NTSB update for Autopilot has me looking for an anti-nag device

[CCopperpot]

It goes without saying that, obviously, people shouldn't use such devices to allow themselves to drive irresponsibly/distracted or without their hands on the wheel. Thats not what this thread is about. On the other hand... the autopilot barking with the new NTSB update is starting to get on my nerves to the point where I started to research DIY/retail anti-nag devices and ran across a small little module that sits behind one of the scroll wheels on the steering wheel and gives it input at random intervals (which is pretty much how I keep autopilot from barking in the first place).

This seems like a decent compromise to other solutions I've seen floating around (many of which seem downright dangerous to be using IMO). Is anyone using such a device? Its certainly a clever solution but I suspect it might be detectable by Tesla (depending on how the system is actually designed)

 

[diplomat33]

I get that people are frustrated at the increase in nags but anti-nag devices should never be used, period. It leads to complacency which will increase the chance of a crash. The whole point of the nags is to make sure you are paying attention because as good as you might think AP is, it is only L2. The fact is that AP might do zero interventions but it might also crash when it encounters a situation it cannot handle. So the driver must be prepared for that.

But if you don't like the nags, blame Tesla for implementing a poor driver monitoring system. Most other manufacturers offer true hands-free with no nags because they have a robust camera monitoring system to ensure the driver is supervising the car.

 

[CCopperpot]

I get that people are frustrated at the increase in nags but anti-nag devices should never be used, period. It leads to complacency which will increase the chance of a crash. The whole point of the nags is to make sure you are paying attention because as good as you might think AP is, it is only L2. The fact is that AP might do zero interventions but it might also crash when it encounters a situation it cannot handle. So the driver must be prepared for that.

But if you don't like the nags, blame Tesla for implementing a poor driver monitoring system. Most other manufacturers offer true hands-free with no nags because they have a robust camera monitoring system to ensure the driver is supervising the car.

Yeah I understand what you're saying but, the nag, while good intentioned, doesn't make me anymore aware of my surroundings or a better driver. It only forces me to take my eyes off the road/mirrors to look at the screen (Or I'm constantly fiddling with the scroll wheels to avoid the nag all together) ... On the flip side, I completely agree with you in that it can lead to complacency and I wouldn't want every Tesla (or other) driver using one since it CAN be abused by those with a death wish.

With that said, I'm still interested in this particular device despite agreeing with you lol I have no desire to try and get the car to behave like an L5, I'm just trying to turn off the annoyance.

 

[uscbucsfan]

Yeah I understand what you're saying but, the nag, while good intentioned, doesn't make me anymore aware of my surroundings or a better driver. It only forces me to take my eyes off the road/mirrors to look at the screen (Or I'm constantly fiddling with the scroll wheels to avoid the nag all together) ... On the flip side, I completely agree with you in that it can lead to complacency and I wouldn't want every Tesla (or other) driver using one since it CAN be abused by those with a death wish.

With that said, I'm still interested in this particular device despite agreeing with you lol I have no desire to try and get the car to behave like an L5, I'm just trying to turn off the annoyance.

Wheel weight will deliver strikes, but you're welcome to spend money on a strike.

 

[diplomat33]

Yeah I understand what you're saying but, the nag, while good intentioned, doesn't make me anymore aware of my surroundings or a better driver. It only forces me to take my eyes off the road/mirrors to look at the screen (Or I'm constantly fiddling with the scroll wheels to avoid the nag all together) ... On the flip side, I completely agree with you in that it can lead to complacency and I wouldn't want every Tesla (or other) driver using one since it CAN be abused by those with a death wish.

With that said, I'm still interested in this particular device despite agreeing with you lol I have no desire to try and get the car to behave like an L5, I'm just trying to turn off the annoyance.

I empathize. But if you do what Tesla says to do, you should not get too many nags. You will only get a lot of nags if you try to drive hands-free and look at the screen too much, which you should not be doing anyway since the system is L2.

I use one hand to turn the left scroll wheel randomly and I keep my eyes always on the road and I get very few nags. I don't need to look at the screen when it nags me. I can see in my peripheral vision that it is nagging me. I've learned to get used to turning the scroll wheel or tugging the wheel. It is a necessary evil. Yes, if I look at the screen for a second to change the music, I get a nag but I can easily dismiss the nag with the scroll wheel or a gentle tug on the steering wheel. I've learned to live with it.

 

[CCopperpot]

Wheel weight will deliver strikes, but you're welcome to spend money on a strike.

It's not a wheel weight. Those seem VERY dangerous IMO

What I'm talking about it essentially an emulator that randomly (or at a set interval) moves the scroll wheel up/down to eliminate the nag.

 

[uscbucsfan]

It's not a wheel weight. Those seem VERY dangerous IMO

What I'm talking about it essentially an emulator that randomly (or at a set interval) moves the scroll wheel up/down to eliminate the nag.

