I think this is more representative of the "masses" and not simply the best run ever by the legacy version, in an effort to better compare apples to apples. I doubt 11.03 will be the best time.

This was 98% SOC with no battery conditioning because I didn't know about it at the time lol

Hoping to better this time on Friday.

 

[Nabush]

Please tell me you have photos of the oem 19s with no covers and the spacers and links. That is an identical setup to what I have but no links yet and have been wanting to see a photo!

Honestly looks super good. Mine is white with the tempest painted in gloss black. Looks mean, the stance looks really wide. Those pics were before my alignment update (more camber) and additional lowering in front.

 

[MODEL+]

Shoutout to the boys over at @UnpluggedP for taking delivery of two 2024 Model 3 Performance's and getting them under the knife ASAP!

I can almost say with certainty, any wheel setups compatible with Gen.1 M3P will also be compatible with the new one (Gen.2). The hub/brake assembly appears to be the same. Unfortunately, the exposed hub lip is something that we will still have to deal with for Gen.2. However, by now we already offer plenty of solutions to address this.

The front suspension upright is different. My hopes is is this will allow more clearance than Gen.1 so we can have better compatibility with 10.5" and wider wheels for track/performance use. We can only confirm this once UP decides to share this data or whenever our own shop M3P gets delivered here in Portland.

There's shorter factory springs and longer shock travel for the rear. Hopefully this means the suspension will play nice with aftermarket lowering springs or height adjustable springs (H.A.S), since we will be dealing with adaptive suspension now. Likewise, I'd like to see one of suspension leaders make a P&P coilover kit that will seamlessly interact with the car's adaptive suspension programming.


Overall, very excited for more development and testing on these new cars. For anyone looking to do a square or staggered aftermarket wheel setup, feel free to message or email me directly. We have plenty of options in-stock. We're also going to be offering early Gen.2 M3P owners great deals on compatible parts here on TMC!


Thanks,
Danny - [email protected]

 

[cptnslo]

Shoutout to the boys over at @UnpluggedP for taking delivery of two 2024 Model 3 Performance's and getting them under the knife ASAP!

I can almost say with certainty, any wheel setups compatible with Gen.1 M3P will also be compatible with the new one (Gen.2). The hub/brake assembly appears to be the same. Unfortunately, the exposed hub lip is something that we will still have to deal with for Gen.2. However, by now we already offer plenty of solutions to address this.

The front suspension upright is different. My hopes is is this will allow more clearance than Gen.1 so we can have better compatibility with 10.5" and wider wheels for track/performance use. We can only confirm this once UP decides to share this data or whenever our own shop M3P gets delivered here in Portland.

There's shorter factory springs and longer shock travel for the rear. Hopefully this means the suspension will play nice with aftermarket lowering springs or height adjustable springs (H.A.S), since we will be dealing with adaptive suspension now. Likewise, I'd like to see one of suspension leaders make a P&P coilover kit that will seamlessly interact with the car's adaptive suspension programming.


Overall, very excited for more development and testing on these new cars. For anyone looking to do a square wheel setup, feel free to message or email me directly. We're going to be offering early Gen.2 M3P owners great deals on compatible parts here on TMC!


Thanks,
Danny - [email protected]

Haha I beat you too it earlier

 

[cptnslo]

Honestly looks super good. Mine is white with the tempest painted in gloss black. Looks mean, the stance looks really wide. Those pics were before my alignment update (more camber) and additional lowering in front.

Dam that looks which links did you run?

 

[MODEL+]

Haha I beat you too it earlier

Sorry.. I can never keep up with the pace of this thread!!

 

[Lolo780]

Shoutout to the boys over at @UnpluggedP for taking delivery of two 2024 Model 3 Performance's and getting them under the knife ASAP!

I can almost say with certainty, any wheel setups compatible with Gen.1 M3P will also be compatible with the new one (Gen.2). The hub/brake assembly appears to be the same. Unfortunately, the exposed hub lip is something that we will still have to deal with for Gen.2. However, by now we already offer plenty of solutions to address this.

The front suspension upright is different. My hopes is is this will allow more clearance than Gen.1 so we can have better compatibility with 10.5" and wider wheels for track/performance use. We can only confirm this once UP decides to share this data or whenever our own shop M3P gets delivered here in Portland.

There's shorter factory springs and longer shock travel for the rear. Hopefully this means the suspension will play nice with aftermarket lowering springs or height adjustable springs (H.A.S), since we will be dealing with adaptive suspension now. Likewise, I'd like to see one of suspension leaders make a P&P coilover kit that will seamlessly interact with the car's adaptive suspension programming.


Overall, very excited for more development and testing on these new cars. For anyone looking to do a square or staggered aftermarket wheel setup, feel free to message or email me directly. We have plenty of options in-stock. We're also going to be offering early Gen.2 M3P owners great deals on compatible parts here on TMC!


