BoerumHill
not great not terrible
Hey buddy - meant to acknowledge this earlier today but got busy @ work. This is an encouraging development. I know you're still in limbo but pulling for a good outcome for you here.
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Hey buddy - meant to acknowledge this earlier today but got busy @ work. This is an encouraging development. I know you're still in limbo but pulling for a good outcome for you here.
I have no idea what sort of "legal issue" this could be, but given that Tesla Legal is totally incompetent and has allowed Tesla to violate copyrights rampantly for over 2 years, I don't believe their claim that there's a "legal issue". I think it's purest ********.
What Tesla should do is to offer the owner all the service history *which Tesla has*. When buying the car back from the previous owner, the previous owner should sign a disclaimer allowing the service history to be retained and shared with a future owner, with name/contact information/license plate and other personally identifying information stripped. Tesla should give the service history to the new owner with a further disclaimer, stating that this only constitutes the service history *of which Tesla is aware*, and that Tesla cannot guarantee that the previous owner did not have other service done without telling Tesla.
I cannot think of any legal system under which this would be a problem.
HankLloydRight
No Roads
ev-now
Member
Juse want to thank BoerumHill for contacting Tesla and sharing the response. Clearly internal policy on service history is still confused - legal issue is BS, as other said that can be covered as part of the trade-in paperwork.
The previous owner's personal information can easily be redacted when disclosing the service and repair history of the car...
After reading this thread, I felt I should weigh in with our own CPO purchase.
We started looking at CPO cars through Tesla's website in May 2015 and found a few candidate cars on there that met our needs. We watched them vanish as they got purchased, but others would pop up. Finally we narrowed down on one that was located in Cleveland. The car had all of our required features, as well as a few extra features that were nice additions. It was a 2013 P85 (manufactured Feb 2013) with 17,000 miles on it. I contacted Tesla by phone and was given a direct contact point in Cleveland to discuss the car. The person was very helpful, and offered to help trade in our current car if we wanted (a 2011 VW Jetta Sportwagen TDI). He didn't pressure us at all on the trade in, saying it was entirely a service to make the purchase of the Tesla more convenient. We weren't planning on trading in, and the quote they offered was a few thousand less than the price we got selling it locally.
I asked him to take photographs of the car, and gave him some specific areas that I would be concerned about, such as the front hood (for rock chips), driver's seat (for wear) and any damage that he could see. He quickly took a handful of very high resolution photos of the car, including photos of minor scratches on the metal trim on the inside of the drivers door and 2' long scratch down the passenger rear door and quarter panel. The scratch was deep, clearly down to metal in some places. He also took a photo of some very minor curb rash on 1 of the 21" wheels, which was interesting because the CPO listing showed the car with 19" wheels.
I spoke with him on the phone and asked him about the scratch, and if they could drop their price because of that. He said no, the price was based on the car in the condition it was in. He confirmed the car we were looking at had 21" wheels (despite the CPO listing), and said if that was a concern, they could easily swap those out for 19s. The rest of the car looked fine. He didn't indicate to me that Tesla was going to do anything to repair or replace the damage. He did tell us that while the delivery time frame would be determined after we paid our deposit, he thought it would headed our way within the week.
We put our deposit down in late May. It took almost exactly 4 weeks to deliver the car from Cleveland to us in Oregon (through the Portland Service Center). Tesla in fact shipped the car back to Fremont due to logistical efficiencies, and informed me they would be doing a full service on the car there before sending it to Portland.
When we finally went up to Portland for delivery, we found the scratch had been fully repaired. The car had those beautiful 21" wheels and the minor curb rash on the 1 wheel is still present (and when I say minor, its really minor), and the scuffs on the driver's door interior trim was still present, but our delivery specialist noted it and marked it for replacement (which is happening next week). The tires looked nearly new, they definitely did not have 17,000 miles on them! As I consider the tires to be the biggest/highest cost wear item on the Model S, I was very pleased to see this.
Our brake rotors have rusted, and look like the ones you originally posted. This is entirely normal though, and its not something I would have complained about. I actually feel a bit bad for Tesla having to replace your rotors because you complained about perfectly normal rust on them, but I do respect them for doing it in an effort to keep a customer happy. I may consider painting the non-wear surfaces of our rotors to prevent rust since the brakes are probably going to last a really long time as we've gotten the hang of 1 pedal driving.
