P90D Owners - What Is Your Wh/mile and 90% Rated Range?

[ArtInCT]

My 90% is now at 233 with 11K miles.
My 90% when new was 241 miles.
So a loss of about 3.3% rated miles.
My 100% (back in August) was 262 Miles.
I am on firmware 2.42.40
My typical recharge rate is 40A up to 70% and recharge is performed on a scheduled daily basis.
When car is parked it is usually plugged in and always connected is mode.
My build is late Feb 2016 with pack 1071394-00-A.
Pre Facelift.

 

[Walta]

My 90% is now at 233 with 11K miles.
My 90% when new was 241 miles.
So a loss of about 3.3% rated miles.
My 100% (back in August) was 262 Miles.
I am on firmware 2.42.40
My typical recharge rate is 40A up to 70% and recharge is performed on a scheduled daily basis.
When car is parked it is usually plugged in and always connected is mode.
My build is late Feb 2016 with pack 1071394-00-A.
Pre Facelift.

That is more reasonable and appears to be perfectly in line with owner expectations.
My battery dropped 5.3 % within the first 2 months. Then after that a gradual decline of 3.2 % over the next 11 months.
I have the 1063792-00-A battery.

 

[rpo]

My P90DL is at 248 miles @ 90% with 3k miles. It hasn't begun dropping quite yet.

 

[Walta]

My P90DL is at 248 miles @ 90% with 3k miles. It hasn't begun dropping quite yet.

If I were to guess - I would say that the original P90D battery was based on the 85kw - only with more silicon to provide for the extra 5kw to make it 90kw. With that comes the risk of battery degradation. Early P90D purchases in 2015 occurred before Tesla had enough long term battery testing data to understand the negative impact that people were going to experience. Over time there came a flood of empirical data to show that the 90kw battery was suspect to NON gradual degradation. The warranty supports gradual degradation. What 90kw owners have dealt with is not gradual. I lost 14 miles in the first two months. Which immediately devalued my purchase both in range and performance. And immediately reduced my battery to an 85kw battery.
After which Tesla designed a couple newer 90kw batteries to address this early degradation.
If you have a non V1 battery , I believe you will be fine. Which is your case if you only have 3k miles it must be a recent post V1 battery purchase.

I believe strongly that Tesla violated the battery warranty for the V1 90kw owners. Buy selling them a battery that did not exhibit gradual loss over time. Tesla states it is simply a software issue in reporting the correct range? Really. I am a principal software engineer, and I can promise you, that something as simple as reporting the correct range is NOT difficult to fix. Though this has been the excuse for the V1 owners not seeing the correct range. They finally gave my car the software fix to address the incorrect reporting of the range... told me to wait 3 weeks to let it learn the battery and increase the range. I asked them what I needed to do to give the fix the best chance of succeeding. They responded saying to make sure I allowed the battery to run down below the 30% mark. I did exactly what they wanted and then some. The results were a loss of 4 miles of my rated range. There is no magic software fix to address the V1 battery range issue. There is ONLY one fix. Replace the V1 battery with a newer 90kw battery that has proven to supply the range V1 owners have paid good money for, and is meeting the warranty by providing only gradual loss over time.

 

[AWDtsla]

My P90DL is at 248 miles @ 90% with 3k miles. It hasn't begun dropping quite yet.

You have a revised pack. I was only at 239 with like 10 miles on the ODO.

 

[AWDtsla]

I believe strongly that Tesla violated the battery warranty for the V1 90kw owners. Buy selling them a battery that did not exhibit gradual loss over time. Tesla states it is simply a software issue in reporting the correct range? Really. I am a principal software engineer, and I can promise you, that something as simple as reporting the correct range is NOT difficult to fix. Though this has been the excuse for the V1 owners not seeing the correct range. They finally gave my car the software fix to address the incorrect reporting of the range... told me to wait 3 weeks to let it learn the battery and increase the range. I asked them what I needed to do to give the fix the best chance of succeeding. They responded saying to make sure I allowed the battery to run down below the 30% mark. I did exactly what they wanted and then some. The results were a loss of 4 miles of my rated range. There is no magic software fix to address the V1 battery range issue. There is ONLY one fix. Replace the V1 battery with a newer 90kw battery that has proven to supply the range V1 owners have paid good money for, and is meeting the warranty by providing only gradual loss over time.

