Your average power while driving on the limit defines how much energy you have to turn to heat by brakes. If your car is heavy, you going to have higher average kinetic energy and lower average speed, so again more energy goes to brakes.
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Model S Plaid Brakes Are Terrible!
- Thread starter theslimshadyist
- Start date
MarcG
Active Member
I posted this in my thread about upgrading the Plaid to be more track-ready:
teslamotorsclub.com
But for more context for this thread, I‘ve had a couple years experience with Racing Brake’s rotors and pads of various compounds on my Model 3 Performance, which I tracked several times in the last two years.
Contrary to Mash’s experience, I’ve never had issues with my RB setup besides expected pad wear. I will say the XT910 compound is definitely not designed for the track and will wear quickly (i replaced them after two track days), but the XT970 is much better at handling track driving - though not quite as great as a much more expensive compound like the EX99.
Anyway, I’m a happy camper now that I have much better confidence to hit the track - and the ability to slow down much more quickly and consistently than the stock Plaid brakes.
Plaid handling improvements: better wheels, tires, brakes, suspension options
What happens when Uncle Elon decides that now there’s no longer issues producing the 4680 cells and that the Plaid + will get produced. https://www.carscoops.com/2021/10/tesla-model-s-plaid-with-active-aero-caught-testing-at-the-nurburgring/
teslamotorsclub.com
But for more context for this thread, I‘ve had a couple years experience with Racing Brake’s rotors and pads of various compounds on my Model 3 Performance, which I tracked several times in the last two years.
Contrary to Mash’s experience, I’ve never had issues with my RB setup besides expected pad wear. I will say the XT910 compound is definitely not designed for the track and will wear quickly (i replaced them after two track days), but the XT970 is much better at handling track driving - though not quite as great as a much more expensive compound like the EX99.
Anyway, I’m a happy camper now that I have much better confidence to hit the track - and the ability to slow down much more quickly and consistently than the stock Plaid brakes.
@RB_PB what are the largest rotors you offer that will be interchangeable with 19" wheels with my winter tires?How come you never purchased nor used XT910 pad yet can talk in such an authoritative mode (Don't buy...)? - Forgot or just want to act as how much you knows?
Just to help your memory, here is your revised invoice, under Note: Per customer's request XT970 was shipped (in lieu of standard XT910).
<redacted>
You sold the front kit (assumed still keep the rear kit) to an M3 owner in Hong Kong in Oct 2020, who called us for help to sort out the rotor issue on noise and installation. This was when we discovered the rotors were altered by your (with an insert ring, pic provided by the new owner).
View attachment 740365
The rotors were evidently not correctly re-assembled after alternation, but you used it to keep accusing RB two piece rotor hardware issue. Even after we explained in detail - If they are torqued properly there is no way they will become loose.
Upgrading Brake Pads for Plaid - Racing Brake
Hey folks, I can't believe that I ran out of brakes on the street....don't know why. I am certainly swapping out the fluid but I ordered some more aggressive pads from Racing Brake yesterday. The pad lining is 54mm vs. the OEM pad of 42 mm. Racing Brake also has a pad and rotor package as...
Instead of reviewing it and thinking of "what could I have done wrong?" you return with more vicious attacks.
We know this is an usual reaction from a beginner who started learning how to track; but lack of wisdom to learn. Who always blame the equipment and/or the vender but himself. In fact we have been shipping our hardware free to customers who need them that was not even caused by our fault, but you "NEVER" contacted us for the hardware issue - Neither replacement nor purchase, so why you know the hardware cost.
The new owner from Hong Kong also purchased our rear BBK and he has been happy since. In fact we helped you resolve your hardware issue with your buyer on those "undisclosed" defects so what's wrong with our customer service?
I just have these questions for you to respond.
1. What kind of track cars you owned before M3, and how many seasons or track days you have to enable you to talk like a vantage track racer?
2. Where is your rear RB BBK now, if you still have it are the hardware also making noise or falling apart., or if it's sold did you disclose to the new owner with the hardware issue?
3. If you still have RB rear kit, can you take a pic of those hardware and post it here to prove your point.
Other subjective opinions about what you like and dislike are your personal opinion BUT it's usually not coming out from someone that are truly experienced with intelligence and knowledge that are willing to help and contribute to the community, who would only advise how to make a proper choice in equipment and accessories by sharing the skills w/o even touching the brands. Your message is loud and clear - Don't buy RB but buy "X" brands, while insulting others posting positive review on RB in receiving discounts that should have well said about yourself why you recommended other brands.
You should learn how to co-exist with others with peace and respect than spreading the hate (repeatedly without a ground), you only have our kit for 3 month, while some customers have our kits for decades before they are willingly to endorse our products that's the difference.
thanks in advance
lbowroom
Plaid, white on black, CF, 8/27/21, Track Pack
your mass and change in velocity determine heat load in brakes. The motor power helped you achieve your initial velocity.
