-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
MarcG
Active Member
I'll post all the details later but it was 433 Wh/mi. Constant 10 mph over the limit, so 80 mph for over 110 miles of that stretch.
This does not make sense - unless the P85D has a much larger unusable buffer. 172.3 mi x 0.433 Wh/mi = 74.61 KWh - why only 2 miles range left (=1 KWh)?
On a separate note, if you use EV trip planner and select the S/P with 21' wheels (I know you are on 19s) it is exactly the same number for average Wh/mi - 1.1 speed factor gives 81 mph speed over ~110 mi. Check it out:
MarcG
Active Member
Thanks for the analysis. I ran a lot of EV Trip Planner scenarios as well before my trip to get a sense of what would be achievable, which is why I was able to get so close to 0 rated miles (RM) left :~)
So I just did another 109 mile leg between Corning and Shasta with some elevation gain and higher average speed, so my avg Wh/mi for that stint was 482. I used 176 RM.
In both these first two runs, I caculated that the usable amount of energy is exactly 75.2 kWh, which amounts to about 88.5% of 85 kWh. That 9.8 kWh bricking protection "reserve" is much more than I would have anticipated!
Last edited:
Andyw2100
Well-Known Member
So...is it possible that right now the lousy real-world highway range results we're seeing with the P85Ds are actually the result of a double-whammy, so to speak, and that in the future things could improve in two different ways? We already know about the Musk tweet about a software update that should take the P85D to about the P85 level, give or take, by disabling one of the two motors. But what if Tesla is temporarily allocating more than is necessary to this bricking protection, just while they roll out the new model, and their intention is to eventually free up some of that as well? If that's the case we may see the kind of range from our P85Ds that we were all hoping for in the first place.
EarlyAdopter
Active Member
I believe this is the same as before - 5kWh reserved on the top and 5kWh reserved on the bottom to mitigate degradation and bricking, respectively.
In other words, even on a "full" "trip" charge you are only actually charging to 94%. Likewise, running it to "empty" and dead still leaves 6%. LiIon degradation is most pronounced at the extreme ends of charged and discharged. By avoiding these extremes, Tesla considerably increases the life of the cells.
I've seen a nice info graphic of this around here before. I'll see if I can find it.
In other words, even on a "full" "trip" charge you are only actually charging to 94%. Likewise, running it to "empty" and dead still leaves 6%. LiIon degradation is most pronounced at the extreme ends of charged and discharged. By avoiding these extremes, Tesla considerably increases the life of the cells.
I've seen a nice info graphic of this around here before. I'll see if I can find it.
Cliff Hannel
Member
Did you recalculate by hitting 'route direct' after changing wheel size? It does not automatically recalculate energy on parameter changes at this point. Also: 1.1 is big speed factor - see 'details' tab to see what actual MPH that corresponds to relative to current traffic conditions. We are attempting to update for P85D, but real-world reliable numbers aren't really out there and there is a lot of onflicting information. For now, I'd assume same driving habits at P85S will result in close to same consumption.
If you use 19" it gives you estimated 413 Wh/mi. I used the 21 because EV planner for 21 seem to match the average Wh/mi that MarcG was reporting.
The 1.1 speed factor gives you the 80 mph he used on his trip - you can download the speed data per segment.
It seems to me that:
1. EV planner using 21" for S/P85 matches real-life 19" P85D usage fairly well - I suppose you will need to increase that by a certain factor (6-8%?) to get the P85D on 21".
2. You should count on ~75 KWh from your battery as max usage.
I thought that some of that "reserve" beyond 0 miles of rated range is anti-bricking protection, and some is for hidden buffer miles. From the graph below, 5.1 kWh is drivable beyond 0 and 3.9 kWh is anti-bricking protection.
Am I mistaken?
dennis
Model S Plaid
I thought that some of that "reserve" beyond 0 miles of rated range is anti-bricking protection, and some is for hidden buffer miles. From the graph below, 5.1 kWh is drivable beyond 0 and 3.9 kWh is anti-bricking protection.
Am I mistaken?
I re-posted that several months ago and was informed that is has never been verified.
