If that's the case, why anyone would bother to purchase an EV? That's not practical.
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Wiki Sudden Loss Of Range With 2019.16.x Software
- Thread starter Dutchmeeuw
- Start date
If that's the case, why anyone would bother to purchase an EV? That's not practical.
This advice runs counter to what has been preached here for years - that the best way to preserve the health of the battery is to keep it neither at a high SOC nor at a low SOC. Keeping the battery averaging at 50% SOC has been the advice for how to best prolong the battery.
I think they just throw an random number out as diagnostic fee. Last year I took my 1 year old Model X (not CPO) to a service center to fix a problem where the driver door won't open at all. The girl there said she is going to charge me a $75 diagnostic fee. I asked why.. it is under new car warranty and you can clearly see the door is not opening.. something is wrong with the car. She then went on and said oh if you have anything plug into the 12 volts, we will charge you a diagnostic fee. So, I said okay sure.. since I have nothing plugged in. I think she thought I must have a dashcam or something wired to it and will back down and go away or something.
It’s probably true for Li-Ion batteries in general, but as you stated, is not useful for an EV. There is a balance to be had between longevity and practicality. My Stihl Li-Ion batteries say to store them at 20-30% charge for max life.
Ferrycraigs
Member
OK. That’s some change in consumption due to winter! Wow.
I understand you are suspicious whether Projected Range includes the buffer. I agree, it certainly makes no sense to do so. Your confidence that it doesn’t forced me to wonder if I was misinterpreting my figures. So I thought I would go out and just re check them.
My figures from today are:
My Ave consumption 213 Wh/mi. (This is an unusually low figure as my 55,000 mile average is 328 Wh/mi).
My Projected Range is 238 miles.
My SoC% is 83%
From those figures my Capacity works out at 213*238/83%=61.07kWh. (Should be 71.2 kWh)
TMSpy reading the data off the CANBUS shows my Total Capacity (including the buffer) is 60.9kWhs. So pretty close. Less than 1 kWh out.
SoC of 83% of 61kWh (so including the 4kWh buffer)=50.6kWh.
Divided 50.6 by .213 Consumption gives a Range of 237 miles. Pretty close to the Projected Range of 238.
So from those figures I conclude that the Projected Range does include the buffer. Excluding the buffer means 46.6/.223=218 miles. A pretty mad system, unless Tesla want to give the impression that the car's range is more than it actually is.
If you can see a flaw in my calculations, please say. It wouldn’t be the first time. I used to trust my brain, but now ........
That's not the Tesla's official best practices for charging. "A happy Tesla is a Plugged in Tesla", "Charge to 90%", etc. has been their recommendations from day one. Tesla has never said anything close to what you are stating either verbally or in writing to the owners. The opposite is true:
An owner asking Elon Musk:
"any insight on the best nightly SoC for battery longevity? 90%, 70%, 50%?
Any software fix for unbalanced cells due to sub 90% nightly charges?"
LikeTesla on Twitter
Elon Musk advising:
"Not worth going below 80% imo. Even 90% is still fine. Also, no issue going to 5% or lower SoC."
Elon Musk on Twitter
How do you think the people who have a very daily commute would charge nightly? They have been told by Tesla to charge overnight to 90% and leave it plugged in till morning.
ChargeGate must be 'degradation' dependant too?
I charged my S 70D Oct 2015 with SoC + kW > 98 this christmas with SW 2019.40.2.3. Best thoughput was at higher SoC. Attached App-screenshot shows 42kW at 56%
Attachments
Not sure what you are referring to.
So, you are also in the same boat with regard to the chargegate, looks like.
Hmmm, how come you quote Tesla for recommendations, when you assume you have a Tesla BMS that fried your battery?
It is almost a fact that:
- Consistently cycling at high SoC or consistenly rest at high SoC, will hide recoverable capacity loss to BMS
- Consistently charging at high rate and low temperature will permanently degrade capacity
You can take Elon's word that always charging to 90% has no impact, but then you should question Elon and not me, when you discover the impact?
Ohhh, that's important! It argues that some banks have much higher internal resistance than others (A little difficult to grasp when each module has 70+ batteries in parallel). Woulod be interesting to know/learn the sampling period, 500mV or 0,5V seems large on a chemistry that has 3,2 V at empty and 4,2V at full!!!
Why not? Tesla is the manufacturer of my car. Are you suggesting the owners should not follow the manufacturer's guidelines? Or, you believe the manufacturers can not screw up with their software? And, if they do, the owners should not complain because the owners follow the manufacturer's recommendation?
My battery, for your information, is not fried! Please don't make stuff up.
These might be "almost" academically true, and believe me I've read all of them, but they are not in my owners' manual and spelled out by Tesla elsewhere.
And, those facts you are stating work for a smart watch. Tesla cars are equipped with sophisticated BMS, per Tesla, and with battery pack cooling and heating systems.
You brought it up by directly replying to one of my posts. Elon did not call me today. I was just answering you that what you stated is not the official Tesla's recommendation.
And, just as a reminder to you as an owner, if you don't follow Tesla's recommendations they blame you, and possibly voiding your warranty. They do not blame someone else who their advice you followed on Internet
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I fear you have overooked a few details?
The post you indirectly quote states:
roschke, Dec 27, 2019
↑
I supercharged yesterday from 40% to 90%, and when done, the pump ran for 5 hours while the car was parked and plugged in. Lost 1 mile per hour by the pump running off of the HV battery. The outside temperature of about 50F.
Today, with the navigation destination set to the supercharger:
- The battery warming up icon was visible on the app
- Charged from 40% to 80%
- Outside temperature: 47F
- Charging speed: started at a pitiful 36kW steady to mid 20kW toward the end
- The cooling pump: Did not run at all
So the poster was able to charge 36 kW at 40% with 400V battery pack
My data are 42 kW at 56% so much higher on my 350V battery pack.
Of course temperature can affect results, but perhaps Battery gate (which has hit all old battery packs) is as well somehwat nuanced.
I think it would be nice if you skim posts for new info instead of statements that you can oppose?
(I now understand why this thread is so long!)
I propose you write Jeff Dahn and ask if he recommends resting a Model S Battery at 70% or 90%?
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At this point I have no clue what you are talking about. You are not making any sense with these posts. You sound more interested in a choppy conversation, jumping from one topic to the next with no clear indication on what you want to prove. Your latest post itself is a good example.
That poster is me, not another poster
What? I did not oppose anything. I shared my charging experience with others. I think you are badly confused.
No, no, no. Don't propose it to me. You do it and post his reply here. Deal?
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At this point I have no clue what you are talking about. You are not making any sense with these posts. You sound more interested in a choppy conversation, jumping from one topic to the next with no clear indication on what you want to prove. Your latest post itself is a good example.
That poster is me, not another poster
So what is it that you dont understand in:
'So the poster (== Drosche) was able to charge 36 kW at 40% with 400V battery pack
My data (== jensk2) are 42 kW at 56% so much higher on my 350V battery pack.'
Given that AbetterRoutePlanner reports a 70D Supercharging as being around 10 kW BELOW an 85 Supercharging, your battery gate appears far lower than mine?
Tesla Supercharging - Summer 2019 Update
So what? Am I to understand that two cars get charged differently?
I don't need to ask Jeff, he already stated 70% in 2017!
Tesla Battery Expert's Recommendation For Maximum Battery Life - Video
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