Model S&X Price Adjustments

[Kan-O-Z]

Yup, Tesla is definitely a savvy player and they don't even need to advertise. I looked up a couple of things. Apple has been around for 47 years while Tesla has been around for 15 years. Apple's net worth is 3.8 times that of Tesla (2965 vs 777 billion USD). Fun fact, Tesla's net worth is 17 times that of GM (the EV leader ). GM has been around for 115 years. I only know what Google tells me.

Yep. Apple has stayed relevant even though it’s been around for long. Remember Apple almost went bust around late 90s/2000. Jobs came back after being kicked out of the company he founded and resurrected Apple in early 2000s.

Tesla is a great company don’t get me wrong. I’ve always wondered why no one produced a serious EV until Tesla came around and changed the game. I was a fan of GMs EV1 in the 90s. Imagine where they would be if they followed through with EVs like 2 decades before Tesla! EV1 was a great car for it’s time!

I only complain about Tesla’s latest tactics and places where they need some improvements. Personally I think Elon did his job in helping Tesla being successful. But now it’s time for another phase and I don’t believe he has the skillset to take it further. That involves attention to detail, delivering on promises, and great customer experience. Elon is all over the place with his 10 companies and social media to stay focused and follow through like Jobs. Things like him getting overly political and saying stupid things on social media like challenging Zuckerberg to a fight certainly don’t help.

I truly believe another CEO could take Tesla to the next level. The engineers at Tesla are great.

 

[Unclepaul]

Name a car dealer (or better yet a car company) that changes their normal price (not sale/promo price) for a vehicle by $20k overnight.

Or for that matter name any product (phone, laptop, etc) that has a huge price adjustment month to month. I’ve never seen an Apple product go from being $1000 to $700 for the exact same model/version that you just bought yesterday.

I think Elon’s Asperger’s causes unstability at all levels in all his companies.

Apple does indeed do this, quite often. When they release a new model, they often continue to sell the old model at a discounted price.
In addition Federal Tax Credits, local rebates, and Utility refunds often come and go from one day to another. You cannot get a rebate that expired lase week on a purchase today.

The dollar can Zoom or crash in value, as does gold, Crypto Currency and the prices of gasoline.

 

[Kan-O-Z]

Apple does indeed do this, quite often. When they release a new model, they often continue to sell the old model at a discounted price.
In addition Federal Tax Credits, local rebates, and Utility refunds often come and go from one day to another. You cannot get a rebate that expired lase week on a purchase today.

The dollar can Zoom or crash in value, as does gold, Crypto Currency and the prices of gasoline.

The key is a new model. You never see apple reduce its price without a fair reason like a new model. Sales and promotions don’t destroy the used market. They are for limited time and the price comes back to where it was. I’ve also never really seen much more than 10% off as a sale (ie Black Friday). Compare that to Tesla cutting the REGULAR price by 40% on some models. This isn’t a case where the older model was discounted. There is no newer model. It’s the exact same car and model.

 

[zoomer0056]

apple

Tesla does not want to be like apple. Tesla does Tesla only. It does not make sense to compare Apples to  oranges Teslas.

 

[EatsShoots]

Dealer overpricing is not the same comparison. Assume Tesla was sold through dealers. Now if Tesla priced the Plaid at $90k MSRP and the dealer decided to sell it for $140k, it is VERY clear to the consumer what is going on. It's pure dealer markup and it's in plain sight.

When one buys a Tesla, it's not clear that Tesla has marked up their own car any $50k. I can tell you that if Tesla sold through dealers and they were marking up their cars by $50k, I for one would not have any inclination of buying. I would wait it out.

What other manufacturer adjusted their MSRP price by huge amounts like Tesla? None.

Price gouging like no other car company or tech company and many on here support it. LOL.

Markup, dealer market adjustment, it's all a rose by any other name. I see that the average new car price in 2020 was about $39k. By 2022 it had bounced to $47k (this based on a google image of historic prices attributed to cox automotive). Absolutely everybody who bought a tesla at any time could have clearly seen how prices had changed very aggressively upward. They were betting that the huge ramp up in prices would be the new normal and they bet wrong.

Check this out: $54k ford bronco with an $18k market adjustment: https://i.redd.it/vuqp3bdhv3f91.jpg

If you "had to have" a ford bronco and couldn't wait for inevitable settling of the market you're now underwater to the tune of five digits. Same thing happened with people overpaying an F150 lightning: Ford Dealer Adds $69,554 Markup To F-150 Lightning (Update)

One could make the argument that it's shortchanging stock holders if tesla did not demand prices that, in 2022, people were willing to pay.

