Petition to rollback 5.8s suspension behavior modification at high speeds

[dsm363]

For me, 5.8 is a big improvement over 4.5, and the suspension thing has not impacted me in any way over the past few days of highway driving.

Having said that, I think updates should be optional (to a point) and there should be some sort of rollback capability. I can see the need to keep withing, say, one or two release versions or it would just get too difficult for Tesla to manage.

I honestly can't tell the difference after the update. It's not like the higher setting disables the car and keeps you from taking road trips. Yes, it you were planning a 265 mile trip on level ground all on the highway at 65 mph it would make you stop and charge maybe unless you could drive 60mph that is.

While they can 'take away ' features they also can add them and lots of them without having to go to the dealership like you would with any other car. Both positives and negatives with this feature I guess.

I really think a petition is an over reaction and wouldn't do anything useful anyway. I'm sure they know some people are upset already.

 

[SFOTurtle]

For me, 5.8 is a big improvement over 4.5, and the suspension thing has not impacted me in any way over the past few days of highway driving.

Having said that, I think updates should be optional (to a point) and there should be some sort of rollback capability. I can see the need to keep withing, say, one or two release versions or it would just get too difficult for Tesla to manage.

With the added drag of being slightly higher at freeway speeds, 5.8 has probably cost you and me a couple of few pennies so far. OMG, the horror, the horror!!

 

[Al Sherman]

I'm not interested in the petition. I DID however just now install 5.8. I'm going for a drive to see if I can tell any difference.

 

[yobigd20]

With the added drag of being slightly higher at freeway speeds, 5.8 has probably cost you and me a couple of few pennies so far. OMG, the horror, the horror!!

I wonder how the media would react if GM rolled out a change (assuming they had the capability) to suddenly make their entire fleet of vehicles 1 mpg less efficient without telling anyone because "they felt like doing it".

I'm just a little miffed at the fact that Tesla is dictating to us what they feel is safe vs not and then forcing/tricking/duping everyone to comply.

Mucho-negative points to Tesla on this one. This is a royal-PR screw up.

 

[pramirez19]

I disagree. Car companies should dictate what they feel is safe when the image of their product is the only thing keeping them in business. If they did nothing to address this, the next headline for a Model S fire will read: "Tesla Fire #4 - Is Tesla Doing Anything to Address This!?", which I think would be far more of a PR problem than you not having Air Ride automatically lower your car for 2 months. I'm looking forward to the update in January, since I have a 60kW and would like to make the trip to Indianapolis from Chicago (209 miles for me) and could use the .24 drag coefficient to help get me there, but I don't see a need for a petition. Tesla is balancing this well, in my opinion.

 

[PeterK]

Nice capture of how some of us feel at this point. It's part of why I basically didn't bother to read the forums most of yesterday.

+1

And my guess is that if you read the owner agreements carefully, we've already given them the right to make such changes without our consent.

 

[SFOTurtle]

I wonder how the media would react if GM rolled out a change (assuming they had the capability) to suddenly make their entire fleet of vehicles 1 mpg less efficient without telling anyone because "they felt like doing it".

I'm just a little miffed at the fact that Tesla is dictating to us what they feel is safe vs not and then forcing/tricking/duping everyone to comply.

Mucho-negative points to Tesla on this one. This is a royal-PR screw up.

That's life, and I agreed to take the update and other updates when I bought the car and to give Tesla the right to put whatever functionality it deems appropriate in the update. Time will tell if this is a royal PR screw up or not. That's really another thread. I don't think it's worth threats of petitions, lawsuits, demands for full refunds, etc. Now if they issued an update that prevented me from driving the car on the highway or at night or in the rain, well then I imagine I'd feel differently. I haven't experienced any dimunition in use to the car.

 

[BobHodgen]

If you're making a trip where the added drag by not lowering .79 inch at speed will make a difference you're cutting it too close. I doubt you'd be able to tell the decreased range without repeated tests to eliminate all of the other variables like speed, wind, slope, temperature, barometric pressure, etc.

The Model S corners just fine at the standard height, we don't take every corner in excess of 60 mph!

I'm not upset, I got the air suspension primarily to clear speed bumps and curbs. It still does that.

To me, this comes under the heading of "first world problems."

 

[RoverS]

To me, this comes under the heading of "first world problems."

I got another name for it, but I feel ya...

 

[Al Sherman]

Just got back from my 5.8 test drive. No big deal.

I can tell it's less responsive at high speeds. But certainly not out of control.

