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Model 3 Highland Performance/Plaid Speculation [Car announced 04.23.2024]
- Thread starter Daniel L
- Start date
Model 3 LR was 4034 lbs before. Highland Model 3 LR is 4030 lbs.
I read that the Ioniq 5 N shouldn't weigh more with the new battery pack. Its supposedly a change in battery density vs. actual size. Good to see battery evolution at play here.
Hyundai Ioniq 5 N To Use "Next-Generation" Battery Tech
Hyundai Executive Technical Advisor Albert Biermann says the Ioniq 5 N has next-gen battery tech to minimize range loss compared to the standard AWD Ioniq 5.
www.motor1.com
If the M3P gets heavier then it becomes a 1 trick pony like the rest of the EVs in this performance category. If all you care about is daily driving and acceleration its fine, but if you actually like that the M3P handles well also then heavier is absolutely the wrong direction.
Still, 4800 lbs would be too much. I believe the normal Ioniq 5s are heavier than the equivalent EV6 cars. This Ioniq 5N is going to be a porker no matter what. Not BMW I4 M50 heavy but pretty darn close.I read that the Ioniq 5 N shouldn't weigh more with the new battery pack. Its supposedly a change in battery density vs. actual size. Good to see battery evolution at play here.
Hyundai Ioniq 5 N To Use "Next-Generation" Battery Tech
Hyundai Executive Technical Advisor Albert Biermann says the Ioniq 5 N has next-gen battery tech to minimize range loss compared to the standard AWD Ioniq 5.
The problem (as it were) is that for the vast majority of buyers of this type of vehicle, the above is all they actually care about. Car enthusiasts who actually care about vehicle weight and stuff are an extreme minority, and there certainly are not enough of them who are going to buy this car to make it worth focusing on things like reducing weight.... ESPECIALLY at the expense of things like additional range.
Most of the people in this thread that are wanting things like weight reduction would also likely be happy if that weight reduction came with the car being smaller, and / or less range (batteries are heavy).
Thats not what most of the buying public wants, though, and they are not charging enough of an uptick in price to make it a car thats just for the enthusiast(s).
"Most" people just care about usable speed, which is daily driving speed, and these cars have that in droves. The speed of these cars is accessible to just about everyone, just mash the pedal and go, no launch mode, etc etc.
I realize fully thats not what most of the people posting in this thread would want, but its a vocal minority, like I said.
As for speculation, Its my opinion the car will be roughly the same weight (within 100 lbs either way), marginally faster to 60 (like rated at 2.7 ish with rollout) and possibly some more cosmetic bits to slightly differentiate it from the regular LR model (minor things like the current performance has, different colored calipers etc).
The number of people who would buy a kia / hyundai at those price points simply for performance (even if its good / great) is quite small... see kia stinger.
2.7 0-60 mph actually would be a significant improvement especially if it does it with full weight and wider 20" wheels. It took a ton of work and weight reduction to get down to 2.83 with rollout subtracted. Honestly, I would consider 2.7 0-60 mph to be a significant upgrade. I know .1 or .2 seconds doesn't sound like much but in Drag racing at these speeds and times it is actually a lot.
.2 seconds on the short end would be about half a second or more in the 1/4 mile. That would be very significant to me.
To be fair, the Ioniq 5N is closer in size to a Model Y rather than M3P. I look at it as a MYP competitor with performance of M3P (possibly better for sustained track usage) . Yes, it's still heavier than a MYP, but it's not so much of a porker if you look at it that way
Its also way smaller. Model Y is noticeably bigger than the I5 and EV6. Its like a tweener between the Model 3 and Y.
The crazy thing is that the Ioniq 5N isn't significantly bigger than the Model 3 in most dimensions.
Rear Cargo space is the biggest difference between the Ioniq 5N(59.3 FT^3) and Model 3(38 FT^3). That is just because one is a hatchback and the other isn't.
The Model 3 is actually longer than the Ioniq 5, almost as wide, but it is much shorter. The Model 3 has more front and rear headroom. The Model 3 even has more front leg room. The Ioniq 5 has 4" more rear leg room so that is a difference. However, everything else is comparable.
The Model Y is far bigger in almost every dimension than both of these cars. The EV6 and Ioniq 5 aren't as big as people think they are.
I think the new M3P will be within 100 pounds of the current one. It might end up slightly lighter, but it's more likely to be slightly heavier. If it became more than about 200 pounds heavier, I will just keep my current M3P until something more in tune with my tastes comes along. I'd never buy any of the other EVs that could be considered competitive to the M3P, like the Hyudais or BMWs, because they're all too porky.
