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Range Loss Over Time, What Can Be Expected, Efficiency, How to Maintain Battery Health
- Thread starter KK_RedM3
- Start date
Got an ODB2 adapter finally, and plugged Scan My Tesla.
I have a July-2019 built model 3 performance stealth, delivered in Australia early September 2019.
I had reported concerns to Tesla back in December, after TeslaFi reported a sudden drop in November (from 4% degradation to 8%). Tesla analysed the log and determined a faulty 12V batteries that prevented the car from going into deep sleep mode and the BMS to do its work.
They replaced the battery, told me to charge to 100% and down to < 20% a couple of times to recalibrate the BMS.
They found that the degradation was 7.8% and was within specs.
Since the range reported has continued to drop.
Now it shows a nominal full pack of 69.7kWh (from 77.8kWh new); a 10.4% degradation after just 15 months and 14,700km (9160 miles); 66 charge cycle
What worries the most, is that it steadily goes down after each recharge.
I did to the 90 - 20% over January as discussed in that other thread; with no improvement.
What do you guys think?
Nothing to worry about?
I have a July-2019 built model 3 performance stealth, delivered in Australia early September 2019.
I had reported concerns to Tesla back in December, after TeslaFi reported a sudden drop in November (from 4% degradation to 8%). Tesla analysed the log and determined a faulty 12V batteries that prevented the car from going into deep sleep mode and the BMS to do its work.
They replaced the battery, told me to charge to 100% and down to < 20% a couple of times to recalibrate the BMS.
They found that the degradation was 7.8% and was within specs.
Since the range reported has continued to drop.
Now it shows a nominal full pack of 69.7kWh (from 77.8kWh new); a 10.4% degradation after just 15 months and 14,700km (9160 miles); 66 charge cycle
What worries the most, is that it steadily goes down after each recharge.
I did to the 90 - 20% over January as discussed in that other thread; with no improvement.
What do you guys think?
Nothing to worry about?
Candleflame
Active Member
For those guys plugging the car every day, have you tried charging to 100%, turning sentry/summon on demand/overheat protection/etc off, and then letting battery discharge to 30% or so over a few days, so the SOC is reported overnight at different SOCs? That supposedly 'recalibrates' the algorithm, for what I've read. Then charge back to 80% max. It'd be best to do that every 3 months or so. But let's hear from an expert like AlanSubie, and see what he says.
it only recalibrates if you are not calibrated. which doesnt apply to most users.
Candleflame
Active Member
*sugar* pack. There is some sort of problem with the initial Model 3 deliveries to Australia (which includes everyone with an australian stealth 3). A lot of people think it had something to do with the 12V battery failure which may have disabled the BMS for a month or so. I'm not so sure about that...
I'm also down to 45x km (like 8-9% degradation) with 30k km on the clock on my stealth.
Unfortunately 30% degradation is a long way away and its one of these annoying things where it unfortunately does not degrade fast enough to get an early new battery pack.
I don't think without a class action law suit there is any chance unfortunately. They advertise a 499km pack but deliver this only for the first 5-10k km following by a rapid drop way beyond what most people see.
This is also the reason things like calibrations, repeated discharges etc do not work to increase the range for us - the issue is somewhere else and something has damaged the pack causing early wear.
That was the explanation given by Tesla and was the first time I had heard about it.
Apparently prior mid-October, the software was draining the 12V battery too much, causing premature wear.
My original delivery had been delayed by 10 days already due to a dead 12V batteries, and when the mobile technician came to change my 12V battery, the old one had a build date of October 2019 ; which leads me to believe that in all this car has seen 4 12V batteries since it was built.
oh, you calculate the battery degradation from the "Full pack when new" figure ; mine shows 451km now. Originally it was 499km, which is "only" 9.6% degradation.
