Performance increase for 100D. 0-100 in 3,3 sek

[Destiny1701]

There is for sure a glitch and performance figures are all over the place on tesla.com. Either way, to me this indicates clearly what is going on. There will be a performance improvement announced for the non performance 100-packs. But it will not be as low as we hav seen. The main mix up is between 0-60mph and 0-100km/h and Tesla really need to regression test their webb.

If Tesla want to keep things in the dark for us they need to hide the factory codes from the configurator and from our specs. E.g. the separate battery discussion with BTX8 batteries delivered in EU and now the latest APH3 hardware. Sigh.

Based on what has been said and what has been not this is what I predict it will look like for Model S when Tesla sort things out. For 75 and P it's already known and 100D will simply just fall between them in terms of performance:

75D
0-100km/h: 4,4 sec
0-60 mph: 4,2 sec

100D
0-100km/h: 3,5 sec
0-60 mph: 3,3 sec

P100D
0-100km/h: 2,7 sec
0-60 mph: 2,5 sec

Wholeheartedly agreed....until....110kw..

 

[R.S]

It has been more than a week now and still there is no answer to this problem. And no matter how hard I try to figure out why, I just don't get it.

This is the mid range Model S, the one with high margins and high volumes. But also the one that got the least improvements/price reductions over the last moths. If it can go faster, why not advertise it right ahead?

It would probably make more people buy the 100D instead of the 75D. Maybe they are afraid it will steal sales from the P100Ds? But I don't really see that changing with time. So it shouldn't really matter when they introduce that.

Or is it just a IT mistake and the guys at Tesla either don't care, or they are too stupid to get it right?

I really don't get it. Is there an option three I haven't thought about?

 

[Bebop]

It would probably make more people buy the 100D instead of the 75D.

Not really. The 100D is still about $20K more expensive than the 75D. I'd still go with the 75D (which I did) because of how significantly less money it is.

 

[R.S]

Not really. The 100D is still about $20K more expensive than the 75D. I'd still go with the 75D (which I did) because of how significantly less money it is.

But by that definition nobody would buy it right now. Because right now the only thing it has is a bit more range, which is nice, but that might not be convincing enough. If it has more range and is a good bit quicker, then I could see more people stretching their budget.

There are people willing to spend over 30k to upgrade from a 100D to a P100D and then you actually loose range. Getting the 100D to be a low 3s car might hurt P100D sales, but it would surely make the 100D a better value, than it is today.

 

[AMPd]

As a relatively new 100d owner (March), this pisses me off. I was forced to take 4.2s as I didn't want to spend another 45k for the 'P' model, but man... if now the newer 100d's give the speed I wanted, that sucks. Well, good for new owners, but bad for me.

Why did you buy the car then?
If you weren't happy with it you shouldn't have bought it.

 

[Matias]

If it is a mistake, it is really stupid, that they cannot fix simple 0-100 km/h time in web page.

 

[R.S]

If it is a mistake, it is really stupid, that they cannot fix simple 0-100 km/h time in web page.

But it's also really stupid to leak something, more than a week before it's officially announced and just not bother to correct it.

And this isn't like some leak where Jason Hughes had to dig through code, or it was a hidden portion of the website. This is right there for anyone to see.

And these numbers are on the website for over a week now.

 

[headcase]

zzzz.... nothing to see here.

 

[nico180]

It's not a mistake. Can't be this simple..

Changing a number value on a site is a matter of seconds... It's a week now. to have it changed online. I suspect there is a reason it is there..

 

[ccdisce]

What I have noticed is that the 100D s that show 0-60 3.3S are new inventory cars in Europe in Great Britain and Germany that I just checked, none available in Netherlands.
New Inventory for the EU, indicates that they were built 2-3 months ago for export and probably built from what were in the parts bin at the time to meet the shipping deadline which could be compounded by the fact that the cars had to be partially disassembled and the kits sent off Tilburg NL for final re-assembly.
What I would like to know is the 0-60 time that the Design Studio showed 2-3 months ago for a 100D?

A pie-in-the sky view could be that the factory found itself with shortage of 100KW packs but had a number of 'new design now fully qualified100KW marked' batteries that were testing out at a capacity of say 125KW, no badging for 125D exists as they are not selling 125Ds.. Just do a battery cap at 100KW , badge them as 100D and log the serial numbers and VINs for later reference if and when 125s are shipped..... just get them on the boat to Europe.

