Ontario EV Rebates Cancelled July 11, 2018

[T3l5aFan]

We are paying cash and no VIN yet.

Early reservation and paying cash. Still no VIN either.

 

[haromaem]

I suggest you do a poll - much easier to track numbers. E.g.

After the new Ford government cancelled the EHVIP program, I:

1. Cancelled and purchased an ICE
2. Cancelled and purchased another EV or Hybrid
3. Proceeded with my Tesla order anyway
4. Am awaiting news about rebate and will probably cancel soon
5. Am awaiting news about rebate and will probably proceed soon
6. Am deferring until a less expensive Tesla is available (e.g. SR)

Likely #5 considering how much we spend in gas (our biggest motivator)

 

[NoBeard]

What does this mean for the EV rebate? Possible revival for a period of time?

As others have pointed out in this forum, quite correctly...
Cap and Trade funded the EHVIP, it wasn't linked, just where the cash was being spent.

Even if the new Government pulled their heads out of their asses and realized the nearly $3 BBBillion hole they've put themselves in can't be Doug out of and they have to leave it as is until 2020... that's no guarantee that they'd reinstate the EHVIP.
Given that DF has repeatedly expressed contempt for all of you MMMMillionaires taking money from the pockets of the people, and he could just recycle the money straight into reducing the tax on gas by reducing the HST on gas and fulfill half his promise, it's much more likely that the moron in charge would choose that route.
Pretty sure that it's the case regardless of which route to victory for Cap and Trade, no victory for EHVIP.

Sad, Sickening, True.

 

[Bytor]

I guess I'm a mixture of 4 and 5! Reserved May 1 and configured June 27 RWD.

I'm in the 'a rep will contact you within 48 hours' group at this point...48 hours has passed days ago...

Really love the car and have tried to rationalize why it is worth the extra 14K bringing me to the 75K taxes in mark but I really am having trouble losing the rebate. Yes I went in thinking I may not have a chance but Doug's methodology of excluding tesla is infuriating!

Also have not been impressed with tesla's seemingly lack of preparedness in dealing with this situation in terms of communication-sorry, love the brand but we live in a world where communication facets are numerous-send me an email, text, smoke signals, whatever and let me know what's going on!

Anyhow gonna sit on the fence a bit longer and check out the used market for hybrids...Porsche Cayenne Hybrid is kinda nice...

 

[WXYZ]

I'm probably 5, but still need to decide what other personal sacrifices are required to manage the extra cost.

Reserved April 2, 2016
Ordered May 27, 2018
First production configuration, red, aero, EAP
No VIN or contact from Tesla.

I'm getting screwed harder than most.
For one, I was told 4-8 weeks for delivery when I ordered. If that was true I would have qualified for the incentive up to 6.5 weeks into the 8 week time frame. 8 weeks has expired and my account shows Aug-Oct which is 3-5 months from purchase. I understand all the reasons why I can't blame Tesla, but I think my frustration is justified.
For two, I made the purchase when the Liberals were still in office...before the election...before PC was voted in...before the clock started ticking for Doug Ford to cancel the program.
Thanks for letting me vent. I love the company and I love the car, but unfortunately the twinkle in my eye at the thought of buying a Tesla is not as bright as it once was. I'm hopeful my feelings will change after a few crisp 0-100km/h sprints.

 

[felixculpas]

As others have pointed out in this forum, quite correctly...
Cap and Trade funded the EHVIP, it wasn't linked, just where the cash was being spent.

Even if the new Government pulled their heads out of their asses and realized the nearly $3 BBBillion hole they've put themselves in can't be Doug out of and they have to leave it as is until 2020... that's no guarantee that they'd reinstate the EHVIP.
Given that DF has repeatedly expressed contempt for all of you MMMMillionaires taking money from the pockets of the people, and he could just recycle the money straight into reducing the tax on gas by reducing the HST on gas and fulfill half his promise, it's much more likely that the moron in charge would choose that route.
Pretty sure that it's the case regardless of which route to victory for Cap and Trade, no victory for EHVIP.

Sad, Sickening, True.

That's my take on it all as well - though you might find there are some restrictions on how Ford would be able to spend the funds and gas costs might not be allowed but certainly I could see him keeping it away from programs he's already cut as that would be doubly embarrassing.

Can't help but wonder what exactly the reason for not introducing the bill to cancel cap and trade would be. Perhaps CELA's request for review and/or the Ombudsman has caught their attention. I suspect the former as it has probably activated people on many different levels as well as taking heat from the other parties during the summer session.

Really impressed by how Schriener hasn't pulled any punches.