You want to go through all of that trouble to just not leave pressure on the wheel?

Again, good luck.

 

[diplomat33]

What I'm talking about it essentially an emulator that randomly (or at a set interval) moves the scroll wheel up/down to eliminate the nag.

And without the nags, will you really pay attention? I know people say they will. The fact is that everybody thinks that they will be the exception. But the reality is that without the nags, there is nothing to prevent you from getting complacent, looking at the screen, taking your hands off the wheel etc... And when AP goes say 100-200 miles on the highway without an intervention, it is easy to think that the system is reliable and let your guard down at the wrong moment. I had a moment myself when FSD beta was doing great, zero interventions for over an hour on the highway but then suddenly phantom braked for no reason and almost caused an accident. Luckily I had been paying attention with my hands on the wheel.

No offense but I feel like people who want these anti nag devices basically want to use AP in a way it is not intended to be used. They want to go hands-free and not have to scroll the wheel or tug the wheel. I get it. But that is how the Tesla system works.

 

[clydeiii]

Personally, I do not see much difference in nagging in the latest FSDb builds compared to previous. You just need to hold the wheel right and you'll never/hardly ever get a nag.

 

[SidetrackedSue]

1. Haven't got the update yet.

2. Had a new error message this week during highway driving on FSDb. The blue flash started then the audio. The driver had responded to the flash as usual (additional torque by the arm already in position through the wheel) but it didn't work and went to audio warning so at that point I'm watching the screen (driver is, you know, actually attentive so not looking at the screen.) Two warnings were coming up. The first was the pay attention. The second was a triangle with an exclamation point saying something like, "Defeat device detected."

We own no defeat device and have not updated the car in response to the recall but this was a new response to the driver's torque method that has been used for over 10K of highway driving on AP/EAP and then FSDb.

(Here's a reddit post with a picture of the same warning:

https://www.reddit.com/r/TeslaLounge/comments/zvtr0k

)

What pissed me off completely was that the warning appeared for a second then disappeared so while I was reading it to the driver, the driver didn't believe me that this was something new since it wasn't on the screen when they looked at the screen (and it didn't show up under the notifications when I pulled those up.) The effin design of the warning completely forces driver distraction in order to prevent driver distraction. If you are going to put messages on the screen, leave them there long enough to be read by the driver when they have a moment to glance over safely. Alternatively, build the effin car correctly, with a heads up display to eliminate the driver having to move head and adjust eye focus to read the warning AND put in a steering wheel sensor so that the car is warning for improper use of the L2 "fake self driving" not constantly throwing up false positives thus making defeat devices seem like the only solution to being able to use the driver assist feature one paid for.

 

[CCopperpot]

And without the nags, will you really pay attention? I know people say they will. The fact is that everybody thinks that they will be the exception. But the reality is that without the nags, there is nothing to prevent you from getting complacent, looking at the screen, taking your hands off the wheel etc... And when AP goes say 100-200 miles on the highway without an intervention, it is easy to think that the system is reliable and let your guard down at the wrong moment. I had a similar moment myself when FSD beta was doing great on the highway but then suddenly phantom braked for no reason and almost caused an accident if I had not been paying attention with my hands on the wheel.

No offense but I feel like people who want these anti nag devices basically want to use AP in a way it is not intended to be used. They want to go hands-free and not have to scroll the wheel or tug the wheel. I get it. But that is how the Tesla system works.

No offense taken at all. I understand what you're saying and completely agree with you. I wouldn't feel safe, for example, letting my wife or family use my car with this device for all of the reasons you stated

I've also experienced AP freaking out and nearly getting me into an accident at a lane merge in the past so I def don't trust it.

 

[CCopperpot]

What pissed me off completely was that the warning appeared for a second then disappeared so while I was reading it to the driver, the driver didn't believe me that this was something new since it wasn't on the screen when they looked at the screen (and it didn't show up under the notifications when I pulled those up.) The effin design of the warning completely forces driver distraction in order to prevent driver distraction. If you are going to put messages on the screen, leave them there long enough to be read by the driver when they have a moment to glance over safely. Alternatively, build the effin car correctly, with a heads up display to eliminate the driver having to move head and adjust eye focus to read the warning AND put in a steering wheel sensor so that the car is warning for improper use of the L2 "fake self driving" not constantly throwing up false positives thus making defeat devices seem like the only solution to being able to use the driver assist feature one paid for.

Amen!

 

[diplomat33]

I wish Tesla had gone with a better camera monitoring system sooner. Then we could have the more hands-free experience that we want. I remember Elon was asked about it in an interview and he said a camera monitoring system would be a waste of time to implement because FSD would not need supervision in 6 months. That interview was like 2 years ago now. Later, Tesla finally did implement a camera monitoring system since FSD still requires active driver supervision. The problem is that Tesla had to make due with the in cabin camera that is not placed correctly for that use. A good driver monitoring system should use a camera placed in front of the driver between the steering wheel.

