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rincewind

Member
Nov 5, 2019
504
273
London England
I'm going to play devils advocate a little here. When I first got the car about 14 months ago, I was quite excited at the thought of the car continuously improving itself via OTA updates. I told my mates about it, they nodded in agreement. Now I'm not so sure. Yes, Netflix was added and I thought 'oooh good' , but I've probably only used it 3/4 times as I don't do many long journeys necessitating supercharger stops. Apart from that, I can't think of much that is positive about the last 12 months worth of updates, which don't seem to have radically improved the car - still get phantom braking and the wipers, although better, still whizz across the screen for no apparent reason.

In fact, I was one of those that was more than a little upset by the recent update that introduced all the white space, squashed up the maps and music screen, put the 'Hold' icon where I can't see it unless I move my head to the left, made the font sizes smaller and made the regen and power bar really hard to see the dots (yes, I am 'of an age').

So, overall, I will say that I wish the last years worth of updates hadn't happened.

...Stands back and waits for the outrage...
 

Dilly

Active Member
Feb 24, 2020
1,478
1,098
Norfolk
I think I’m with you on that. There was an air of excitement with each new update. But a lot of updates have brought little by way of meaningful improvement. The Christmas update being a huge letdown. The UI is now pretty dreadful as you say.
The 2021 updates seem to be nought but splintered bug fixes.
To be fair, some of the earlier updates had some sensible tweaks. It wasn’t quite all gloom and doom.
There is still a lot of work to be done and I’m not sure that it will be until FSD has been sorted
 

Glan gluaisne

Supporting Member
Sep 11, 2019
2,782
2,689
UK
I agree 100%. Had I known that a recent update would render the speed display so much more difficult to see, and hide most of the light icons, the hold icon etc from view, I would have refused to install it.

For me, the failings introduced through software bugs and changes have now annoyed me enough that I'm getting rid of the car and changing to something that I hope may be a bit more consistent. I can live with things being permanently sub-optimal. it's really the random way that things change and fail with Tesla updates that irritates me. Headlights are are good example. Three times now updates have caused the headlights to point skywards, for no apparent reason. Last night I ended up roughly adjusting them yet again, and will need to pay my third visit to the local garage to get them realigned properly. I've never owned a car where the lights need to be regularly realigned like this, it's just barking mad.
 

Dilly

Active Member
Feb 24, 2020
1,478
1,098
Norfolk
I agree 100%. Had I known that a recent update would render the speed display so much more difficult to see, and hide most of the light icons, the hold icon etc from view, I would have refused to install it.

For me, the failings introduced through software bugs and changes have now annoyed me enough that I'm getting rid of the car and changing to something that I hope may be a bit more consistent. I can live with things being permanently sub-optimal. it's really the random way that things change and fail with Tesla updates that irritates me. Headlights are are good example. Three times now updates have caused the headlights to point skywards, for no apparent reason. Last night I ended up roughly adjusting them yet again, and will need to pay my third visit to the local garage to get them realigned properly. I've never owned a car where the lights need to be regularly realigned like this, it's just barking mad.
It’s really odd that there are inconsistencies between the same cars running the same software. I’ve not had any issue with headlight levels. I’ve had level lines on my garage wall for years (a throwback from my LR Discovery) mine haven’t moved and of course they come on auto every time I go into gear. There are others reporting that the car won’t wake for their charger for an overnight charge. I have the same charger, works every time. ...and all these different bug fix releases baffle me.
 

Glan gluaisne

Supporting Member
Sep 11, 2019
2,782
2,689
UK
It’s really odd that there are inconsistencies between the same cars running the same software. I’ve not had any issue with headlight levels. I’ve had level lines on my garage wall for years (a throwback from my LR Discovery) mine haven’t moved and of course they come on auto every time I go into gear. There are others reporting that the car won’t wake for their charger for an overnight charge. I have the same charger, works every time. ...and all these different bug fix releases baffle me.

It is really odd. Some things can be explained by different local driving conditions, but many seem to just be variability between cars, and often just completely random events, that may only occur once in a blue moon.

Another example is phantom window opening. I know a few people have had this, but I never had, until this Christmas. Got in the car the morning after Boxing Day to find the windows open and the car soaking wet inside. Sometime during the night the windows had just wound themselves down, whilst the car was locked and parked in a hotel car park.

The headlight adjustment changing is a fairly regular occurrence on my car. Sometimes the lights just motor fully skywards, sometimes they just move up a bit and the first I realise they've shifted again is when cars start flashing me.

Some things are fairly predictable, though. I know narrow lanes upset the car, and there are a few spots where I can pretty much guarantee that the car will throw a full scale wobbly, with klaxons, brakes applied etc. I'd guess that those are nothing specific to the way my car behaves, and are probably just inherent issues with the software.

It may be that some of the sensors the car uses have some degree of variability that isn't accounted for in the software, perhaps. That might explain why some cars seem to suffer from different issues to others.
 
