Original owners of 2012/2013 Model S w/ 85 kWh pack: Has your main pack been replaced?

[AmpedRealtor]

My 2013 P85 battery/DU warranty expires in August. I am still on my original pack that has had no issues, but I am reading stories of out of warranty pack replacements costing north of $20,000. I am trying to gauge how many original owners of cars of my vintage have had their packs replaced.

My dilemma is whether to keep the car past warranty, and roll the dice on the battery (and DU, of which I've had 5), or sell the car and apply those funds to a new Model 3/Y. My out of pocket on that will be roughly equal to the cost of a new 85 kWh pack out of warranty.

Advice?

 

[Watts_Up]

I imagine that you watched one of the recent Bjørn Nyland video:

I bought back my 2013 Tesla Model S P85​

I think he mentioned that the battery was replaced once.

 

[omarsultan]

Hey @AmpedRealtor -- we got our cars at about the same time (mine was delivered in July 2013). I loved my P85 but just sold it because I did not want to own it w/o a drivetrain warranty. I had my pack replaced this time last year (at ~136K miles) because of excessive degradation (>30%). Given the pack was a reman B-pack, I was not sure how long it would last. The rear DU has also progressively been getting noisier--still within spec per Tesla service, but again, did not want to be on the hook for a DU repair/replacement out of pocket.

I can understand the desire to hold on to the car--and I thought about it--but I know I would not forgive myself if I was suddenly on the hook for $30K of repairs to keep it running.

 

[Electric700]

Until Tesla starts offering out of warranty main battery fixes, you should be able to work with a company such as Services | Black Screen | Roadster Battery | Gruber Motors on battery repairs. Hopefully most if not all main battery issues can be fixed for less than $1,000 by companies such as these.

I would be interested to know the cost of Tesla's drive unit repair service, out of warranty. You might not really even need to go to a third-party company for that if the price is low enough.

 

[eugenetk]

My 2013 P85 has 28k miles, and the HV battery is currently being replaced for the first time. I'm deciding whether to sell it / trade it in before the 1yr replacement battery warranty expires as well.

 

[Lupester35]

My 2012 MS P85 has 50k miles on it. Not sure if it is related (although I'm starting to really to suspect) but after the last software update about a week ago, I'm now having problems charging at home w/ 240V 40A. The car is frequently being interrupted, stating that the max amperage is being reduced and that the car requires service. I'm extremely scared as looking through forums some people are saying that I most likely need a new battery! This car is out of warranty since August 2020. But again, it only has 50k miles!! Worth noting, I purchased this car used in April 2020 w/ 40k miles. Guess I should have done more research on old/used Teslas. Assuming the worst (needing of a new, expensive battery pack), might anyone have any idea of the best way to rid myself of this car??? Thx.

 

[omarsultan]

My 2012 MS P85 has 50k miles on it. Not sure if it is related (although I'm starting to really to suspect) but after the last software update about a week ago, I'm now having problems charging at home w/ 240V 40A. The car is frequently being interrupted, stating that the max amperage is being reduced and that the car requires service. I'm extremely scared as looking through forums some people are saying that I most likely need a new battery! This car is out of warranty since August 2020. But again, it only has 50k miles!! Worth noting, I purchased this car used in April 2020 w/ 40k miles. Guess I should have done more research on old/used Teslas. Assuming the worst (needing of a new, expensive battery pack), might anyone have any idea of the best way to rid myself of this car??? Thx.

I'd be surprised if those were issues with the main pack--more likely an issue with your power to the charger or the charging subsystem. Every once in a while they tweak how sensitive the car is to less than pristine power and it causes issues. If you others like the car, I'd suggest the $200 drag fee from Tesla service to see what the issue is, they migth even be able to check remotely.

 

[Brass Guy]

I haven't voted yet because mine's in the shop for a replacement now. They've had it 3 weeks so far.
I consider myself lucky that it happened in the beginning of its 8th year (Oct 2020 when the symptoms started), as well as being able to limp along until a loaner was available.

Unlucky however to have to lose V8 interface.

 

[random155]

I appreciate this post because I have a 2014 that will be out of battery / DU warranty within a year. I really like this car but I am scared to death of an out of warranty battery replacement. As much as I want to keep it, my gut tells me to sell before the warranty expires. I live in NJ so I dont have any local non-Tesla repair options.

 

[AmpedRealtor]

Thanks for the thoughtful replies. While the poll isn't scientific, obviously, it looks like a 50/50 split. Those are not great odds. It seems fair to assume I have a better than 50/50 chance of needing to replace the battery in the next 3-5 years based on what I'm reading, or at least have it repaired. There seems to be only one place nationally that can properly service Tesla batteries (Gruber) and that makes me feel a little uneasy.