I don't think Ford necessarily understood the breadth and depth to which he would be opposed, nor the nuances of the issues at hand. As one previous article pointed out, electioneering is the easy part. Maybe he's going to find out just how strong his base really is...or was. Yet how he could possibly wiggle out of this one and back peddle...can only come out looking pretty lame except to his hardcore followers if he has to amend his position on cap and trade. I see no easy way out for him having run so strongly on removing it.

It's really a shame we couldn't have a Premier that was dedicated to reducing the deficit while playing a PROGRESSIVE role in programs and changes that lead to GHG reduction and a cleaner environment. Oh, and knew something about provincial politics.

 

[felixculpas]

I'm probably 5, but still need to decide what other personal sacrifices are required to manage the extra cost.

Reserved April 2, 2016
Ordered May 27, 2018
First production configuration, red, aero, EAP
No VIN or contact from Tesla.

I'm getting screwed harder than most.
For one, I was told 4-8 weeks for delivery when I ordered. If that was true I would have qualified for the incentive up to 6.5 weeks into the 8 week time frame. 8 weeks has expired and my account shows Aug-Oct which is 3-5 months from purchase. I understand all the reasons why I can't blame Tesla, but I think my frustration is justified.
For two, I made the purchase when the Liberals were still in office...before the election...before PC was voted in...before the clock started ticking for Doug Ford to cancel the program.
Thanks for letting me vent. I love the company and I love the car, but unfortunately the twinkle in my eye at the thought of buying a Tesla is not as bright as it once was. I'm hopeful my feelings will change after a few crisp 0-100km/h sprints.

Frustration is allowed and justified. Stay tuned for the results of Samina's work with the Ombudsman and potential next steps.

Don't get mad...get even

 

[Abrew2014]

I guess I'm a mixture of 4 and 5! Reserved May 1 and configured June 27 RWD.

I'm in the 'a rep will contact you within 48 hours' group at this point...48 hours has passed days ago...

Really love the car and have tried to rationalize why it is worth the extra 14K bringing me to the 75K taxes in mark but I really am having trouble losing the rebate. Yes I went in thinking I may not have a chance but Doug's methodology of excluding tesla is infuriating!

Also have not been impressed with tesla's seemingly lack of preparedness in dealing with this situation in terms of communication-sorry, love the brand but we live in a world where communication facets are numerous-send me an email, text, smoke signals, whatever and let me know what's going on!

Anyhow gonna sit on the fence a bit longer and check out the used market for hybrids...Porsche Cayenne Hybrid is kinda nice...

Almost exact same page for me, really don’t want to cancel, waiting for any communication from Tesla to convince me to stay but nothing yet, my only side note is I’m concerned about the possibility of another incentive being created short term (federal) since we are getting close to the buy votes for election timing.

 

[Amandeep]

How many of you are planning to cancel? I received a call from the Ombudsman.... they are working on it. Also, if I can get an estimate on number of consumers in this predicament, I’m going to see if we can go the judiciary review (for a class action). I’ll have more info on that tomorrow.

In the meantime it will be helpful to know how many of you are sitting the fence and even if you have got the car, you would otherwise have qualified?

I am in the same boat..........sitting on the fence :-(

 

[Amandeep]

I suggest you do a poll - much easier to track numbers. E.g.

After the new Ford government cancelled the EHVIP program, I:

1. Cancelled and purchased an ICE
2. Cancelled and purchased another EV or Hybrid
3. Proceeded with my Tesla order anyway
4. Am awaiting news about rebate and will probably cancel soon
5. Am awaiting news about rebate and will probably proceed soon
6. Am deferring until a less expensive Tesla is available (e.g. SR)

4. for me

 

[Amandeep]

Ontario’s bill to scrap cap-and-trade may not come this summer

TORONTO — Ontario’s new government says its bill to repeal cap-and-trade may be slower out of the gate than first promised.

The government hasn’t yet introduced the legislation that would unwind the carbon market implemented by the previous government, even though it was one of the top three reasons for calling the rare summer session.

House Leader Todd Smith told reporters two weeks ago the Tories would “strike the Liberal cap-and-trade tax law from the books and repeal any legislation that would enable a future government to impose a cap-and-trade carbon tax in the future.”

On Tuesday he told reporters that’s now uncertain.

[READ MORE: Top Trudeau advisor slams Ford on cap-and-trade]

“I know the minister is working diligently on making sure that legislation gets prepared and we’re not exactly sure how long we’re going to be sitting so those balls are still in the air,” Smith said.

The government says any change in timeline won’t change its plans to scrap cap-and-trade, which Smith called a “Liberal mess.”