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Dilly

Active Member
Feb 24, 2020
1,478
1,098
Norfolk
It is really odd. Some things can be explained by different local driving conditions, but many seem to just be variability between cars, and often just completely random events, that may only occur once in a blue moon.

Another example is phantom window opening. I know a few people have had this, but I never had, until this Christmas. Got in the car the morning after Boxing Day to find the windows open and the car soaking wet inside. Sometime during the night the windows had just wound themselves down, whilst the car was locked and parked in a hotel car park.

The headlight adjustment changing is a fairly regular occurrence on my car. Sometimes the lights just motor fully skywards, sometimes they just move up a bit and the first I realise they've shifted again is when cars start flashing me.

Some things are fairly predictable, though. I know narrow lanes upset the car, and there are a few spots where I can pretty much guarantee that the car will throw a full scale wobbly, with klaxons, brakes applied etc. I'd guess that those are nothing specific to the way my car behaves, and are probably just inherent issues with the software.

It may be that some of the sensors the car uses have some degree of variability that isn't accounted for in the software, perhaps. That might explain why some cars seem to suffer from different issues to others.
I guess that even the tiniest inconsistency in a chip or data bus can have big impacts.
 

Medved_77

TM3 SR+ | MSM+Black | No FSD
Jan 20, 2020
1,925
1,887
Scotland
Under the previous referral scheme, 4 qualifying referrals would net you priority access to vehicle software updates. Not sure if that would be a blessing or a curse for most?

From my own experiences of software updates, I've never found them to be of detriment to the cars performance or operation. I've managed to dodge some of the major irritants, such as the reduced speed home charging, any regressions I've noticed I've been able to live with until a future update resolves them.

Working for a software company, where we release daily, I can understand how most issues creep in but can also see most being short term and the overall trajectory of the improvements, IMO, has led to a better driving experience, long term.

I'm in the narrow pool of owners that appear to have no issues with headlights or windscreen wipers though, which may make me more receptive to the other niggles bought on with software changes.
 
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GeorgeSymonds

Member
Mar 16, 2018
942
546
UK
I'm all for them but not at the expense of proper testing before release or tinkering for what seems to be the sake of tinkering, but sadly that seems to be the way. Few updates actually deliver anything tangible, some introduce bugs with the next updates there to fix it.

I'd be much happier if there was an annual or biannual release that we knew would land in say Dec or Jun and Dec, and we'd all look forward to it and it would be relatively bug free while delivering something useful. I think we're all still waiting for the second part of the Christmas release which I imagine now isn't going to happen. I can think of maybe 3 features added in 5 years that have been great/useful, pin to drive, text messages, and now you've got me on the 3rd...

I had the priority access due to referrals, to be honest it made absolutely no difference whatsoever to when I got the releases, I certainly wasn't at the front of any queue, it was a free giveaway that cost them nothing and actually seemed to mean nothing. I'd also earned referral alloy wheels which took 2 years (yes two) to actually be delivered.
 
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Irata

Member
Oct 16, 2020
300
179
UK
The problem with two large releases a year is... If they have bugs then they need fixing, so you then have patch releases between them. So from the users perspective you still have regular updates.

Most of the updates seem quite small anyway, so in effect it is one or more large release followed by a year of patches already.

It's not the release cycle that really matters, it's the quality. Quality from the customer is both reliability and user experience.

The save profile button missing when seats are moved is a good example, this demonstrates insufficient test coverage. So this is where they need to focus.

Mirrors, seats and steering wheel are adjustable for a reason. Why not make the display adjustable too.
 

Alistairuk

Member
Jun 25, 2020
389
255
Scotland
I think one of the bigger problems is that a lot of people have “advanced updates” enabled on the software update screen, as they want the latest software and features as soon as possible - the down side to this is that it essentially means you are helping test the software before it’s rolled out to everyone else. This is potentially compounded by the fact that UK vehicles are in the right hand drive different configuration that the majority of the world so until it rolls out here it’s not been mass tested on UK vehicles.

(think of it as a not quite beta test but not quite stable release)

Not saying it’s the case with everybody but given some comments that pop up every now and again on here it’s clear that some owners don’t realise that if you have it enabled you’re going to occasionally (although as some would say regularly) experience bugs!

I’d be really interested to know how many people that have the issues / bugs have the “advanced updates” option enabled vs. how many have issues without it.
 

Glan gluaisne

Supporting Member
Sep 11, 2019
2,782
2,689
UK
Has anyone proved that selecting "advanced" actually does anything?

I've been on the standard setting for ages now, but seem to get updates just as quickly (based on posts here)n than when I had it set to advanced. I have long had a suspicion that it was a bit like the disconnected push button on some pedestrian crossings.
 

GeorgeSymonds

Member
Mar 16, 2018
942
546
UK
The problem with two large releases a year is... If they have bugs then they need fixing, so you then have patch releases between them. So from the users perspective you still have regular updates.