If I buy a M3/Y, will I feel this way again in 4 years? Assuming the Model 3/Y are not experiencing anywhere close to what we have experienced with regards to battery and drive unit problems.

 

[Lupester35]

I'd be surprised if those were issues with the main pack--more likely an issue with your power to the charger or the charging subsystem. Every once in a while they tweak how sensitive the car is to less than pristine power and it causes issues. If you others like the car, I'd suggest the $200 drag fee from Tesla service to see what the issue is, they migth even be able to check remotely.

So I dropped of my car at the Tesla SC yesterday. They are currently diagnosing the issue (at a cost of $155/hr). I brought up the 'coincidental timing' of the issue appearing right after the latest software update. Not surprisingly they said that they're sure if had/has nothing to do with it. I'll respond when I know more...

 

[Electric700]

So I dropped of my car at the Tesla SC yesterday. They are currently diagnosing the issue (at a cost of $155/hr). I brought up the 'coincidental timing' of the issue appearing right after the latest software update. Not surprisingly they said that they're sure if had/has nothing to do with it. I'll respond when I know more...

Sorry to see you're having trouble with your Tesla. I hope it's something simple.

Thanks for the thoughtful replies. While the poll isn't scientific, obviously, it looks like a 50/50 split. Those are not great odds. It seems fair to assume I have a better than 50/50 chance of needing to replace the battery in the next 3-5 years based on what I'm reading, or at least have it repaired. There seems to be only one place nationally that can properly service Tesla batteries (Gruber) and that makes me feel a little uneasy.

If I buy a M3/Y, will I feel this way again in 4 years? Assuming the Model 3/Y are not experiencing anywhere close to what we have experienced with regards to battery and drive unit problems.

I think the latest Model 3 and Y along with the other Tesla vehicles have benefitted from years of improvements in all aspects, so am really hoping that the main pack and other components last well beyond 15 or even 20 years. This will help the brand image overall, combined with simplified component replacement when required (including at the battery cell / module level). The more reliable and longer lasting, the better.

 

[Lupester35]

Sorry to see you're having trouble with your Tesla. I hope it's something simple.





I think the latest Model 3 and Y along with the other Tesla vehicles have benefitted from years of improvements in all aspects, so am really hoping that the main pack and other components last well beyond 15 or even 20 years. This will help the brand image overall, combined with simplified component replacement when required (including at the battery cell / module level). The more reliable and longer lasting, the better.

I'd be surprised if those were issues with the main pack--more likely an issue with your power to the charger or the charging subsystem. Every once in a while they tweak how sensitive the car is to less than pristine power and it causes issues. If you others like the car, I'd suggest the $200 drag fee from Tesla service to see what the issue is, they migth even be able to check remotely.

Update: For my charging issue, it did turned out to be an onboard charge(r) issue. I was unaware of this but my 2012 P85 Performance w/ 50k miles (not sure what other cars/years are the same) has '2' onboard chargers - an 80A and a 40A. Well it looks like the 80A went bad. Couldn't really understand the SC tech's explanation of how/why the charging system defaults to the 80A one (when I choose/use 240V/40A level 2 charging at home) but he went on to say that they could simply rewire the charging system so that it uses the 40A alone OR pay $2700 for a new 80A charger. I chose to risk it and run off the lone 40A charger for now. I'll be looking at one of the third-party extended warranty/repair plans or possibly just upgrading to a newer Tesla with an active warranty. Anyway, just wanted to follow up with what happened in my case. Total cost was $310 for diagnosis (2hrs at $155/hr).

 

[omarsultan]

Update: For my charging issue, it did turn out to be an onboard charge(r) issue. I was unaware of this but my 2012 P85 Performance w/ 50k miles (not sure what other cars/years are the same) has '2' onboard chargers - an 80A and a 40A. Well it looks like the 80A went bad. Couldn't really understand the SC tech's explanation of how/why the charging system defaults to the 80A one (when I choose/use 240V/40A level 2 charging at home) but he went on to say that they could simply rewire the charging system so that it uses the 40A alone OR pay $2700 for a new 80A charger. I chose to risk it and run off the lone 40A charger for now. I'll be looking at one of the third-party extended warranty/repair plans or possibly just upgrading to a newer Tesla with an active warranty. Anyway, just wanted to follow up with what happened in my case. Total cost was $310 for diagnosis (2hrs at $155/hr).

Cool.

So those cars originally came with a 40A on-board charger standard and you had an option at add a second 40A charge to give you 80A of total charging capacity (I had this on my '13 P85). Taking you back to a single 40A charger is a good solution and not a hack--its how your car was originally designed.

Enjoy your car

 

[XCare EV]

Cool.

So those cars originally came with a 40A on-board charger standard and you had an option at add a second 40A charge to give you 80A of total charging capacity (I had this on my '13 P85). Taking you back to a single 40A charger is a good solution and not a hack--its how your car was originally designed.