If we're going to get on this subject, there's a lot more to talk about, like even though you have a certain range reported, you will never ever be able to get that mileage out of the car without hypermiling. It's supposed to be able to do that when driven in a standard manner, which is where the EPA rating/rated miles came from, but it won't. If you track your consumption by %/rated miles lost (same thing, different units) you see how much higher your actual consumption is than what's reported or projected by the car. Now the question is whether you give Tesla the benefit of a doubt as just say "The trip meter is S***!", or the energy never existed in the first place. Add that to vampire drain, and you actually have a very expensive fueling costs, forget about range. I was getting the equivalent of 11 MPG in the winter according to my napkin math. If that wasn't enough, the car won't even meet the 10.9 it was advertised to. Guess I'll have to spend $21k on another battery????


<DUCKS FOR COVER>

 

[Walta]

If we're going to get on this subject, there's a lot more to talk about, like even though you have a certain range reported, you will never ever be able to get that mileage out of the car without hypermiling. It's supposed to be able to do that when driven in a standard manner, which is where the EPA rating/rated miles came from, but it won't. If you track your consumption by %/rated miles lost (same thing, different units) you see how much higher your actual consumption is than what's reported or projected by the car. Now the question is whether you give Tesla the benefit of a doubt as just say "The trip meter is S***!", or the energy never existed in the first place. Add that to vampire drain, and you actually have a very expensive fueling costs, forget about range. I was getting the equivalent of 11 MPG in the winter according to my napkin math. If that wasn't enough, the car won't even meet the 10.9 it was advertised to. Guess I'll have to spend $21k on another battery????


<DUCKS FOR COVER>

I haven't even gone there yet ( verifying the reported miles can be achieved ), but can see another can of worms cracking wide open.

As someone who hates to get ripped off, I always check to make sure what I paid for was actually delivered. Seems like a reasonable approach to purchasing any item. Like when you go into a bar and buy a pint of beer... you expect to receive a pint of beer. If not, you will speak up.
With my purchase of the P90DL - I am only demanding from Tesla that they provide me the car with the options I selected. As you have pointed out some of the options are performance based ( 10.9 quarter mile ) as well as 2.8 0-60. As with increased range these options have a cost. Tesla assigned a value to these options, in thousands of dollars. When they don't deliver on those options Tesla needs to refund the money, or provide for the options. Anything less is unacceptable. Seems so obvious. I am really disappointed that Tesla used to handle customer issues so much better. Maybe the growth of the company and the bottom line makes it more difficult? But do they really think they can NOT deliver on what a customer paid money for? And that the customer will accept story after story as to why the battery range is not what they expected, and why their car cannot do 10.9 in the quarter mile?
Back in my early naive Tesla times... when the newer P90D owners started reporting the expected range, as well as reports of 10.9 at the track... I was like YES! It won't be long till Tesla announces a battery replacement for all V1 owners!

Doh!

 

[apacheguy]

Sounds like someone needs to do some cell tests with the A and B batteries.

 

[lolachampcar]

318 W-Hr/m over 25K miles (accelerate hard almost always regen braking only to come to a final stop)
P85DL 20" Pilot Super Sports
very seldom do a range charge so will have to do one to add rated range at 100%

 

[Ames]

My P90DL is at 248 miles @ 90% with 3k miles. It hasn't begun dropping quite yet.

That is amazing. My 100% is 4 miles less than your 90% and my car is not yet 1 year old.

Older P85D's operating in the same environment as my car with similar options (e.g. 21" wheels, pano roof...etc.) are already getting better range. As an example, Sorka (a very active user on TMC) has more than double my mileage and gets 226 at 90% to my 219 (yes it has dropped further when I checked this morning).
What's your 90%?

It looks like by next year I will be competing with 60D owners for range (if I lose another 7% I will be down to 204 miles at 90% and a 60D can be charged daily to 208). I hope my degradation curve evens out a bit and I am wrong about this.

A final thought; the range listed for my car at the time I bought it was 435 km or 270 miles. So by that reckoning I am 10% down in just under a year.

 

[Walta]

That is amazing. My 100% is 4 miles less than your 90% and my car is not yet 1 year old.

Older P85D's operating in the same environment as my car with similar options (e.g. 21" wheels, pano roof...etc.) are already getting better range. As an example, Sorka (a very active user on TMC) has more than double my mileage and gets 226 at 90% to my 219 (yes it has dropped further when I checked this morning).
What's your 90%?

It looks like by next year I will be competing with 60D owners for range (if I lose another 7% I will be down to 204 miles at 90% and a 60D can be charged daily to 208). I hope my degradation curve evens out a bit and I am wrong about this.

A final thought; the range listed for my car at the time I bought it was 435 km or 270 miles. So by that reckoning I am 10% down in just under a year.