A similar case could be conjectured for the larger DU vs smaller ones......production hell is warming up.

What we need is some one in Germany or Great Britain to run a 0-60 test on one of these 100D cars to call the possible Tesla bluff.

 

[nagypite]

What I have noticed is that the 100D s that show 0-60 3.3S are new inventory cars in Europe in Great Britain and Germany that I just checked, none available in Netherlands.
New Inventory for the EU, indicates that they were built 2-3 months ago for export and probably built from what were in the parts bin at the time to meet the shipping deadline which could be compounded by the fact that the cars had to be partially disassembled and the kits sent off Tilburg NL for final re-assembly.
What I would like to know is the 0-60 time that the Design Studio showed 2-3 months ago for a 100D?

A pie-in-the sky view could be that the factory found itself with shortage of 100KW packs but had a number of 'new design now fully qualified100KW marked' batteries that were testing out at a capacity of say 125KW, no badging for 125D exists as they are not selling 125Ds.. Just do a battery cap at 100KW , badge them as 100D and log the serial numbers and VINs for later reference if and when 125s are shipped..... just get them on the boat to Europe.

A similar case could be conjectured for the larger DU vs smaller ones......production hell is warming up.

What we need is some one in Germany or Great Britain to run a 0-60 test on one of these 100D cars to call the possible Tesla bluff.

or they are software limited P100D-s

 

[thegruf]

What bothers me about this supposed 3.3 secs 0-60 is ...

Does it include rollout?

Only the P models to date have included "rollout" which is worht 0.2 -0.3 seconds
If it is actually 3.3 secs without rollout as it appears to be, then the P100D is dead.

I have to assume it is spelling error that should have been corrected by now, otherwise this is yet another mistake by Tesla marketing imo with a totally unecessary hike in performance.

On the other hand if it is a spelling error (most likely) then people who buy due to this claim on the website can definitely ask for a refund when the car does not deliver the stated performance.

too many mistakes Tesla.

 

[CL600]

Here are the screenprints from the car I bought August 26 (first day of Q3 sales in NL):

- the first one is taken 3:28AM (20 hours and 32 minutes before the sale started in The Netherlands)
- the second one is taken 1:00PM (1 hour after the 3Q sales started in The Netherlands)
- the third one is taken around 07:00PM (about 7 hours after the 3Q sales started in The Netherlands)

Please notice:
- battery, range and acceleration were not specified before the 3Q sales started
- during the night, the initial price reduction was corrected upwards (€400)

I definitely settled the deal 01:27PM and the Tesla salesperson confirmed that #195724 was claimed at 01:29PM.

 

[SucreTease]

Here are the screenprints from the car I bought August 26

When do you take delivery? Please, please, test the 0-100 km/hr time for us.

 

[PhaseWhite]

What bothers me about this supposed 3.3 secs 0-60 is ...

Does it include rollout?

I think you are on to something here. My take is: Getting the 100D down to 3.1/3.3 sec 0-60mph/0-100kph would take a major upgrade in current and bigger motors without a change in measurement approach. Remembering that the P85D was listed at 3.2 sec 0-60 (With rollout ) and that the P85D power output was around 345KW. Since 100D power output was previously around 310KW it would only take another 40-50 KW output to bring it on par with the P85D performance specs (IF the numbers are being listed with the rollout time now).

I believe @R.S had previously mentioned the small motors on D cars are capable of about 190KW each. Assuming 350KW output on the upspeced 100Ds, this is still likely within the smaller motor capabilities.

Tesla deliberately uses the rollout method on P cars, while using true 0-60 times on non P cars, this is part of their marketing segmentation strategy. It makes the P cars look faster than they are compared to non P cars. Perhaps they've started using this same market segmentation approach for the 100D to justify it's price premium in the eyes of buyers (Along with a small bump in power)

 

[R.S]

I think you are on to something here. My take is: Getting the 100D down to 3.1/3.3 sec 0-60mph/0-100kph would take a major upgrade in current and bigger motors without a change in measurement approach. Remembering that the P85D was listed at 3.2 sec 0-60 (With rollout ) and that the P85D power output was around 345KW. Since 100D power output was previously around 310KW it would only take another 40-50 KW output to bring it on par with the P85D performance specs (IF the numbers are being listed with the rollout time now).