Other damage or wear that I've found since taking delivery: There's scratches on the valance under the front chin of the car, most likely from steep driveway entries or parking lot curbs, and there's some similar scuffs on the fins beneath the car behind the rear wheels too. There was some make up or lipstick smudges on the suede headliner, some grime between the armrests where its hard to reach (we were able to clean those ourselves) and the UMC has some scuffs on the charge brick, the wall plug and the car plug. None of these are things I would complain about from a car that has 17,000 miles on it. Overall, I found the car to be in excellent condition, and it was in better condition than I was expecting.
We have had no issues with the car at all except for 1: the last OTA update failed to install. I worked with Tesla for about a week remotely and they determined it is a hardware issue with our center display system. The car functions just fine, but I occasionally get "Update unsuccessful" notifications on my Tesla app, there's a service notice in the dash, and the car reports a charging rate of 500 mi/hr when plugged in to my 120v outlets. And despite claiming the 500 mi/hr rate, I don't have 120v, 1,250 amp plugs! I'm taking the car to the Portland Service Center this coming week for this to be fixed (they are replacing the center display system), the interior door panel to be replaced and they are going to be upgrading the main pack contactors.
Overall, I am very happy with both the car and Tesla's service. This is by far the most expensive car I've ever owned, so maybe my expectations are lower than someone coming from the higher end auto experience. I know a few others who have purchased new Model Ss and it does not appear that Tesla's customer service to me as a CPO owner is any different than theirs as a brand new owner. My previous dealership purchase/service experience was very good (VW, but our local dealer sold VW, Audi, Porsche and BMW). Their service was detailed, thorough and considerate, and they treated me and my car well. Before that I dealt with a local Volvo dealer and they treated me and my Volvo very poorly.
We started looking at CPO cars through Tesla's website in May 2015 and found a few candidate cars on there that met our needs. We watched them vanish as they got purchased, but others would pop up. Finally we narrowed down on one that was located in Cleveland. The car had all of our required features, as well as a few extra features that were nice additions. It was a 2013 P85 (manufactured Feb 2013) with 17,000 miles on it. I contacted Tesla by phone and was given a direct contact point in Cleveland to discuss the car. The person was very helpful, and offered to help trade in our current car if we wanted (a 2011 VW Jetta Sportwagen TDI). He didn't pressure us at all on the trade in, saying it was entirely a service to make the purchase of the Tesla more convenient. We weren't planning on trading in, and the quote they offered was a few thousand less than the price we got selling it locally.
I asked him to take photographs of the car, and gave him some specific areas that I would be concerned about, such as the front hood (for rock chips), driver's seat (for wear) and any damage that he could see. He quickly took a handful of very high resolution photos of the car, including photos of minor scratches on the metal trim on the inside of the drivers door and 2' long scratch down the passenger rear door and quarter panel. The scratch was deep, clearly down to metal in some places. He also took a photo of some very minor curb rash on 1 of the 21" wheels, which was interesting because the CPO listing showed the car with 19" wheels.
I spoke with him on the phone and asked him about the scratch, and if they could drop their price because of that. He said no, the price was based on the car in the condition it was in. He confirmed the car we were looking at had 21" wheels (despite the CPO listing), and said if that was a concern, they could easily swap those out for 19s. The rest of the car looked fine. He didn't indicate to me that Tesla was going to do anything to repair or replace the damage. He did tell us that while the delivery time frame would be determined after we paid our deposit, he thought it would headed our way within the week.
We put our deposit down in late May. It took almost exactly 4 weeks to deliver the car from Cleveland to us in Oregon (through the Portland Service Center). Tesla in fact shipped the car back to Fremont due to logistical efficiencies, and informed me they would be doing a full service on the car there before sending it to Portland.
When we finally went up to Portland for delivery, we found the scratch had been fully repaired. The car had those beautiful 21" wheels and the minor curb rash on the 1 wheel is still present (and when I say minor, its really minor), and the scuffs on the driver's door interior trim was still present, but our delivery specialist noted it and marked it for replacement (which is happening next week). The tires looked nearly new, they definitely did not have 17,000 miles on them! As I consider the tires to be the biggest/highest cost wear item on the Model S, I was very pleased to see this.
Our brake rotors have rusted, and look like the ones you originally posted. This is entirely normal though, and its not something I would have complained about. I actually feel a bit bad for Tesla having to replace your rotors because you complained about perfectly normal rust on them, but I do respect them for doing it in an effort to keep a customer happy. I may consider painting the non-wear surfaces of our rotors to prevent rust since the brakes are probably going to last a really long time as we've gotten the hang of 1 pedal driving.
