Did you read the followup posts? It was really a question as to how modular one can go with the options once the design studio goes live. Based on previous rollouts, it looks like partial modularity would apply (by offering several different base options based on battery size upon which you can add further optional features). Thanks for your input.
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James Anders
Member
Look at it this way...
What features/options does the 7 Series BMW have that the 3 Series doesn't?
What features/options does the 7 Series BMW have that the 3 Series doesn't?
The reason is that they have an higher margin on the options, so they earn more the more option there is on the cars they deliver. When they start to roll out a new model, they have burned a lot of cash, and need the income from the sale fast. Therefore there is an incentive for them to start with (only) the top-optioned cars with the shortest delivery time (CA/west US/NA) the first week(s). But for exact the reasons you mentioned, and the tempo of the ramp-up, they can not do that for a longer period of time like they did with the Model S. We will soon see what they do with the Model X roll-out....
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Not until I had posted :redface:. I overlooked that it was more pages when I got down to the end of that page....
Good point since the analogy is similar with 7 Series a larger car just like the Model S is larger than the Model 3 will be.
For instance the 7 series is 200" in length, the 3 Series 182".
igotzzoom
Active Member
I don't want to come across as a class warrior or wealth-hater (those that know me know I'm neither of those things) but from a lot of the posts I've seen on this forum, I don't think many current Model S owners have much of a sense of perspective how important price is to many buyers. I'm not saying the Model 3 needs to be $10,000. However, I'm somewhat befuddled by S owners that say, "Tesla should launch a $75,000, dual motor, ultra-high-performance Model 3 first, and give us (current Model S owners) first crack at buying it." Tell me how in any way that accomplishes Musk's goal of making electric cars mainstream? I know for some members on here, the only difference between $10,000 and $100,000 is the number of zeros, but for most Americans, it's a MAJOR difference requiring serious strategy about money management and budgeting.
I don't feel people that would consider a $35,000 car would balk at a $40,000 or $45,000 car. If the car had a reasonable level of content and performance for that price, I would absolutely still consider it. However, $50,000 is kind of my cut-off point for reasonable consideration. If it gets to that point or more, I'll probably get a Bolt or another lower-priced EV.
I don't feel people that would consider a $35,000 car would balk at a $40,000 or $45,000 car. If the car had a reasonable level of content and performance for that price, I would absolutely still consider it. However, $50,000 is kind of my cut-off point for reasonable consideration. If it gets to that point or more, I'll probably get a Bolt or another lower-priced EV.
ProphetM
Member
That's a premise that I'm not really convinced of. Sure, they will have used up a lot of money, but they are not likely to be in dire financial straits as they may have been when releasing previous cars. Unless the Model X is a total flop, which I seriously doubt. If a low margin on a few hundred cars in their first couple months makes the difference, then they've got much bigger problems, IMO.
For one, the 7 series has a refridgerator in the back seat that the 3 doesnt.
http://www.motorbeam.com/wp-content/uploads/2013-BMW-7-Series-Rear-Seats.jpg
http://www.motorbeam.com/wp-content/uploads/2013-BMW-7-Series-Rear-Seats.jpg
I think almost everybody agrees that most of the Model 3's sold will be under 50K, but that doesn't mean they won't also offer a version that is more expensive. I also imagine that there will be an under 50K version available at launch, I'm just not sure that the 35K version will be available at launch. They will be production constrained for a while, so it makes sense for them to sell higher margin cars at first. I don't see as much a difference between Tesla's vision of the Model 3 and the Model S as other people do. After all, when their only car was the Roadster they talked about the Model S as being their affordable family car. The language they use in describing the Model 3 is similar. It will be mass market because it will be higher much higher selling than the Model S, but it certainly isn't suddenly some affordable car for the masses. It's just the next step in making their cars more mainstream.
You have a point here, but on the other hand, they will have used a lot more cash to release the TM3 then any of the other cars... Remember, all the other cars was after all "just" released to make enough money so Tesla could actually release the TM3 on the scale it will be. But for the release after TM3 (the roadster NG or TMY or whatever it will be) this should not be a problem.
bigbear
Member
I think it has a good chance, if for no other reason than it might just be easier to order the same screen 500,000 times then to manufacture 2 different screen sizes, and thus has to program for two different screens. Unless they plan on squeezing down the size of the original screen they will have to reprogram the way the programs and data are displayed on a smaller screen.
Candleflame
Active Member
ive written this a few times before, i honestly think that the touchscreen isnt that expensive, seeing how without it youd have to manufacture tons of buttons and relays etc AND an obligatory smaller LCD for media/satnav.
I think it may be a 15" screen but there will definitely be a large center display with essentially the same UI. And there will also be a driver's LCD display. That way Tesla can leverage all their R&D for the Model S UI into the Model 3 and provide the same excellent user experience.
In the past Elon has said that the 3 may only have a single display. But I just don't see how that would work, and then Tesla would have to offer a bunch of knobs and buttons and Elon would hate that.
bigbear
Member
I think the GUI work for supporting both 15" and 17" is completely negligible. They probably could simply use the same resolution in a smaller format, as well, the difference wouldn't be that big.
Going to knobs and buttons however would be a major departure from current tech, and would mean that *a lot* of programming would need to be redone, plus design and development of said buttons. They could still do it, because divided by say 5 million cars, the redesign wouldn't cost that much per car, but I don't think they will. Center touchscreen is modern, and I just don't see Tesla investing tens of millions of dollars into developing already outdated systems. I actually think Tesla would rather sell the Model 3 with a starting price of 40k USD if that is what it would take for the car to be a compelling modern car, rather than sell it with a starting price of 35k USD and have the tech of a Toyota/Honda/Ford/etc. (Not that I think it's impossible to sell the Model 3 at 35k USD with the center touchscreen.)
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I assume you would have mechanical dials for speed, power, etc. Or some other non-LCD solution.
I really really doubt Tesla would go for this solution, though. Even cheap cars these days can have LCDs for this purpose.
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It's far cheaper and easier to manufacture and update electronic displays than mechanical ones. It's a bit more expensive to design the electronic displays (software) in the first place, but they have already done that. Put in the displays on the Model 3 and install the Model S/X firmware and the UI is ready to go. Hooking up the various things from the display down to the new hardware is the only real work you have to do. I strongly doubt the Model 3 will have mechanical displays and not some form of the Model S/X displays.
gavine
Petrol Head turned EV Enthusiast
James Anders
Member
I am sure Brembos will be an option. I think there just will be a lot of options. Again, look at those features in a 7 series BMW vs a 3 series. There's going to be comparable options/features for both.
I doubt it will get below 240hp, just to keep competitive. The plethora of slow EVs polluting the market today is the result of having to cope with expensive batteries and need to increase range. As usual, Tesla will make a statement, remember the Model T was faster than a cart at the time
Another feature that probably won't make it is the special chrome trim above the windows. This huge, continuous piece of trim looks gorgeous, but is an automotive oddity. Everyone else breaks this trim into multiple pieces for ease of manufacture, shipping and installation. Tesla's trim is difficult to manufacture, ship and install. Their supplier had to come up with new manufacturing techniques and a special way to ship this part to Tesla because it was so large and easily damaged in transport. I don't think Model 3 can afford those type of expensive design details.
