Describe a case where Cadillac released a new technology that did not work as advertised or better. Even the electric starter for cars worked fine right off the bat.
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Move Over Tesla. Here Comes Cadillac.
- Thread starter NerdUno
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Describe a case where Cadillac released a new technology that did not work as advertised or better. Even the electric starter for cars worked fine right off the bat.
I have no complaints with Cadillac. Heck I owned a 2005 Cadillac STS 10+ years ago and the adaptive cruise control worked great back then. I can only assume they will come out of the gate with a working system or they would have just delayed it further. I rather that approach then being a beta tester out of the gate.
3Victoria
Active Member
twonius
Member
I feel for the AP2 folks here, No one realized how much Tesla was going backwards here before they'd get back to AP1 performance. I assumed they'd have surpassed AP1 by now.
In one sense they knew they were buying an unfinished product, but it was probably oversold relative to how far they've come in the last months.If it was just an OTA update like AP1 then I'd feel differently, but you either bought FSD or wouldn't have the option later.
For the total cost of this option you could've literally bought another car, or taken a very nice holiday.
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@3Victoria: Never mind that we actually paid for the features that you didn't pay a nickel extra for. 
You do understand that most of us in the last quarter of 2016 were actually told that the new cars would be better than the old AP1 vehicles. So never mind that nothing worked. Do you happily buy sh*t like this often?
You do understand that most of us in the last quarter of 2016 were actually told that the new cars would be better than the old AP1 vehicles. So never mind that nothing worked. Do you happily buy sh*t like this often?
twonius
Member
It's also because of this kind of stuff that I haven't reserved a model 3. I'm sure eventually they'll get it all worked out, but I'll leave that to someone else to deal with.
So are you saying the Cadilac system is as good as or better than AP1? Tesla should have tried to at least duplicate AP1 on their own while working on trying to build a working AP2 before selling it with false promises. I guess AP at this point is one of the main selling points of Tesla so they were stuck with what have been plummeting sales if they didn't make false or at least exaggerated promises of AP2 by January. If Tesla cant provide a system that at least equals or betters AP1 for half of the three years that an average buyer of a luxury car keeps their car and AP is one of the main reasons the buyer is buying a Tesla, then Tesla is cheating the owner out of a significant amount of the premium they paid based on AP2 Vaporware. Keep in mind that without autopilot you aren't getting any real features in the Tesla other than what a basic cheap sedan offers plus the electric drive. I've heard people say in this forum how expensive an EV is to build and therefore the lack of features, Lack of quality but still the premium price. I'm not sure who drums that idea of high cost to build into their heads but there are a lot fewer parts in an electric car and if the 3 can be profitable then I guess that higher cost really was just BS. Don't forget Tesla got their factory and manufacturing equipment for pennies on the dollar from GM and Toyota so their cost should be artificially lower.
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I already laid out $8000 for AP2 and FSD so I want to get my money's worth but I was not expecting to be a Beta tester so yes, I am being forced to be a Beta tester to get what I paid for. I am still also waiting for simple things like my Auto High Beams & Auto Windshield Wipers I was promised.
No one is forcing you use auto pilot? that's what the car was sold to buyer based
You must be joking "No one is forcing you to use auto pilot" that's what Tesla sold cars based on and charged buyers for!
Actually, yes, Tesla is forcing me to be a beta tester, against my wishes. They sold me a feature that was supposed to be perfected and "enhanced" compared to AP1 (which I test drove and worked quite well). I'm still waiting to get what I paid for in real non-beta money.
I had no way to reasonable expect AP2 would be anything but superior to AP1. Would you expect your new iPhone 6's camera to not take photos after trading in your iPhone 5, after hearing Steve Jobs ranting and raving about the "magical" new camera on the iPhone 6?
This was not a choice by us owners, but a conscious decision by Tesla to defraud early AP2 owners.
FlyingCookie
Member
The Adaptive Cruise in the Cadillac STS (2005-2011) was always mediocre, but it generally either worked very very well or not at all. It was easy to make it refuse to engage (rain, dust clouds blowing over the internet, fog, etc) but when it was confident it generally would track the car ahead very well and not brake late/early or too hard/not hard enough. Hopefully Supercruise (that's a terrible name...) will be as refined.