Candleflame
Active Member
That would be odd because it's only our Australian Teslas which were effected by this 12v failure. I have a USA battery in mine... I think builddate was August or september. Not that that means much apparently Tesla shipped usa batteries over to us so the date on the battery doesnt tell you much. I certainly have not had any issues with my 12V battery. From looking at the sleep/wake cycles of the care when it doesnt get used it has probably lost 20-30% of its capacity over the 16 months which is ok.
The thing is that if it affects calibration that is ok (i.e. if the car gets kept awake all the time), but that is unfortunately not the case. no amount of re-calibration can undo the battery degradation which is very real.
edit:
yeah so extrapolated from your kwh max thats like 70.5kwh for me which is what I see anyway by extrapolating it from my range or from the cars computed remaining range...
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Candleflame
Active Member
it would be interesting to rip a few cells out of the initial australian model 3s and see how much charge they hold... whether its all just a huge BMS issue or real degradation.
I have not heard of anyone requesting a CAC reset for those cars...
Maybe you could request one given that Tesla acknowledges that you might have a BMS issue?
I have not heard of anyone requesting a CAC reset for those cars...
Maybe you could request one given that Tesla acknowledges that you might have a BMS issue?
Candleflame
Active Member
ucmndd
Well-Known Member
Or, charge along the way for 10 minutes and drive as fast as you want without needing to do something utterly stupid like “drafting” a semi going 80mph.
Watts_Up
Well-Known Member
You should review the consumption graph of your trip. (Like this graph from this thread)
When looking at the elevation map, there are some major passes of two thousand feet or so.
So I imagine that when starting from Los Angeles, a major part of the energy was used to reach Victorville
You should use ABRP to have a better idea of the trip consumption and range.
I just made a quick search using your input (2018 M3 LR AWD 18") starting from San Bernardino.
With a speed a 65 miles per hour from San Bernardino to Las Vegas, and a speed of 68 miles per hour on the way back
the ABRP tool using a 278 Watt per miles at 65 miles per hour let you make the ride without using a supercharger.
This tool is quite reliable but I don't think it includes a possible loss of 2 to 4 % for the battery capacity for this 2018 car,
also you have to consider wind and temperature and number of passengers and luggage and so on.
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Watts_Up
Well-Known Member
A more realistic situation would be to use a speed limit of 78 miles per hour as you mentioned,
and I found the following trips information:
You can noticed that the total trip duration are very similar between
- lowering the speed to avoid superchargers, and
- driving faster but making quick stops at a supercharger.
and I found the following trips information:
You can noticed that the total trip duration are very similar between
- lowering the speed to avoid superchargers, and
- driving faster but making quick stops at a supercharger.
DonTom
Member
I believe the mile spec is for 65 MPH and seems accurate to me at that speed. The best range is at 38 MPH, IIRC, and at that speed, expect better than 400 miles of range,
At 78 MPH, I would expect poor range.
If you can drive a steady 65 MPH, you should be able to do the 241 miles, if not better. Set the cruise control when you can.
-Don- Reno, NV
Candleflame
Active Member
nominal capacity is the BMS estimated range/capacity.
nominal capacity is just your rated range multiplied by a constent (like 0.147wh for the model 3 performance/awd) or even easier to just multiple the true estimated range x average consumption in the trip meter when charged to 100%, or close to 100%.
ucmndd
Well-Known Member
Sorry boss. Your post and assumptions (i.e. " you can go 80 and the penalty is similar to driving 60") are just plain wrong.
Digital Debunking: Could Drafting Really Improve Fuel Efficiency on the Highway? - The Altair Blog
MarcG
Active Member
“if the truck came to a sudden stop”
Curious minds inquire: Unless a loaded semi hits a wall, how does it come to a “sudden stop”?
Curious minds inquire: Unless a loaded semi hits a wall, how does it come to a “sudden stop”?
MountainRatMat
Member
What terrible advice by ABRP on the route out to Vegas, you want to arrive at a Supercharger with a much lower state of charge to improve charge rate. Go to Baker, top up for 15 min then on to Vegas.
The route back home is much better, it is much faster to arrive at a Supercharger with a lower state of charge than high state of charge because the battery will charge faster that way.
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