I believe @R.S had previously mentioned the small motors on D cars are capable of about 190KW each. Assuming 350KW output on the upspeced 100Ds, this is still likely within the smaller motor capabilities.

Tesla deliberately uses the rollout method on P cars, while using true 0-60 times on non P cars, this is part of their marketing segmentation strategy. It makes the P cars look faster than they are compared to non P cars. Perhaps they've started using this same market segmentation approach for the 100D to justify it's price premium in the eyes of buyers (Along with a small bump in power)

The big difference between a 350kW 100D and the 345kW P85D is still the big rear motor. Especially in 0-30, when the motors are still in their constant torque phase, the 515kW combined P85D motors have a huge advantage.

What it all comes down to, is that the P85D can reach 345kW much quicker, while maintaining a high top speed. Different gearing could improve the 100D as well, but it might be limited to a much lower top speed afterwards. Which leads to the interesting conclusion, that a two speed gearbox could really improve the performance of an electric vehicle.

But I am still skeptical about those 3.3s. I'd really love it and I think more differentiation between the 75D and the 100D is needed, especially since there already are rumors about the 75 being replaced by an 85. The price difference is already too steep and letting the base vehicle have even more range would make the 100D somewhat obsolete.

But IMO the only way to really get to 3.3s, at least while using the current measurement methods, is only possible with a big rear motor.

 

[ccdisce]

Here are the screenprints from the car I bought August 26 (first day of Q3 sales in NL):

- the first one is taken 3:28AM (20 hours and 32 minutes before the sale started in The Netherlands)
- the second one is taken 1:00PM (1 hour after the 3Q sales started in The Netherlands)
- the third one is taken around 07:00PM (about 7 hours after the 3Q sales started in The Netherlands)

Please notice:
- battery, range and acceleration were not specified before the 3Q sales started
- during the night, the initial price reduction was corrected upwards (€400)

I definitely settled the deal 01:27PM and the Tesla salesperson confirmed that #195724 was claimed at 01:29PM.

CL600 ,
do you still have a copy of the URL of the spec sheet? if you do could you put it through the options decoder to see what options were selected by the build computer to build your 100D.

 

[R.S]

Except that there is no "big" rear motor. The performance motors are very similar to if not identical to the regular motors. The "big" difference being the higher torque limited settings are limited higher on the "Performance" motor than they are to the 100D, and the 100D is limited higher than the 75D uncorked, and the 75D uncorked is limited higher than the 75D corked.
So yes it needs a higher torque limit. But no the drive unit doesn't need a "P" sticker. And it won't likely get a "P" sticker because the P stickers are reserved for the "P" cars. And what many of us here are supposing is that the reason the 100D would get 3.3 seconds is because the upcoming performance cars are getting increased performance as well.

You are confusing the P and non P motors, with the small and the big motor. There actually is no difference between P and non P motors, that's true. The motor in a P85 is the same as in a 60 and the motors in the 75D are the same as in the 100D. But the 75 has a different motor, than the two in the 75D.

Tesla has a small motor that they use as both the front and the rear motor on the regular Ds and a larger motor used on the RWD cars and as a rear motor on the PD's.

 

[Krash]

You are confusing the P and non P motors, with the small and the big motor. There actually is no difference between P and non P motors, that's true. The motor in a P85 is the same as in a 60 and the motors in the 75D are the same as in the 100D. But the 75 has a different motor, than the two in the 75D.

Yes I am mixing up my terms. I deleted my post. I still think that the smaller DU00 rear motor could do 3.3 with the DU00 front motor but you are correct that I do not have any evidence for this so I will wait and see.

 

[R.S]

Yes I am mixing up my terms. I deleted my post. I still think that the smaller DU00 rear motor could do 3.3 with the DU00 front motor but you are correct that I do not have any evidence for this so I will wait and see.

That really isn't your fault. It's pretty hard to navigate the TMMM (Tesla-Motors-motor-mess). They have stated so many different hp ratings before they said something along the lines of: "Power doesn't actually matter anyways"