What is the highest recorded kwh that have been put into an 85 kwh battery when the rated range was exactly at zero when the charge was initiated?
Musk tweeted two days ago:
Elon Musk @elonmusk · Dec 23
Software update to achieve max efficiency (going to full idle on 2nd motor) is not out yet. Range of P85D should then closely match P85+.
This is excellent news. The P85+ has an estimated 265-mile range.
Elon Musk @elonmusk · Dec 23Software update to achieve max efficiency (going to full idle on 2nd motor) is not out yet. Range of P85D should then closely match P85+.
This is excellent news. The P85+ has an estimated 265-mile range.
Jim MacInnes
Member
Range and highway battery performance
Here is an interesting article related to this topic Tesla Model S Dual-Motor Is Quicker, Has Higher Range Too: How Do They Do That? (UPDATED)
Here is an interesting article related to this topic Tesla Model S Dual-Motor Is Quicker, Has Higher Range Too: How Do They Do That? (UPDATED)
Andyw2100
Well-Known Member
The even better question would be how much kwh was put in to achieve a 100% charge when someone had actually run their battery out of charge.
I know a few people here have talked about running out of power, and how they managed to do that. I don't know if any of them then charged to 100% and documented how much kwh their battery accepted. But that would be very useful information to have, wouldn't it?
- - - Updated - - -
That article is pretty old. It's dated October 15. Lots has changed since then, including the 295 number the author uses, though that's really the least of the problem with his comparisons.
Personally, I really enjoyed this part:
"The official EPA combined range of the standard S-85 is 265 miles. On its website configurator, Tesla says the new AWD version will go 295 miles at 65 mph. (Temperature and climate-control use are not specified.)Though it's not quite an apples-to-apples comparison, that's an 11-percent improvement."
I mean, that's pretty accurate, as long as you take out the words "not quite" and replace them with something like "nothing at all, whatsoever, in any way, shape, or form."
Seriously, to compare the overall EPA mileage estimate with the mileage at 65 MPH estimate and say that it "wasn't quite apples to apples" was pretty ridiculous.
MarcG
Active Member
FYI, the detailed data for my completed SF-Portland trip has been posted here:
P85D trip SF-Portland: detailed data on range and charging
And for reference, I found that the 1.15x speed multiplier scenarios I ran on EV Trip Planner are closer to the numbers I got.
Happy to share more data if you need it to refine the website for P85D consumption.
-Marc
jerjozwik
Active Member
jerjozwik
Active Member
i have a suggestion for marcG, the only person who seems to be using the range google doc.
P85D Uninterrupted Hwy Trip Data - Google Sheets
can you add a new column that shows your cars lifetime mileage at he start of the trip? seems like the main counter argument for the lacking range besides FW is that the cars are not "warn in" yet.
P85D Uninterrupted Hwy Trip Data - Google Sheets
can you add a new column that shows your cars lifetime mileage at he start of the trip? seems like the main counter argument for the lacking range besides FW is that the cars are not "warn in" yet.
The Canadian WebSite now shows
S85 (RWD) - 460 kms (105kmh)
S85D (AWD) - 435 kms (105kmh)
P85D (AWD) - 407 kms (105kmh)
This seems like an attempt to reflect the current (pre-software update) range accurately as it even shows the S85D as having less range which Ideally won't be true in the future. Not sure why the Canadian site was updated and not the US site. Maybe our advertising laws are more stringent.
Hmm... Hope thats temporary yes... No change in Norway, but of course according to the blog the new firmware will be out before first delivery here..
MarcG
Active Member
I've just updated the spreadsheet with my Portland-SF trip back via Bend. More details can be seen in this post:
P85D trip SF-Portland: detailed data on range and charging
BTW the P85D range now shows 253 EPA-rated (with 19" wheels). The most I've gotten out of a 100% charge is 252 miles.
P85D trip SF-Portland: detailed data on range and charging
BTW the P85D range now shows 253 EPA-rated (with 19" wheels). The most I've gotten out of a 100% charge is 252 miles.
Attachments
Similar threads