Most of the updates seem quite small anyway, so in effect it is one or more large release followed by a year of patches already.

It's not the release cycle that really matters, it's the quality. Quality from the customer is both reliability and user experience.

The save profile button missing when seats are moved is a good example, this demonstrates insufficient test coverage. So this is where they need to focus.

Mirrors, seats and steering wheel are adjustable for a reason. Why not make the display adjustable too.

They can push bug fixes silently, they do when it’s important. My first car had a fault where after a software update the charge flap was constantly reported as open obscuring half the screen. Every owner had the same problem in Europe because they didn’t both testing it in Europe and we have a different charge port to the US. One morning it was gone with a silent update. So I agree they need to push bug fixes but if they a, tested properly major releases, and just did their dirty bug fix clean up quietly it would work. I didn’t say they shouldn’t say do bug fixes at all.
 

Glan gluaisne

Supporting Member
Sep 11, 2019
2,782
2,689
UK
I've been running Linux Mint on one machine for several years now, and since switching to the LTS (long term support) version life's been a lot simpler. It's not the cutting edge version, but it does remain very stable, and seems an ideal way to handle car software updates to me.
 

Yachtsman

Member
Sep 5, 2020
219
75
Staffordshire
I think one of the bigger problems is that a lot of people have “advanced updates” enabled on the software update screen, as they want the latest software and features as soon as possible - the down side to this is that it essentially means you are helping test the software before it’s rolled out to everyone else. This is potentially compounded by the fact that UK vehicles are in the right hand drive different configuration that the majority of the world so until it rolls out here it’s not been mass tested on UK vehicles.

(think of it as a not quite beta test but not quite stable release)

Not saying it’s the case with everybody but given some comments that pop up every now and again on here it’s clear that some owners don’t realise that if you have it enabled you’re going to occasionally (although as some would say regularly) experience bugs!

I’d be really interested to know how many people that have the issues / bugs have the “advanced updates” option enabled vs. how many have issues without it.

I've had the advance option from day one & I seem to be fairly late getting any updates based on comments on here. I'm still on 48.35.5.
Generally speaking I don't experience some of the problems that many other report on here, however I've done virtually no night driving & never experienced phantom braking just a hesitation sometimes with mild braking.
Simerlarly I've never had my headlights alter before or after updates & except for the slow reaction when on auto they are no worse than my two previous premium bmws.
So as you say it is strange, I can only conclude some of the issues (lights &:wipers exempt) maybe down to our different driving styles.
 

rincewind

Member
Nov 5, 2019
504
273
London England
So as you say it is strange, I can only conclude some of the issues (lights &:wipers exempt) maybe down to our different driving styles.

Some may be, but I can't see that wipers are. For instance, I pulled away from my house last week with a very light rain falling. This rain stopped with 100 meters or so, but the wipers, yet again, went to max and didn't stop until I turned them off manually. I also had an instance a few months ago, driving at night on the M11 when it started raining heavily and lorries were chucking up lots of spray. The wipers totally refused to start (and yes, they were on auto), I had to start them manually -- it was dangerous.

So, I now leave them on manual all the time. The wife's Golf auto wipers work fine, but Tesla cannot get this right with their current way of doing things even after some considerable time of their auto wipers being out there in the real world. It's time for them to re think the methodology they are using.
 
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Stuart1714

Member
May 27, 2020
109
61
Ashton-in-Makerfield
I'd be much happier if there was an annual or biannual release that we knew would land in say Dec or Jun and Dec, and we'd all look forward to it and it would be relatively bug free while delivering something useful.

This is the way Microsoft want large organisations to operate with regards to Windows 10. They release two lots of big updates so rather than large major upgrades every 4 or 5 years, it’s evolution a couple of times a year rather than revolution every 4 or 5 years.

They will also provide bug fixes and security updates in between.

This approach isn’t always practical for everybody and every PC out there, so they have another version which is supported for a longer period of time, so if you want/need to keep a stable version for longer with fixes and security updates but not the latest features, it’s possible.

As far as Tesla goes, I’d also prefer to see less regular changes, but when they do release the updates, they have been tested more thoroughly.
 

GRiLLA

Member
Jul 5, 2020
438
428
UK
Apps are a little slow recently, same happened at around this time last year. It's easy to forget but there were lots of features that I use released during 2020 ...
  • Speed sign recognition
  • Car will now start charging when my charger provides power
  • Sentry Cam viewer
  • Spotify now supporting podcasts and generally being more reliable
  • 2FA for my Tesla Account
  • Traffic Light green alert sound
  • App alerts if I leave the windows open
  • SMS Messaging
  • Being able to see an updating number of available SuC available from the map
I don't think we should be surprised that there has been next to no development in AutoPilot/FSD, we are on a legacy version while the rewrite is being iterated by beta testers in the US.

As for windscreen wipers, yes mine are now terrible and go too fast and drag blades across a dry windscreen. They didn't used to be, but I've coated the glass with gTechnic which perhaps was a mistake.
 
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