19" SV104 will clears the following RB OE Caliper BBK BBK (400/390) for Tesla S Plaid (P/N 2681-K & 2643-K) (390mm rear) or RB CCB System Kit (420/410) for Tesla Plaid & LR Front & Rear (P/N 2R44-K & 2R49-K)
@SignatureSales you're a hawk to notice that I was referred to the SV104s not stock 19s. Thank you for weighing in!
sflgator
Active Member
Yes, that was my point. I was only saying that since the Plaid is a 1,020HP/1,050 ft/lb TQ to the wheels vehicle (& it's very heavy at > 4,800lbs), it's extremely powerful meaning it can get up to high speed very quickly AND you need really powerful BRAKES to slow/stop it.
sflgator
Active Member
What are your thoughts about using the RB XT970 pads (with oem sized RB drilled/slotted rotors) on the street for occassional spirited runs as compared with the XT910 pads?I posted this in my thread about upgrading the Plaid to be more track-ready:
Plaid handling improvements: better wheels, tires, brakes, suspension options
What happens when Uncle Elon decides that now there’s no longer issues producing the 4680 cells and that the Plaid + will get produced. https://www.carscoops.com/2021/10/tesla-model-s-plaid-with-active-aero-caught-testing-at-the-nurburgring/
But for more context for this thread, I‘ve had a couple years experience with Racing Brake’s rotors and pads of various compounds on my Model 3 Performance, which I tracked several times in the last two years.
Contrary to Mash’s experience, I’ve never had issues with my RB setup besides expected pad wear. I will say the XT910 compound is definitely not designed for the track and will wear quickly (i replaced them after two track days), but the XT970 is much better at handling track driving - though not quite as great as a much more expensive compound like the EX99.
Anyway, I’m a happy camper now that I have much better confidence to hit the track - and the ability to slow down much more quickly and consistently than the stock Plaid brakes.
I have the same experience with my Plaid's brakes. Not strong enough for such a powerful car! I haven't had them replaced yet but considering. I saw some youtubers already upgrading their Plaid's brakes to much better ones. Definitely consider to do so.
Signature Wheel did their home work to have the clearance duly verified and that would be our 410/390 kit. (If you have OE 19" it only fits the front but not the rear.)
This kit also allows customer who already purchased the stock replacement 380/365 kit for a seamless upgrade by replacing only the rotor rings and adding caliper spacers/brackets which can be purchased later at a discounted price.
- Very flexible - upgrade as you see need
- Retain the rotor hats & brake pads (fully interchangeable)
- Save money
Last edited:
lbowroom
Plaid, white on black, CF, 8/27/21, Track Pack
That 400/390 kit looks really nice. Any feedback on front/rear bias performance on the Plaid?
Yeah agreed - but realistically if you want road course capable brakes on this car comfort in autopilot mode likely isn't a top priority haha.
That product desire for comfort has to be why the car has the brakes it has (and the expectation that there was going to be a "+" to sell.) When they offer track mode (and accompanying 'track' pads maybe) I'm wondering if they will adjust the modeling for the pad friction co-eff to make it work a bit better. If the 3 is any guide, they won't.
MarcG
Active Member
Good question, I would personally still go with the XT970 as the downside of the initial minor squeals (which went away completely on my Model 3 after a few days) is far outweighed by much better heat resistance and higher friction levels than the XT910s, providing with better brake feel.
This does generate more brake dust, but for someone who enjoys driving safely but spiritedly in the mountains, and who goes to the track often, it makes more sense to keep a set of XT970 for daily driving and track events without having to constantly change pads. Black rims also help
Took delivery on my S Plaid in late October. Within two days I was thinking to myself that the car does not have adequate braking. I had the S LR for 3 years previously and that seemed fine but the Plaid just feels kind of unsafe and I am not doing 100 mph through town. No, I mean more aggressive but safe driving feels harder to bring to a stop and I need greater margin now. For the car that it is, it just feels like they underdid the brakes. This is our 3rd Tesla the other being my wife's X LR, so I speaking of the way the car feels from an intuitive sense and experience in a few Teslas. I just don't feel as secure as far as the braking goes.
The tradeoffs for brake pads are always wear vs dust vs usable temp range, coeff of friction, and cost. I think it's pretty clear that Tesla optimized around a low temp usage with low coeff of friction for one pedal driving. Return springs/efficiency notwithstanding, I wonder if most people for "performance" street use wouldn't be happier if they simply changed the pads up.
Do you have the opportunity to try switching to a different pad to see if that resolves the feeling you are describing? I'm curious for someone who isn't otherwise modifying the car significantly to try it. We have used Gloc brakes before for our Model 3 successfully and they have the right caliper sizing for the Plaid now, so that is one option but really anyone who produces a performance street version I think might work so take your pick. I'm guessing the Mu on a good performance pad would be something like 50-100% more than comfort pads it comes with and not too pad with respect to wear or dust.
Brake Compounds - G-LOC Brakes - G-LOC Brakes (GS-1 = Street, R6 = basic road course/autocross pad) Caveat: we are testing R10-R16 for our road course focused application with @MountainPass but have not used/tested the Street versions.
Hawk Example: https://www.tirerack.com/images/pdf/product/Hawk-Compound-Charts.pdf
Unplugged just released their steel PFC rotor upgrade for the Plaid and LR:
Model S Plaid + LR – UP x PFC Large Sweep Brake Rotor and Pad Set (For OEM Caliper) (2021+) - Unplugged Performance
The rotor size is thicker at 34mm by the overall diameter is the same as stock it seem with a +11% annulus.
I wonder how the Girodisk MPP rotors compare as far the annulus goes. Which one would you guys like better?
Model S Plaid + LR – UP x PFC Large Sweep Brake Rotor and Pad Set (For OEM Caliper) (2021+) - Unplugged Performance
The rotor size is thicker at 34mm by the overall diameter is the same as stock it seem with a +11% annulus.
I wonder how the Girodisk MPP rotors compare as far the annulus goes. Which one would you guys like better?
lbowroom
Plaid, white on black, CF, 8/27/21, Track Pack
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