I only complain about Tesla’s latest tactics and places where they need some improvements. Personally I think Elon did his job in helping Tesla being successful. But now it’s time for another phase and I don’t believe he has the skillset to take it further. That involves attention to detail, delivering on promises, and great customer experience. Elon is all over the place with his 10 companies and social media to stay focused and follow through like Jobs. Things like him getting overly political and saying stupid things on social media like challenging Zuckerberg to a fight certainly don’t help.

I truly believe another CEO could take Tesla to the next level. The engineers at Tesla are great.

Tesla wouldn't be where it is now without him, but Musk has always been a bit of a clown, and he's lately really upped his game. He's terrible for the brand these days. He's done a fantastic job in the past couple of years of reducing the public's opinion of him, and the glossy sheen of the tesla brand has been severely damaged as a result (in my belief). I sure wouldn't complain if he was replaced by somebody who spends more time on tesla than puerile social media fights. His recent forays into right wing politics are kryptonite for the EV demographic.

 

[zoomer0056]

When one buys a Tesla, it's not clear that Tesla has marked up their own car any $50k.

There are no stealership markups on a Tesla. There is no such thing as Manufacturer "Suggested" Retail Price for a Tesla. With legacy auto, prices are different for every customer. A Tesla is sold to everyone at the same price.

 

[Joe-FV]

They can afford to follow interest rates and ensure the macro environment doesn’t affect sales, so they do.
Further, it really depends upon what the stated goal is—they have always said it was to further the transition to sustainable energy/transportation, keeping people switching to EVs.
I bought a couple of them at much higher prices than are offered now. What hasn’t changed is that I made a decision that the physical cars were worth XX price and I paid it. I am still happy as a clam every time I get in one.

(And you don’t lose till you sell, give it a minute)

 

[Kan-O-Z]

There are no stealership markups on a Tesla. There is no such thing as Manufacturer "Suggested" Retail Price for a Tesla. With legacy auto, prices are different for every customer. A Tesla is sold to everyone at the same price.

I am not supporting dealerships. But it seems that Tesla is playing the same game as dealerships. Huge markups to gouge and take advantage totally based on demand week to week. My point I was making is that MSRP prices from other manufacturers don’t fluctuate that much (talking about the companies here: Toyota, GM, etc). Sure the dealerships take full advantage as you said but it’s also very clear they are doing so. Anyone can see what the MSRP is and what the dealership is charging.

I think where customers feel taken advantage of is exactly this. They felt they are dealing with Tesla so there is more stability and fairness with prices. But it was definitely not the case. Price changes week to week. Sure everyone pays the same price today but tomorrow who knows.

 

[Kan-O-Z]

Markup, dealer market adjustment, it's all a rose by any other name. I see that the average new car price in 2020 was about $39k. By 2022 it had bounced to $47k (this based on a google image of historic prices attributed to cox automotive). Absolutely everybody who bought a tesla at any time could have clearly seen how prices had changed very aggressively upward. They were betting that the huge ramp up in prices would be the new normal and they bet wrong.

Check this out: $54k ford bronco with an $18k market adjustment: https://i.redd.it/vuqp3bdhv3f91.jpg

If you "had to have" a ford bronco and couldn't wait for inevitable settling of the market you're now underwater to the tune of five digits. Same thing happened with people overpaying an F150 lightning: Ford Dealer Adds $69,554 Markup To F-150 Lightning (Update)

One could make the argument that it's shortchanging stock holders if tesla did not demand prices that, in 2022, people were willing to pay.

Tesla wouldn't be where it is now without him, but Musk has always been a bit of a clown, and he's lately really upped his game. He's terrible for the brand these days. He's done a fantastic job in the past couple of years of reducing the public's opinion of him, and the glossy sheen of the tesla brand has been severely damaged as a result (in my belief). I sure wouldn't complain if he was replaced by somebody who spends more time on tesla than puerile social media fights. His recent forays into right wing politics are kryptonite for the EV demographic.

Totally agree with your recent assessment of Musk. I used to like him a lot years ago and respected him. It’s much less today. A friend of mine went for a BMW because he said he can’t support Musk.

Musk doesn’t realize how badly his own image and all his company brand images is going downhill. Couple that with the new upcoming competition and he’s gonna be in trouble. Smart guy at some things and a complete idiot and mess at other things.

 

[zoomer0056]

playing the same game as dealerships. Huge markup

Tesla does only Tesla and is not the same as anything. Markup happens only to MSRP. I get what you wanna say, but the wording is not right. Strange to me, only that prices are down are people complaining about high prices.