We are both experiencing the results of batteries that are not living up to Tesla's warranty claims of gradual loss over time. These batteries need to be replaced. Throughout Tesla's documentation they explain that tesla wants each customer to be satisfied with their purchase. With my case The battery engineers are reporting the battery is fine and just the reported range is wrong. I assume you have heard the same lie? The jig is up. There is no fix but to replace the battery.
Tesla values battery range at roughly $3000 per 5kw. They are quite comfortable taking my money for the promise of increased range. The door swings in both directions.

 

[AWDtsla]

Just to add my own data to the range loss story. I don't have that many miles, but it seems I have probably cycled through 150% worth of ODO miles on the battery as compared to others due to climate and drive cycle, but I don't think that's really relevant. The real data is here: My car is extremely babied as far as calendar time*temperature on the pack. At home it sits in a garage on a concrete slab that is pretty much around 50F all year, and such the garage never gets very hot or very cold. At work I'm almost always parked in a 100% shaded structure, so even in the summer it doesn't really experience more than ambient air temp. Over the course of these drive cycles, I have basically noticed negligible loss in rated miles. However, I'm still down 4-6 rated 90% miles in one year. How did that happen? Due to circumstances outside of my control, the car was parked in 85-95F sunny weather on blacktop for around 3-4 weeks, starting somewhere above 70% and ending somewhere in the mid-20's SoC. During this time, the entirely of the range loss happened.

 

[Walta]

We are both experiencing the results of batteries that are not living up to Tesla's warranty claims of gradual loss over time. These batteries need to be replaced. Throughout Tesla's documentation they explain that tesla wants each customer to be satisfied with their purchase. With my case The battery engineers are reporting the battery is fine and just the reported range is wrong. I assume you have heard the same lie? The jig is up. There is no fix but to replace the battery.
Tesla values battery range at roughly $3000 per 5kw. They are quite comfortable taking my money for the promise of increased range. The door swings in both directions.

I am SO HAPPY! Due to the unusually quick range drop I experienced with my battery, Tesla has replaced my V1 battery with a V3 battery. My max range went from 245 rated miles to 272 rated miles and my performance improved from 450kw to 510kw. I want to thank the incredible efforts of Tesla service to hang in there with me over the past year to reach a solution. I feel that Tesla has proven to me to be the car company I signed up with over a year ago. They have completely delivered on the car I was expecting when I ordered it, and then some. Tesla is the best!

And to stay on topic... my 90% is now 241 miles.

 

[AWDtsla]

I am SO HAPPY! Due to the unusually quick range drop I experienced with my battery, Tesla has replaced my V1 battery with a V3 battery. My max range went from 245 rated miles to 272 rated miles and my performance improved from 450kw to 510kw. I want to thank the incredible efforts of Tesla service to hang in there with me over the past year to reach a solution. I feel that Tesla has proven to me to be the car company I signed up with over a year ago. They have completely delivered on the car I was expecting when I ordered it, and then some. Tesla is the best!

And to stay on topic... my 90% is now 241 miles.

You lucky bastard!

 

[MorrisonHiker]

I am SO HAPPY! Due to the unusually quick range drop I experienced with my battery, Tesla has replaced my V1 battery with a V3 battery. My max range went from 245 rated miles to 272 rated miles and my performance improved from 450kw to 510kw. I want to thank the incredible efforts of Tesla service to hang in there with me over the past year to reach a solution. I feel that Tesla has proven to me to be the car company I signed up with over a year ago. They have completely delivered on the car I was expecting when I ordered it, and then some. Tesla is the best!

And to stay on topic... my 90% is now 241 miles.

Do you happen to know the part numbers of your old battery and new battery?

 

[Walta]

Do you happen to know the part numbers of your old battery and new battery?

The original battery was 1063792-00-A, and the new battery is 1088792-00-A.

 

[Majorfubar]

My March 2016 build S P90DL (classic) gets 415 km at 100%.

I have road tripped from Toronto to Orlando, and see 415 KM in both hot (Florida) and the current winter temps in Toronto area.

 

[davidc18]

90% 238 at 7350 miles. Was 240 at 2,600 when i picked up the car

 

[Whistle2Whine]

10K in, My projected range at 90% is bouncing between 235 and 237. The only variable SEEMS to be how warm the battery is. If I've been on the highway a lot and supercharge right after, 237 seems possible. My around town driving seems to only get me to 235 when it's time to charge. My Whm...well, I don't want to talk about

 

[Majorfubar]

My March 2016 build S P90DL (classic) gets 415 km at 100%.

I have road tripped from Toronto to Orlando, and see 415 KM in both hot (Florida) and the current winter temps in Toronto area.

I finally got a chance to record my rated mileage on several charges. Outside Temperature were around -2 to 1 degrees Celsius

80% charge = 208 rated miles
90% charge = 237 rated miles.
100%charge = 259 rated miles