I'd be pretty happy if the new M3P could hold its power to 130 and weighed the same or a smidgen more; weighing less would be a nice bonus, but not necessary. Combine that with improved seats and suspension along with the other Highland upgrades we already know about, and I'd be looking to get one.
Ioniq 5 interior space
Model Y Interior space
I think you're pretty mistaken, Other than headroom because obviously the Model Y is taller...the ioniq 5 has more shoulder room, more hip room, and same front legroom (just 1" less rear legroom). So i'd call them more or less the same...
The model 3 is smaller in every dimension
what about storage space? I have an EV6 which is about the same size as an N and I've rented a Model Y a couple times spanning about a month of rental time. Model Y is much bigger and way more practical in terms of total space.
I agree about the passenger space though. Model Y and Ioniq 5 are about the same and much more alike than the Model 3 but the storage space is more similar to the Model 3. A true tweener.
30 vs 27 cubic feet, so the model Y is a bit bigger in that capacity. The Model 3 is way smaller at 20 cubic feet. So i'd still say it's MUCH closer to a Y than a 3.
That's not to harp on the model 3. The 3 is great if you want a small lightweight(relatively) pocket rocket. I think it drives so much better than the Y. I just don't think it's fair to compare the ioniq to the model 3. It's not apples to apples. i4 and model 3 are much closer size/capacity wise.
that 30 vs. 27 is misleading. You get a much much bigger underneath compartment in the Model Y and a frunk. No actual frunk in the I5.
Also, the I5 drives smoother than the Model Y but the handling isn't any better. I would say the Model Y actually drives sportier but ride quality isn't great (on the old cars anyway). Also, if you were to try and define the I5 and EV6, they are closer to the Model Y for sure as the Model 3 feels downright light compared to those porkers.
The answer to the question "Which car is bigger" is actually "It depends". It depends on which dimension you are measuring. Are you measuring front leg room? Then the Tesla Model 3 actually has the biggest front leg room of the Ioniq5, EV6, and even the Model Y. Only the Ioniq 6 has more front leg room. Are you talking about Front Head Room then the Model Y takes that category. Are you talking about cargo space? Then the Model Y has that by a HUGE margin.
It all depends on how you are using the car. If you drive yourself and the kids mostly then maybe you want more front seat room and just adequate back seat room. If you are driving Uber with it then perhaps you just want as much rear seat room as possible?
Here is a chart comparing the Tesla Model 3, Tesla Model Y, Kia EV6, Hyundai Ioniq 5, Hyundai Ioniq 6, and BMW i4 for pretty much all exterior and interior dimensions. It is sorted by front leg room first, then rear leg room, then Front Head Room, and finally Rear Head Room because that is what is important to me. I am 6'4" so I need front passenger space and I rarely put large passengers in the back seat. I have a 3 row SUV for that. Other people might have different priorities.
I think you (we) are a much smaller minority than even those of us here think. It's easy to be persuaded on an enthusiast website that this is how the average buyer thinks. I think the average buyer would trade some raw performance for some improved creature comforts. The other thing that I personally find interesting is that with so many Model 3s on the road, I wonder whether people will be turned off by a $60,000 model 3 performance (even with amazing performance stats) that looks like every other car on the road. In some parts of the country, Model 3s are literally everywhere. When I got my 2021 at least in Southwestern PA, Teslas were not yet super prevalent. The car still felt somewhat exclusive. Fast forward 3 years, and there's many times more Teslas on the road. Now, ask me to pay $60,000 for a performance variant that looks 90% the same as the guy driving the standard model? I don't know. At that price, I want something more exclusive perhaps. I wonder if at some point, people start turning away from Tesla (not just an M3P thing) because there are actually too many of them around. I think many people will be turned off by the fact that Model 3 has become the "everyman(woman)" car. It's one thing if it's a $30,000 vehicle designed to get me from point A to point B. But those looking for performance cars usually factor in exclusivity and rarity into the mix.
Also here in Utah, everybody thinks AWD is mandatory so when Tesla was not selling the Long Range AWD, everybody just got the Performance (side note: also running on summer tires and probably complaining that its terrible in the snow) reducing the exclusivity of the Performance even more.
Zcd1
Active Member
I spend a lot less time thinking about how my car looks than I do enjoying how it performs, and that performance remains stunning/fun/amazing/unique in its price and practicality range.
That said, simply adding a nice set of wheels has inspired many compliments even from people to see Model 3s every day.
That said, simply adding a nice set of wheels has inspired many compliments even from people to see Model 3s every day.
Yes, agreed. I lowered mine and added some rims and it certainly did not look like the average model 3. But the average buyer isn't going to do that. They want it to look that way from the start. Lowering in particular is not something most people want to mess with.