 

[Eric33432]

A lot of good comments here. I can see both sides.

But as a person who paid almost $146k (before tax and tag) on 6/30/2023 for a MX Plaid (red / cream with the 22" wheels, no FSD) I cannot fault Tesla for selling the car to me at that price, and I am not beating myself up for buying it. It is simple supply and demand. Supply was limited and people were willing to pay the price. What were they supposed to do? Selling the car for $98,400 (price today) would have caused even greater shortages. That is the problem in centrally planned economies, where some government officials try to be smarter than the market and determine what is produced and what the price should be. Only shortages and misery come from that.

Say what you want about Elon, but I suspect Tesla has some pretty good economists setting its pricing strategy.

As EV adoption increases, and someday EVs become mainstream, the people here that will never do business with Tesla again will not be material to Tesla's success, and the late adopters will know nothing about this, or if they do will not care. These people will do what they perceive to be in their best interests when it comes time to buy a new car.

Just like I am not a factor to BMW, who sold me a lemon in 1986, and with whom I will NEVER buy a car from.

I still love my MX, even with it's creaks. Bought a little M3 RWD for my daughter about a month ago from inventory and got what I thought was a good deal, with the knowledge that there was a new M3 coming out. Really nice and tight little car, fun to drive. Daughter does not care for the stalkless MX, did not want the refresh M3.

And I will never buy a car using the dealership method again.

 

[Kan-O-Z]

Tesla does only Tesla and is not the same as anything. Markup happens only to MSRP. I get what you wanna say, but the wording is not right. Strange to me, only that prices are down are people complaining about high prices.

What I am trying to say is they never should have gone up like crazy. Tesla did what your typical "stealership" would do. They saw demand and did huge markups! I just wish they listed the markup on paper so we could all see it. With stealership it's in your face.

A lot of people buying Tesla's expected better and more honest pricing and made the assumption Tesla would provide that...which they did not.

 

[Kan-O-Z]

A lot of good comments here. I can see both sides.

But as a person who paid almost $146k (before tax and tag) on 6/30/2023 for a MX Plaid (red / cream with the 22" wheels, no FSD) I cannot fault Tesla for selling the car to me at that price, and I am not beating myself up for buying it. It is simple supply and demand. Supply was limited and people were willing to pay the price. What were they supposed to do? Selling the car for $98,400 (price today) would have caused even greater shortages. That is the problem in centrally planned economies, where some government officials try to be smarter than the market and determine what is produced and what the price should be. Only shortages and misery come from that.

Say what you want about Elon, but I suspect Tesla has some pretty good economists setting its pricing strategy.

As EV adoption increases, and someday EVs become mainstream, the people that here that will never do business with Tesla again will not be material to Tesla's success, and the late adopters will know nothing about this, or if they do will not care. These people will do what they perceive to be in their best interests when it comes time to buy a new car.

Just like I am not a factor to BMW, who sold me a lemon in 1986, and with whom I will NEVER buy a car from.

I still love my MX, even with it's creaks. Bought a little M3 RWD for my daughter about a month ago from inventory and got what I thought was a good deal, with the knowledge that there was a new M3 coming out. Really nice and tight little car, fun to drive. Daughter does not care for the stalkless MX, did not want the refresh M3.

And I will never buy a car using the dealership method again.

I ordered appliances for my new house and there was a 1yr wait. It was not marked up 40% however. I still got the same price. The wait just got longer. That's what consumers expect from manufacturers and companies. Only stealerships do you expect ridiculous markups like 40%. Tesla is not much better than a stealership.

 

[EatsShoots]

I ordered appliances for my new house and there was a 1yr wait. It was not marked up 40% however. I still got the same price. The wait just got longer. That's what consumers expect from manufacturers and companies. Only stealerships do you expect ridiculous markups like 40%. Tesla is not much better than a stealership.

I really don't think there is a correct view of this, just alternate opinions.

In my view a non-essential product (essential being food, medicine, etc.) can arguably not be gouged to begin with because nobody is levering your legitimate, undeniable need to make a dollar.

Example appliance: If you want to pay MSRP of $800 and wait a year for a washing machine but somebody else is willing to pay $1200 for it now, to get to the top of the list, is it bad that they are given that opportunity? It's certainly better for the manufacturer, and the fact they are willing to pay $1200 whereas you're only willing to pay $800 in fact means they are a better customer--according to market principles more "worthy" of the purchase because they will pay more. This is also why I don't blame car dealerships for adding these huge market adjustments. Their supply was limited, so with reduced sales it was a mechanism to get their revenues back up. At the same time I was not going to partake in that, so when I needed a new car last year I only purchased at MSRP--and in one case had to wait a couple of months.

