Ultron
Member
why not just make the yoke an option. Problem solved. But to force the yoke on everyone who buys the car will have a negative effect on sales.
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Reuters: "Tesla readies revamped Model 3 with project 'Highland' -sources" [projected 3rd quarter 2023]
- Thread starter 3sr+buyer
- Start date
Refreshed Model S/X owners seem to manage?
I drove one, seems fine for both of these. Although I realized I must rest my hand at the top of the wheel because it took some adjustment to the yoke. But the yoke definitely seems better for highway driving.
S and X are niche cars going to hardcore Tesla fans with costing well over $100k… hardly Model 3 or Y volumes
It's still regular people. And if you're buying a $60K car, it's not like you're used to taking the bus everywhere.
It's like 5 years ago someone would make the argument "you can't expect regular people to interface with the car via a giant iPad screen". People manage.
I don't believe on the yoke for model 3 and Y. I find much more likely just the removal of stalks adding the buttons on a normal round steering wheel.
The yoke will still be treated as luxury for the more exclusive vehicles S and X.
Single cast Front and Rear body I think it is happening.
The yoke will still be treated as luxury for the more exclusive vehicles S and X.
Single cast Front and Rear body I think it is happening.
I realize there are lots of 'leaks and reports'. But I'm not believing the Model 3 will get any substantial refresh, as a standalone update.
The 3/Y are just too closely related to update one and not the other. Just like with the S/X refresh.
So could a 'revamped' Model 3 debut? Sure. But probably in 2024+, alongside changes to the Y.
The 3/Y are just too closely related to update one and not the other. Just like with the S/X refresh.
So could a 'revamped' Model 3 debut? Sure. But probably in 2024+, alongside changes to the Y.
ElectricIAC
Good-Natured Rascal
heavyD
Member
Yeah but the Model 3 has been out for years while the Model Y is a newer, fresher product even if it's overall design is very similar to the Model 3. Model 3 sales have dipped and refreshing the styling is a good way to boost sales as it makes for a bigger reason for existing Model 3 users to upgrade to the refreshed models. The longer they keep the styling the same as when introduced the less reason they are giving for existing owners to upgrade and a big part of the automobile industry is the 4/5 year model cycles that allow brands to sell more cars to repeat customers.
Maybe in 5 years. Tesla is already behind on the Roadster, Cybertruck and (maybe?) whatever the robotaxi is going to be. They need to get the Cybertruck ramped and pumping out volume in order to keep up free cash flow. That will take a few years.
Everything you're saying would be applicable to the Model S vs X, yet those got their major refreshes at the same time. And the 3/Y share much more parts/design than the S/X.
It's all about economies of scale with Tesla. If they refresh the 3, but not the Y, then their incremental cost per vehicle goes up, not down. Notice how close the 3/Y are today? They're closer in parts/features than they've ever been in the past. Tesla has essentially 'converged' the 3/Y and surely that was on purpose for cost + efficiencies.
Unlikely they'll break that convergence strategy, especially for the vehicle (the 3) that's the lesser of the two in volume and growth trajectory.
ZenRockGarden
Active Member
It's a nice dream, but the reality of the mega-casts has been that they don't really save weight nor make things stiffer - they are vastly easier to assemble and there's potentially fewer alignment issues, but it's really just cheaper, not "better" from an end user experience.
I also think the 4680 pack is optimistic - they've not shown they can make a LR pack with full range, and they also cannot make enough cells to cover even the already-designed Model Y 4680 pack at full Model Y output.
Expect the cabin to be revised and simplified, USS sensors removed, yoke, stalks, new cameras, and yeah maybe minor exterior facelift plus a ton of further details under the skin that relate purely to manufacturing efficiency (which is good - get those costs down so Tesla can out-compete others on price)
heavyD
Member
The Model S and X are low volume sellers so not really applicable IMO. Not exactly sure why you believe incremental cost per vehicle going up. The Model 3 and Y don't share any exterior sheet metal or body panels and the rumores changes are mostly cosmetic with some rumoured cost cutting changes on the interior and underpinnings. There are photos of the refreshed Model 3's with the front and rear ends covered. It's absolutely coming.
TunaBug
Member
There is some past behavior to support what you say. When the Y was released it did not take long for the 3 to get an updated interior based on the Y. For many items that are shared (for example, the steering wheel and display) I remain skeptical that they would change one and not the other.
But the 3 is a laggard right now in that it does not have the megacastings that are in the Y, nor the structural battery pack. Those updates would be a win for both Tesla and consumers: lower cost of assembly with less opportunity for mis-assembly, and a more rigid chassis that should improve the driving experience.
The 3/Y interiors are 95%(I'm guessing) identical, so if you're going to change up the 3's interior then the Y would change too - else costs go up.
I saw the spy photos, but the 3/Y share the same tail lights and headlights. So why would they change one and not the other? If they did, costs would go up. If all we're talking about is updated bumpers for the 3, well that's really not much of anything.
Obviously it would make sense for the 3 to get the same updated casting design as the Y. But that doesn't mean the 3 has to change appearance. From the outside all versions of the Y appear the same.
heavyD
Member
If you have seen the spy photos then why are you denying change is coming? Automakers don't go through the trouble of molding new body panels for shits and giggles. I have never seen camo-cars rolling around in public not become reality within a year. Once they are seen driving around it's in the works and very close.
I never said there wouldn't be any change coming. I said I don't expect any substantial update, especially ones as wild as I've seen speculated. And anything beyond cosmetic bumpers, I would expect to see carried over to the Y, as well.
ZenRockGarden
Active Member
I'd build on that point: other than a minor external cosmetic tweak, I expect the changes to be almost completely in two areas: Feature-deletion, and under-the-cover-changes-to-make-it-cheaper-to-assemble.
I could buy into that. Sure, a yoke, stalk-delete and maybe a few more tweaks (that will all come to the Y at the same time or soon thereafter) make sense.
But these speculations about a wild 'revamp' with 4680s, Plaid-version, air-suspension and other major customer-facing enhancements just seem like clickbait or wishful thinking.
In theory, Tesla would want to use the same ones for both (they are currently physically interchangeable).
However, for some reason, there has been at least a few years where different versions of headlights and taillights were being installed on new Model 3 and Y. See the Global/Premium headlights threads and the taillights with red versus amber turn signals.
Understood that there have been slight differences in lights. But my point was that they've now converged (finally), so splitting them to divergent parts/paths would make little sense.
Great news tonight on the steering wheel coming back to the S/X.
Not so great news is that the stalks didn’t make a comeback along with the wheel.
Not so great news is that the stalks didn’t make a comeback along with the wheel.