Other damage or wear that I've found since taking delivery: There's scratches on the valance under the front chin of the car, most likely from steep driveway entries or parking lot curbs, and there's some similar scuffs on the fins beneath the car behind the rear wheels too. There was some make up or lipstick smudges on the suede headliner, some grime between the armrests where its hard to reach (we were able to clean those ourselves) and the UMC has some scuffs on the charge brick, the wall plug and the car plug. None of these are things I would complain about from a car that has 17,000 miles on it. Overall, I found the car to be in excellent condition, and it was in better condition than I was expecting.
We have had no issues with the car at all except for 1: the last OTA update failed to install. I worked with Tesla for about a week remotely and they determined it is a hardware issue with our center display system. The car functions just fine, but I occasionally get "Update unsuccessful" notifications on my Tesla app, there's a service notice in the dash, and the car reports a charging rate of 500 mi/hr when plugged in to my 120v outlets. And despite claiming the 500 mi/hr rate, I don't have 120v, 1,250 amp plugs! I'm taking the car to the Portland Service Center this coming week for this to be fixed (they are replacing the center display system), the interior door panel to be replaced and they are going to be upgrading the main pack contactors.
Overall, I am very happy with both the car and Tesla's service. This is by far the most expensive car I've ever owned, so maybe my expectations are lower than someone coming from the higher end auto experience. I know a few others who have purchased new Model Ss and it does not appear that Tesla's customer service to me as a CPO owner is any different than theirs as a brand new owner. My previous dealership purchase/service experience was very good (VW, but our local dealer sold VW, Audi, Porsche and BMW). Their service was detailed, thorough and considerate, and they treated me and my car well. Before that I dealt with a local Volvo dealer and they treated me and my Volvo very poorly.
HankLloydRight
No Roads
While it's there, and the center console being replaced, you may want to ask or, or confirm that, the center console unit has the latest LTE upgrade. They are charging $500 for the job, but considering they're already replacing the center console, you may be able to get away for just the cost of parts, and that's assuming the new center console is not LTE upgraded.
I spoke with them about that. The LTE upgrade is available to do, but it will be $500 for the upgrade, and there's no discount due to the dash being apart. They said it was a package upgrade, they couldn't just break out the parts at a lower price. I'm hoping for the outside chance that the new console system just has it, but we'll see. We live out in the sticks, data coverage is pretty spotty, bad enough that we rarely listen to the internet radio and we're used to driving through a featureless green field on the nav system. I don't see the LTE module helping that much.
The treatment is nice. What might have been missing on a few cars was a more thorough screen. I think Tesla is working harder to fix that. If they were being cheap, it would have shown up a lot more frequently. Delivering new cars isn't easy, but that QC process has had a lot more time to bake-in.
I think some people have unrealistic expectations when it comes to buying used cars. A CPO car is a used car by the way. Some people take care of their cars, but most people really do not take good care of their cars.
You get a good discount on purchase price, but that discount comes with some risk. For me it worked out great.
If you want a car that is perfect in every way, then you should skip the used market and just pay the money for a new car.
You get a good discount on purchase price, but that discount comes with some risk. For me it worked out great.
If you want a car that is perfect in every way, then you should skip the used market and just pay the money for a new car.
taurusking
Member
That is a bummer...I wish Tesla did not charge you $500..I can understand what you are saying though...I drive mostly on the country side and I don't need a LTE upgrade.
You could always get around the LTE issue by activating the WIFI hotspot feature on your phone and your car gets LTE Internet right away...
HankLloydRight
No Roads
I just completed a 1500 mile r/t trip, and I tried that several times. It works, and the connection is faster, but it never stays connected, it drops back to 3G pretty quickly (within 10-15 minutes). Now this might be a function of my iPhone 5, or the Tesla wi-fi stack, or both. If it were more stable, I'd use it all the time, but it's too problematic to worry about constantly re-connecting to the wi-fi network to get LTE speeds. So I just gave up using this method.
taurusking
Member
@MsElectric
So this works only if the phone is able to get 4G LTE service right? I drive on country side and most of them are just 3G.
Yup, without a 4G signal whether it is built in 4G from the car or via a WIFI hotspot on your phone you are out of luck...
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Maybe it has to do with the shielding in the car (windshield glass etc.,) that also interferes with EZPass type transponders? You may need to keep the windows and the sunroof open for best 4G reception for your phone :biggrin:
Roadrunner13
Member
I was never impressed with the iPhone5 hotspot capability, so I'd first blame that rather than the car's wifi stack.
The iPhone 6 was a net improvement but I don't know if we need to thank the new hardware or the later iOS version...