His statements though are at odds with those of his colleague Environment Minister Rod Phillips who yesterday and today maintained that his bill would still be tabled in this sitting.

So far the government hasn’t said how, or if, it will compensate companies who paid into the market. Ontario has brought in $2.9 billion in revenues from cap-and-trade. Much of it was going to repairs and retrofits for schools and social housing. The cash was also used for rebates to businesses and homeowners who upgraded their properties to make them more energy efficient.

[READ MORE: Abrupt scrapping of cap-and-trade in Ontario sparking anxiety for businesses]

Green Party Leader Mike Schreiner said the government would have been better off to follow the exit clauses set out in the cap-and-trade agreement with California and Quebec. That plan called for one year’s notice before leaving the market and suggested that any exit should be tied to the end of a compliance period — the current one ends in 2020.

“If they’d actually followed the agreement we could avoid the headaches and the potential legal actions and the financial risks that the people of Ontario are exposed to by the reckless actions of this government,” Schreiner said.

[READ MORE: Ontario’s fiscal watchdog to probe the cancellation of cap and trade]

He accused the government of not having a plan for cap-and-trade. When “you try to govern on back of the napkin promises you make mistakes,” Schreiner said.

What does it means for us?

 

[felixculpas]

My intent in posting it isn't to convey there's any direct meaning but it's certainly related. Perhaps someone else can offer some insights.

Personally, it appears they might be a little over their heads. I'm sure there's some very serious discussions going on. It could really become a bit of a hot potato for them and if they screw it up, the optics are potentially very damaging.

If they really are feeling the heat on this, I could see them taking Schreiner's advice and ending it at the end of this compliance period - 2020. That way they still get to say they are doing what they proposed and spin it as saving a ton of dough.

As we've posed - even if that happened, I think he'd be unlikely to use the funds generated for anything but environmental initiatives but likely avoid anything related to the old GreenON or EHVIP incentives.

There's no way to tell what it means for sure yet. If he took Schreiner's advice, we'd have a clear plan till 2020 and maybe that would prompt the feds to then step up to the plate with some incentives. I think it's quite possible but I wouldn't bet on it.

Short term though...it doesn't mean much. They might just be re-grouping and digging their heels in and coming up with a more devious plan that circumvents and deflects any of the heat they are currently taking.

Hopefully something will break before the long weekend. I think we'll have a much clearer picture by then.

 

[haromaem]

Kind of odd but some threads have been deleted. See my screenshot and can anyone find the July 6 thread?

 

[felixculpas]

Moderator merged threads into this one.

 

[deltav]

How many of you are planning to cancel? I received a call from the Ombudsman.... they are working on it. Also, if I can get an estimate on number of consumers in this predicament, I’m going to see if we can go the judiciary review (for a class action). I’ll have more info on that tomorrow.

In the meantime it will be helpful to know how many of you are sitting the fence and even if you have got the car, you would otherwise have qualified?

I will cancel if there are no rebates. I am sitting on the fence. If Tesla calls and says either buy or cancel. I would have to cancel at that point.

 

[haromaem]

Moderator merged threads into this one.

Thanks.

 

[felixculpas]

Also in terms of timelines for Tesla deliveries, they did announce today new delivery windows for new orders. It's been 1-3 months the past while but is now apparently 2-4 months. This is making some a little nervous in the USA as they see the end of the $7500 tax rebate coming. How this might affect CDN orders, I'm not sure.

 

[lscalzo]

Here is a google form. It will be easier to track the responses.

EV Rebate Cancellation Poll

Here is the response sheet

EV POLL (Responses)

 

[haromaem]

Here is a google form. It will be easier to track the responses.

EV Rebate Cancellation Poll

Here is the response sheet

EV POLL (Responses)

Thanks for putting this together. Good to get an idea of numbers

 

[pcons]

Here is a google form. It will be easier to track the responses.

EV Rebate Cancellation Poll

Here is the response sheet

EV POLL (Responses)

Good idea, will be interesting to see the numbers pan out. Currently 3/9 say going ahead with purchase anyway, and 3/9 say will likely proceed and 3/9 say will likely cancel. If I had to guess I would have figured about that raio, ie 20-30% of people cancel their orders. Will be interesting when there are more responses as I believe a lot of people will end up waiting for SR. I expect that to be a long wait though because it seems a lot of people are waiting for that, so hopefully they ramp up production and dont end up with 6 month + wait times.

Not that 6 months wait time would be unheard of with EVs. I believe Bolts are something like 8 months right now and Leafs are also multiple months last I heard...so to be honest, 1-3 months for a model 3 AWD seems pretty decent from where I'm sitting