I think I like the new regen. It's more civilized. I'll bet we're getting the same amount of energy back also. You'll probably need brakes to come to a complete stop on level ground as opposed to before though. Maybe in the future a third setting can be available for folks that like the old way better. Should be easy to do.

I DID notice a faint electrical hum seeming to come from behind the passenger side rear door area whenever the power was set at 5-10 kW. Absolutely there. Absolutely not there this morning under 5.6, or ever before. I can reproduce it every time. ???

Other than that, still a magnificent machine!

 

[fluxemag]

This thread is why I'm glad I never have to deal with the public as customers.

 

[Todd Burch]

Sorry, I stand with Tesla on this one. I believe they're making the right decision. The future of the company and the public's perception of EV safety is far more important than any of us having our car suspensions drop 1" on the highway for the next 2 months. IMHO, Tesla owners concerned about temporarily losing the low suspension height at highway speeds are overreacting just as much as the media's reaction to the fires.

For the record, I drive on the highway every day during my commute, and don't notice a significant loss in efficiency. This is temporary folks. Suck it up for two months, for the good of something more important.

Another thing that bugs the crap out of me: can we stop complaining for a second about one thing that Tesla takes away temporarily for the overall good, and say thanks that we drive a car that gets better the longer we own it?

 

[SFOTurtle]

Sorry, I stand with Tesla on this one. I believe they're making the right decision. The future of the company and the public's perception of EV safety is far more important than any of us having our car suspensions drop 1" on the highway for the next 2 months. IMHO, Tesla owners concerned about temporarily losing the low suspension height at highway speeds are overreacting just as much as the media's reaction to the fires.

For the record, I drive on the highway every day during my commute, and don't notice a significant loss in efficiency. This is temporary folks. Suck it up for two months, for the good of something more important.

I agree 1000%.

 

[AmpedRealtor]

I'm with Tesla as well. Several days ago I was concerned about the "removal" of a paid feature in the absence of any other information. Now that Elon has put it into context, however, I am squarely behind Tesla and support their decision. As Elon said in his blog post, the feature will return in January. His word is good enough for me. I can wait a couple of months for the feature to return, and probably in an improved form.

 

[wormhole]

I'm with Tesla as well. Several days ago I was concerned about the "removal" of a paid feature in the absence of any other information. Now that Elon has put it into context, however, I am squarely behind Tesla and support their decision. As Elon said in his blog post, the feature will return in January. His word is good enough for me. I can wait a couple of months for the feature to return, and probably in an improved form.

Put it into context? How so? Bottom line, 1) even set at LOW, the MS is still higher off the ground than other production cars, 2) keeping it at standard height doesn't eliminate the risk of running over debris (nothing eliminates that risk), 3) and it was taken away prior to any communication whatsoever. So what is the 'context'? It doesn't do anything other than take away a paid feature.

And I will bet that the feature isn't re introduce in January...don't get me wrong, love the car and company, but they've missed on EVERY date they've put out there...every one

1. Vampire Drain fix
2. Supercharger Rollout
3. Original Delivery Dates
4. Center Console Insert
5. etc etc etc....

 

[Beavis]

Just got back from my 5.8 test drive. No big deal.

I can tell it's less responsive at high speeds. But certainly not out of control.

I think I like the new regen. It's more civilized. I'll bet we're getting the same amount of energy back also. You'll probably need brakes to come to a complete stop on level ground as opposed to before though. Maybe in the future a third setting can be available for folks that like the old way better. Should be easy to do.

I DID notice a faint electrical hum seeming to come from behind the passenger side rear door area whenever the power was set at 5-10 kW. Absolutely there. Absolutely not there this morning under 5.6, or ever before. I can reproduce it every time. ???

Other than that, still a magnificent machine!

I agree with you on it being less responsive at freeway speeds. I think it feels different in a bad way and I look forward to them giving me the option on the auto leveling, as long as it is the same height. As for the poll, I've already asked to be rolled back to 5.6. Like everyone else who asked, the answer is no.

 

[Newscutter]

I have weighed all the intra-day "bickering" and come to the conclusion that the solution is really quite simple:

Tesla should offer to purchase back all the cars whose owners are unsatisfied with their cars now that they ride less than inch higher. Furthermore, this offer should be extended to all non-air suspension owners who are also dismayed at the prospect of receiving one unwanted update in addition to the potential life-of-car updates full of new features.