I didn't go back to try the latest iOS with the 'old' phone!
HankLloydRight
No Roads
No, it wasn't the phone losing LTE connection, it was the car not being able to hold a stable Wi-fi connection to the wi-fi hotspot my phone was providing inside the car. The LTE connection was stable and solid.
Maybe the WIFI antenna is outside the car? Isn't it supposed to be on the side view mirror or something like that?
SmartElectric
Active Member
Subject : Experience with Tesla service.
Today, Tesla came to our house at 8 AM and dropped off a loaner vehicle, and drove away with our CPO Tesla Model S85. They added the 85 badge to the back trunk, fixed a wind shield wiper issue (they were hitting too hard on the down stroke), checked on all maintenance items and cleaned and detailed the vehicle. At 5 PM they returned the car to our house and picked up the loaner.
Positives:
1. Having door to door service even though I am the second owner of the vehicle is a pleasant and welcome surprise.
2. There was no cost. The service person even refused a tip!
3. The P85 was excellent for giving rocket/test rides at work. Only two of 10 people got sick from the full throttle launches (on private property so there was no chance of a ticket). Seriously, actually sick.
4. The P85 was more car than I was expecting. I was able to even get it to "bunny hop" on one launch with the car fully loaded with passengers. I'm going to ask more about this hop, as I only experienced similar behaviour in my 1996 Camaro Z28, namely, that the car "hooks up" and then looses enough traction that when a fraction of a second later it hooks up again, the experience is "violent" (and amazing), basically thrown back in the seat very strongly.
5. Tesla did exactly what they promised on the service, and the loaner experience was extremely convenient.
6. The P85 had the "auto pilot" hardware, so I was able to test/demonstrate the radar cruise control, the lane departure warning and parking sensors and camera features. Very cool, my wife was a big fan of these newer safety features.
What I learned:
1. I am very happy with our 85, and the P85 "cured" me of wanting any more (for now). Next time, I'd like to try a dual motor AWD car to see how that handles.
2. Everyone who experiences the car is amazed, even those who are not "car people", and even one sceptic was "converted".
3. The P85 center display had more "lag" than our 85. It's possible that the fact I periodically (weekly) "reboot" our 85 may help reduce lag/delays on the screen. Our 85 never lags.
4. While our 85 is one year older, and driven 30000 km more than the newer more powerful loaner, the driving experience is very similar, and both cars were virtually identical to drive "normally".
Cheers!
Today, Tesla came to our house at 8 AM and dropped off a loaner vehicle, and drove away with our CPO Tesla Model S85. They added the 85 badge to the back trunk, fixed a wind shield wiper issue (they were hitting too hard on the down stroke), checked on all maintenance items and cleaned and detailed the vehicle. At 5 PM they returned the car to our house and picked up the loaner.
Positives:
1. Having door to door service even though I am the second owner of the vehicle is a pleasant and welcome surprise.
2. There was no cost. The service person even refused a tip!
3. The P85 was excellent for giving rocket/test rides at work. Only two of 10 people got sick from the full throttle launches (on private property so there was no chance of a ticket). Seriously, actually sick.
4. The P85 was more car than I was expecting. I was able to even get it to "bunny hop" on one launch with the car fully loaded with passengers. I'm going to ask more about this hop, as I only experienced similar behaviour in my 1996 Camaro Z28, namely, that the car "hooks up" and then looses enough traction that when a fraction of a second later it hooks up again, the experience is "violent" (and amazing), basically thrown back in the seat very strongly.
5. Tesla did exactly what they promised on the service, and the loaner experience was extremely convenient.
6. The P85 had the "auto pilot" hardware, so I was able to test/demonstrate the radar cruise control, the lane departure warning and parking sensors and camera features. Very cool, my wife was a big fan of these newer safety features.
What I learned:
1. I am very happy with our 85, and the P85 "cured" me of wanting any more (for now). Next time, I'd like to try a dual motor AWD car to see how that handles.
2. Everyone who experiences the car is amazed, even those who are not "car people", and even one sceptic was "converted".
3. The P85 center display had more "lag" than our 85. It's possible that the fact I periodically (weekly) "reboot" our 85 may help reduce lag/delays on the screen. Our 85 never lags.
4. While our 85 is one year older, and driven 30000 km more than the newer more powerful loaner, the driving experience is very similar, and both cars were virtually identical to drive "normally".
Cheers!
Holy Hell! You found the unicorn! P85 with Autopilot. Someone snatch that thing up now!!! :scared:
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