I think AutoPilot is going to be better for a while, but I do think that GM at least has a shot at making this work well on the interstate. Tesla is trying to tackle the really frustrating things right now, though. I'm fine to drive on the interstate all day long for a week, but when you put me in rush hour traffic that's just stop and go, I would much much rather have the computer take over for me.
I think AutoPilot is going to be better for a while, but I do think that GM at least has a shot at making this work well on the interstate. Tesla is trying to tackle the really frustrating things right now, though. I'm fine to drive on the interstate all day long for a week, but when you put me in rush hour traffic that's just stop and go, I would much much rather have the computer take over for me.
Chopr147
Active Member
I don't mind your anti-Tesla opinion but get ya facts straight. 1st Q 2017 WAY up from last year 1st Q
I hope GM Super-cruise works well but their history suggests it will not. And something like this needs updates often. Will the consumer have to go into service and pay for those updates? At least once a year minimum.
I feel for the AP2 users. It will work as advertised but anyone following Tesla knows the timeline is always overly optimistic.
Is this going to be about transit buses, rear engine sports cars, dealer associations, or normal pickup tank placement? Or do we get lectured once again on how grand life would be if Japan or Germany were the only countries allowed to make vehicles since all Americans are stupid?
Do you know when Tesla will allow hands-free driving like the Cadillac does for pre-mapped roads?
For non-mapped roads the Cadillac system defaults down to a lower level of autonomy, similar to what Tesla offers, meaning the driver is required to keep their hands on the wheel while the ACC does its thing.
No, but it isn't really available from Cadillac yet either. I do hope it lives up to its hype. It will be good to have competition in this area. It also implies that Tesla could add enhanced maps (Lidar generated, fleet generated, etc) and continue to improve its operation as well.
Of course eye monitoring hardware is missing. But there are alternatives I would guess/hope.
This isn't anti Tesla, "get my fact straight " I'm just stating facts. I didn't say they had plummeting sales. I said they would probably would have had plummeted sales if they had not lied about the AP2. You call Tesla lying just "being overly optimistic " they knew exactly what they were selling with AP2 to unsuspecting customers. They skirt flat out lying by parsing their statements just enough to push sales.
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jeffro01
Active Member
Still whining I see... I find it extremely hard to believe that Tesla is "at least as bad as the very worst used car dealer I've ever had the pleasure of dealing with"... You just lost all credibility with that comment. That's just absurd...
Jeff
Like I've said before, there appears to be two basic AP2 buyers.
But I'm an EV enthusiast/driver and outsider with a reservation for a Model 3. My wife veto'd a P series Model S last year, just like I can veto major purchases.
I can say that if she changes her mind (that has happened a lot), we probably would not order AP2 with the build. We would buy it at higher cost via OTA when the technology is more polished.
She is not interested in Super Cruise either for what that is worth.
- Those who believe in the vision of fashionable, powerful, and futuristic products from Tesla Motors and accept that they are and probably always will be a work in progress, and know that waiting for features is part of the history of Tesla Motors.
- Those who believe Tesla Motors should operate more like the existing car companies and when delivered, the car should do everything you've heard their marketing mention from the day you drive it home.
But I'm an EV enthusiast/driver and outsider with a reservation for a Model 3. My wife veto'd a P series Model S last year, just like I can veto major purchases.
I can say that if she changes her mind (that has happened a lot), we probably would not order AP2 with the build. We would buy it at higher cost via OTA when the technology is more polished.
She is not interested in Super Cruise either for what that is worth.
jeffro01
Active Member
Very interesting... I say that because my wife thought AP was a gimmick until she took the Model S to work for the first time and now can't wait to give her Volt up to get a car with AP... Granted no two experiences are the same but I feel like I've heard more than a few people talk about how AP (from whatever vendor and whatever that vendor names it) isn't interesting to them until they experience it, especially in traffic...
Jeff
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