The repurchased cars can be used to jump-start the Model S Certified Preowned program and allow new drivers to join the ranks of the oppressed and manipulated masses who have already blindly accepted the world's best car, "warts" and all.

Everybody wins.

Or, alternatively, if a rollback is offered, you could then use a hammer to disable future updates. I'm sure someone here can point you to the correct sensitive component to obliterate. After all, even comparable $100k cars are sometimes in need of a good whack (since this comparison is so frequently made).

 

[bluetinc]

I really think a petition is an over reaction and wouldn't do anything useful anyway. I'm sure they know some people are upset already.

I disagree. I think this type adult reaction, (not an over-reaction of requesting refunds and involving lawyers immediately) helps Tesla keep their eye on the ball. In the cases where owners were very clear they were unhappy, for example 3 phase charging for Europe or Sleep Mode, Tesla has made sure to do what was necessary to bring the car up to snuff. In the cases that there was not a strong push by owners, such as the sunshade or lighted vanity mirrors or wifi access point (and insert others here), those things have fallen by the wayside even though they were promised.

I disagree. Car companies should dictate what they feel is safe when the image of their product is the only thing keeping them in business. If they did nothing to address this, the next headline for a Model S fire will read: "Tesla Fire #4 - Is Tesla Doing Anything to Address This!?", which I think would be far more of a PR problem than you not having Air Ride automatically lower your car for 2 months. I'm looking forward to the update in January, since I have a 60kW and would like to make the trip to Indianapolis from Chicago (209 miles for me) and could use the .24 drag coefficient to help get me there, but I don't see a need for a petition. Tesla is balancing this well, in my opinion.

Not to rehash what I just said above, but perhaps you should re-read the exact wording of both Elon and Ownerships responses this Owners on this. It should be clear that a January update that re-enables Fridays functionality (user selectable or not), is anything but a sure thing.

If you're making a trip where the added drag by not lowering .79 inch at speed will make a difference you're cutting it too close. I doubt you'd be able to tell the decreased range without repeated tests to eliminate all of the other variables like speed, wind, slope, temperature, barometric pressure, etc.

The Model S corners just fine at the standard height, we don't take every corner in excess of 60 mph!

I'm not upset, I got the air suspension primarily to clear speed bumps and curbs. It still does that.

To me, this comes under the heading of "first world problems."

Perhaps this is a Florida vs. Mid Atlantic/ North East thing, but if you drive 60 through the turns on the highways here, you are 10-20 miles under the average speed of most cars on the road.

 

[Todd Burch]

To those complaining about this not being the car you paid for, you're right. When I bought it, there was no heading up orientation on the map. Superchargers and visited chargers weren't available on the map either. The car now consumes less power than it did when i bought it, not more. The car didn't have creep capability when I bought it. Now it does. When I bought the car, preheating used the battery. Now it uses shore power. I could go on and on.

Not the same car, indeed. Elon stated the ride height adjustment capability will be back. Hold him to it. That's fine.

Tesla's not doing this because they believe it makes you safer. They're doing it to quell the PR issues, and because the PERCEPTION of another fire (no matter how incorrect) would be very harmful to the future of the company. And yes, the new height could still result in a debris impact and fire. But every inch higher means significantly less probability of such an instance happening again.

If this pisses you off to no end, take a step back and breathe. I have to say that people annoyed that their $120K car temporarily rides an inch higher on the highway need to take a moment and be grateful that they're driving what multiple independent reviewers have essentially called the best overall car in the world. If there were "zeroth world problems", this would be it.

- - - Updated - - -

Perhaps this is a Florida vs. Mid Atlantic/ North East thing, but if you drive 60 through the turns on the highways here, you are 10-20 miles under the average speed of most cars on the road.

In the military, we called this quibbling. Even at 90 MPH, curves on highways are not sharp enough for the difference in ride height to matter significantly. Surely you know that.

 

[jerry33]

Interesting when taken in context with this comment made earlier in the thread...

This is the "Ask ten Tesla employees, get 12 different answers".

- - - Updated - - -

Here is an interesting tidbit:

Tesla is calling ALL owners not updated to assure 100% compliance with 5.8.

Isn't that how Stanley Steamer went under? They had a car that was fast, reliable, quiet, and well ahead of other car made at the time, but they were so heavy handed with the car owners that people stopped purchasing them.

Seems a little heavy handed, or perhaps this was an NHTSA mandate to have all cars modified this way.

I can't see any NHTSA mandates happening until they have finished their analysis. With luck, there won't be any mandates after it's finished.