 

[Kan-O-Z]

I really don't think there is a correct view of this, just alternate opinions.

In my view a non-essential product (essential being food, medicine, etc.) can arguably not be gouged to begin with because nobody is levering your legitimate, undeniable need to make a dollar.

Example appliance: If you want to pay MSRP of $800 and wait a year for a washing machine but somebody else is willing to pay $1200 for it now, to get to the top of the list, is it bad that they are given that opportunity? It's certainly better for the manufacturer, and the fact they are willing to pay $1200 whereas you're only willing to pay $800 in fact means they are a better customer--according to market principles more "worthy" of the purchase because they will pay more. This is also why I don't blame car dealerships for adding these huge market adjustments. Their supply was limited, so with reduced sales it was a mechanism to get their revenues back up. At the same time I was not going to partake in that, so when I needed a new car last year I only purchased at MSRP--and in one case had to wait a couple of months.

All depends on how you feel. Most manufacturers have some sort of good practices they follow.

Another example: when Apple released their new iPhone during the pandemic the wait was many many months long. Apple did not gouge its customers. As a matter of fact they tried to stop flippers who bought iPhones and sold them 2-3 times their worth. You could only buy 2 iPhones maximum.

Good practices builds good image which builds good customers which builds good sales. It’s a holistic long term strategy v short term gain.

I’m only calling this out because some people are under the spell that Tesla is way better than a stealership. They’re not.

 

[Jimboy435]

Tesla does not want to be like apple. Tesla does Tesla only. It does not make sense to compare Apples to  oranges Teslas.

You have to remember prior to Tesla, car buying was an experience no one wanted to go through. Tesla changed that by going direct to consumer..also i am not sure if anyone remembers in the 90’s, dealer cashback and “x amount under invoice” came through because access to the internet and sites like Edmund’s, true car helped educate the consumer. I remember going in to a Honda dealer for an accord and showing him Edmund’s true value and they were like we don’t care! Another dealer honored it..so Tesla is unique in what they are doing, I am hoping it catches to legacy dealers who are still stuck in the 90s. Wouldn’t it be nice if dropping prices was a norm for all car companies…it would really change the whole dynamic how you would buy cars

 

[Kan-O-Z]

You have to remember prior to Tesla, car buying was an experience no one wanted to go through. Tesla changed that by going direct to consumer..also i am not sure if anyone remembers in the 90’s, dealer cashback and “x amount under invoice” came through because access to the internet and sites like Edmund’s, true car helped educate the consumer. I remember going in to a Honda dealer for an accord and showing him Edmund’s true value and they were like we don’t care! Another dealer honored it..so Tesla is unique in what they are doing, I am hoping it catches to legacy dealers who are still stuck in the 90s. Wouldn’t it be nice if dropping prices was a norm for all car companies…it would really change the whole dynamic how you would buy cars

Products should be priced right so they don’t need to drop and are already at a good value. They shouldn’t really go up or go down (aside from sales/promotions short term, or a newer version has arrived that has more features and performance).

That is is ideal. And surprisingly most companies selling direct to consumers already do this!

 

[sorka]

There are no stealership markups on a Tesla. There is no such thing as Manufacturer "Suggested" Retail Price for a Tesla. With legacy auto, prices are different for every customer. A Tesla is sold to everyone at the same price.

There is and it's the law. MSRP must be stated on the Monroney sticker which is what the $7500 cap is based on.

 

[ngng]

Products should be priced right so they don’t need to drop and are already at a good value. They shouldn’t really go up or go down (aside from sales/promotions short term, or a newer version has arrived that has more features and performance).

That is is ideal. And surprisingly most companies selling direct to consumers already do this!

Sounds like you should start an EV company and implement your business strategy.

 

[eng8]

Products should be priced right so they don’t need to drop and are already at a good value. They shouldn’t really go up or go down (aside from sales/promotions short term, or a newer version has arrived that has more features and performance).

That is is ideal. And surprisingly most companies selling direct to consumers already do this!

Elon is the CEO of Tesla and he is free to bring the price up and down for the best interest of the company. You are the customer who is free to buy or not to buy from the company. I think you know full well before buying that Tesla had been hiking up the prices. I “lost” $20k from my XLR too after several price drops. It could have beeen more if I bought at the peak price. But I couldn’t blame Tesla because I knew that adjusting price is what they keep doing based on supply and demand. I think it’s best to move on.