Enjoy your car

Great knowledgeable reply. Respect.

 

[Lupester35]

Cool.

So those cars originally came with a 40A on-board charger standard and you had an option at add a second 40A charge to give you 80A of total charging capacity (I had this on my '13 P85). Taking you back to a single 40A charger is a good solution and not a hack--its how your car was originally designed.

Enjoy your car

Can't say that I'm enjoying my car (in the piece of mind sense). I bought it used with only a few months of the warranty left. Really wish I had done more research on Teslas and their actual long term quality and costs of repair (specifically on expensive parts like the drive unit and battery pack). I see that you make mention of your '13 P85 but in your description mention a Model X and '21 MS (ordered). May I ask, do you still have your '13 P85? Have you sold it (or plan to)? How did you fair in regards to quality and repair costs? Thanks in advance for your time.

 

[omarsultan]

I just sold it a month ago via Carvana. I loved the car, even 8 years later, but did not want to own it outside of the battery/drive train warranty. Big ticket items that needed to be repaired:

• Drive unit, for excessive noise @ ~10K miles, under warranty
• DC-DC contactor @ ~40K miles, under warranty
• Driver's side door handle @ ~90K miles, under warranty
• On-board DC charger replacement @ ~105K miles, ~$2,500 (essentially the same issue you had)
• Passenger's side door handle @ ~110K miles, ~$250
• HV battery pack @ ~136K for > 30% degradation, under warranty

I will point out that are 3rd-party shops that will do repairs of the drive unit and battery packs now, which can significantly reduce cost of repairs. Check with your local Tesla Owners Club and or search these forums for details.

 

[Rocky_H]

I was glad I waited a bit to not get a 2012 or 2013 car, but I ordered in January 2014 and got delivery in March 2014, as I felt they were through some of the growing pains, and I feel pretty good with the lack of sizeable repairs. (My wife sees it differently, because she compares it to our no-frills Honda Civic transportation appliance, which obviously never has any issues.) I did, of course have the drive unit replaced as they went through the entire fleet replacing them for that buzzing noise from the pitted bearings to change them to the ceramic ones. But other than that, no need for battery or charger or charge port replacements.

Things I did have:
2 door handles I think. One was just barely after warranty, and they good willed that. The other was longer after, so I paid.
Rear window motor regulator, covered in warranty.
Suspension thing they did as a service bulletin in warranty.
And then the old Baolong tire pressure sensors stopped working right, so I decided to go ahead and do the upgrade to the Continental system.
Touchscreen got the bubbles fortunately soon enough it was still in warranty. So at the same convenient time to save labor cost, I got the LTE upgrade.

And I'm still using my original UMC!

 

[DGates]

My Model S 85 is from October 2013. I'm on my 3rd pack now. Original pack failed and was replaced in July 2018 (81,904 km). That pack has now just been replaced yesterday with a 90 kWh pack. I'm at 149,419 km currently.

I'm also trying to decide whether to keep this car out of warranty. In the last 4 months I've had tons of electrical problems. The chargeport, on-board charger, TPMS, DC to DC converter, headlights all failed. Finally just a few days ago the HV battery failed. Car had to be towed 3 times. I have the ESA and each of those issues cost me a deductible, as they happened several weeks apart. I would get the car back from service, then something else would fail. Probably root cause of all these electrical failure was the HV battery all along, so now that it has finally been replaced (under warranty), maybe the car will be good for more than 3 weeks without something new failing on me.

Model S refresh are sure looking nice about now...

 

[Lupester35]

I just sold it a month ago via Carvana. I loved the car, even 8 years later, but did not want to own it outside of the battery/drive train warranty. Big ticket items that needed to be repaired:

• Drive unit, for excessive noise @ ~10K miles, under warranty
• DC-DC contactor @ ~40K miles, under warranty
• Driver's side door handle @ ~90K miles, under warranty
• On-board DC charger replacement @ ~105K miles, ~$2,500 (essentially the same issue you had)
• Passenger's side door handle @ ~110K miles, ~$250
• HV battery pack @ ~136K for > 30% degradation, under warranty

I will point out that are 3rd-party shops that will do repairs of the drive unit and battery packs now, which can significantly reduce cost of repairs. Check with your local Tesla Owners Club and or search these forums for details.

Can I ask what you got for your '13 Tesla (w/ details (i.e., miles, options))? Did it take awhile (being that your warranty was pretty much over) to sell? Mine is the 'first edition' '12 MS w/ 50kmi Performance Version (pretty much all the upgrades except the moon roof). A purchased the car last April at 40kmi for $35k. Out of curiosity I inquired what Tesla would offer me -- they offered $25k.