Thanks,
Danny - [email protected]

The rear toe links might be a nice upgrade for earlier cars if Teslas price is reasonable.

 

[EV-lutioin]

I personally think he oversold how “terrible” the long range is. The long range price is indeed too high, but it’s not a terrible car or something not worth buying. He also just assumes everyone qualifies for the tax credit and that the tax credit will be around forever. Plus he talked a lot about swapping parts and rims and this and that for the P to make it a LR basically, but 99% of buyers don’t do things like that. A staggered 20” summer tire setup is a big turnoff for a lot of “regular” people who just want a solid daily driver. The LR fits that bill for most people. I also tend to dislike when videos just seem to be hype videos and nothing else (like this one).

RWD = LFP
LR = NMC
P = NCA

Thanks for the reply, I'm still not sure I understand why NMC is worse than LF and NCA. I have a 2018 Model 3 which I think uses the Nevada-made NCA 18650 or are they 2170? We also have a 2023 Model X which I think uses the 18650 NCA from Panasonic (China). How would the NMC's compare to those? I don't want to go back on charging times, since that is the most important metric for long-distance trips.

 

[EV-lutioin]

Ok, yeah he really doesn't know the most up to date Tesla battery configurations.

M3 SR (Standard Range RWD) - Uses LFP made by CATL in China. LFP have lower power density so that's why they are used in the SR. For a given battery size, they can hold less energy (to simplify). Slow charge and discharge rates. The advantage to LFPs are that they can be charged to 100% very often and should be charged to 100% at least once a week. Potentially slower degradation.

M3 LR (Long Range AWD) - Uses NMC (Nickel Manganese Cobalt) made by LG Chem in Korea. These batteries have a slower charge and discharge rate compared to NCA. That is why the performance Model 3 don't use these. Very similar to the NCA however in advantages and drawbacks.

M3 Performance AWD - Uses NCA (Nickel Cobalt Aluminum) made by Tesla/Panasonic in the USA. Higher charge and discharge rate, higher energy density, potentially higher battery degradation compared to LFP. Should only be charged to 100% when needed and shouldn't be kept at 100% charge for extended amount of time.

Thanks, that's a great breakdown! I think all my Teslas have had NCA (2018 M3, 2023 MX), so that is the charge rate I am accustomed to. I definitely don't want to go backwards in charge rate.

 

[mpgxsvcd]

Do you think the 3P would gain much from a front runner drag setup?

View attachment 1051726

No, those 235s are pretty efficient upfront and it is AWD so front traction would be abysmal. Cool setup though. What vehicle is that?

 

[Lolo780]

No, those 235s are pretty efficient upfront and it is AWD so front traction would be abysmal. Cool setup though. What vehicle is that?

N54 BMW running mid 9s.

 

[Nabush]

Dam that looks which links did you run?

N2Tive .. Super expensive for what it is though

 

[ZeroExhaustBoi]

Thanks for sharing this. I like to blend a bit of both form and function. I'll likely never track my car, but I can expect to take it canyon carving occasionally, and overall want to maintain its oem driving dynamics feel. So while I know any mods in the wheels and tires can affect driving dynamics, i'm looking to maximize range while also having a more flush look in the rears without having to add spacers.

So i'm thinking i'll stick with the oem 20s, and eventually change it out to 19s. I personally think 19s provides the best benefits of range and form. So I have the Hankook ION EVO AS tires on my radar now. I also plan to lower mine ever so slight by another half inch. So i'm waiting for aftermarket options that will be compatible with the electronic dampers on this car.

Just to chime in, those new hankooks are more than just range. They offer the same if not better grip than standard off the shelf PS4 summers (not ps4s). It doesnt sacrifice the safety critical wet grip like some eco tires do. truly amazing tires.

 

[P-Lo801]

Just to chime in, those new hankooks are more than just range. They offer the same if not better grip than standard off the shelf PS4 summers (not ps4s). It doesnt sacrifice the safety critical wet grip like some eco tires do. truly amazing tires.

Are you referring to the ION EVO summer tires or the AS ones? I thought there were two versions.

 

[Knightshade]

Thanks for the reply, I'm still not sure I understand why NMC is worse than LF and NCA. I have a 2018 Model 3 which I think uses the Nevada-made NCA 18650 or are they 2170?

A 2018 Model 3 would be panasonic/nevada 2170s

We also have a 2023 Model X which I think uses the 18650 NCA from Panasonic (China).

18650, but from Japan, not China-- always have been and still are (which is why the X can get the $7500 tax credit if it's under 80k)


2170 and 18650 are physical form factor of cells.

NMC NCA, LFP, are battery chemistries, so they will all behave/charge/discharge/etc differently.