 

[ATPMSD]

Is it really that hard to just hang your relaxed hand on the steering wheel? I do this all the time and have no issues.

 

[Big Earl]

It goes without saying that, obviously, people shouldn't use such devices to allow themselves to drive irresponsibly/distracted or without their hands on the wheel. Thats not what this thread is about. On the other hand... the autopilot barking with the new NTSB update is starting to get on my nerves to the point where I started to research DIY/retail anti-nag devices and ran across a small little module that sits behind one of the scroll wheels on the steering wheel and gives it input at random intervals (which is pretty much how I keep autopilot from barking in the first place).

This seems like a decent compromise to other solutions I've seen floating around (many of which seem downright dangerous to be using IMO). Is anyone using such a device? Its certainly a clever solution but I suspect it might be detectable by Tesla (depending on how the system is actually designed)

The NHTSA update basically wants you to have a hand on the wheel for the majority of the time. You can get away with a lot of screen poking and looking around as long as you have a hand on the wheel. People have gotten used to acknowledging nags with a scroll wheel adjustment or a quick grab of the wheel, then going back to hands-off until the next nag. The new update is very intolerant of this practice, and the best course of action is to get yourself in the habit of just holding the wheel (which is how you're supposed to use the system in the first place).

 

[byeLT4]

Like someone above said, it's just the second you take your eyes off the road you get that warning. Tesla, you are the one that put the screen with the AC controls on it, forcing us to look (voice only works soso) and then you punish us for doing so. I can set the speed and seat vent fairly quickly (3-5 seconds) but nope, takes longer now because I have to look back at the road, tug the wheel (at the same time or it doesn't count) and then go back to setting the AC. Yesterday I just let it beep at me after deactivating and kept my foot on the throttle because, well, just because. After 10 or so minutes it starts the hazards up
I'll get my last strike on the way to work here in a few minutes I'm sure. Batter up!

 

[Big Earl]

Like someone above said, it's just the second you take your eyes off the road you get that warning. Tesla, you are the one that put the screen with the AC controls on it, forcing us to look (voice only works soso) and then you punish us for doing so. I can set the speed and seat vent fairly quickly (3-5 seconds) but nope, takes longer now because I have to look back at the road, tug the wheel (at the same time or it doesn't count) and then go back to setting the AC. Yesterday I just let it beep at me after deactivating and kept my foot on the throttle because, well, just because. After 10 or so minutes it starts the hazards up
I'll get my last strike on the way to work here in a few minutes I'm sure. Batter up!

Change your approach. Instead of tugging at the wheel, just hold it. You can poke at the screen for a long time if you're holding the wheel.

 

[SabrToothSqrl]

It's not a wheel weight. Those seem VERY dangerous IMO

What I'm talking about it essentially an emulator that randomly (or at a set interval) moves the scroll wheel up/down to eliminate the nag.

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256806180178293.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.main.3.7168Dyx0Dyx0Sb&algo_pvid=7dc69d7f-e76e-4a5d-b3ec-eaa30f667b41&algo_exp_id=7dc69d7f-e76e-4a5d-b3ec-eaa30f667b41-1&pdp_npi=4%40dis%21USD%2161.67%2130.83%21%21%21439.87%21219.93%21%402103255a17061256312997754e37c0%2112000036918671446%21sea%21US%213998103833%21&curPageLogUid=vwGxkIVai2yb&utparam-url=scene%3Asearch%7Cquery_from%3A

 

[CCopperpot]

Is it really that hard to just hang your relaxed hand on the steering wheel? I do this all the time and have no issues.

I do and still get nagged.

The two fool proof ways I've found to stop the nagging is to either put constant torque on the wheel (almost fighting against the AP without giving it too much to actually knock it out of AP) or to occasionally articulate the scroll wheels every few seconds.

 

[CCopperpot]

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256806180178293.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.main.3.7168Dyx0Dyx0Sb&algo_pvid=7dc69d7f-e76e-4a5d-b3ec-eaa30f667b41&algo_exp_id=7dc69d7f-e76e-4a5d-b3ec-eaa30f667b41-1&pdp_npi=4%40dis%21USD%2161.67%2130.83%21%21%21439.87%21219.93%21%402103255a17061256312997754e37c0%2112000036918671446%21sea%21US%213998103833%21&curPageLogUid=vwGxkIVai2yb&utparam-url=scene%3Asearch%7Cquery_from%3A

Yup, thats the device.

Evooor also carries it and has a new one for the Highland M3 (in case anyone was interested)

Model 3/Y Autopilot Nag Elimination Module For Tesla, Steering Wheel

Compared with the weight ring, this module can not only eliminate noise, but also set the automatic driving time interval without affecting the appearance of t

www.evooor.com

I'm a bit confused about the hit or miss reviews, but I'll report back if I order one if anyone cares to know how it went