Wiki Sudden Loss Of Range With 2019.16.x Software

[Ferrycraigs]

Not a fluke. It's happened twice more where it requires a manual reboot. Plus every day for the last 5 days or so, it's been rebooting spontaneously 2 or 3 times a day. It always comes back up and is fine even playing my podcast or whatever exactly where it left off.

I'll probably try a factory reset as a last resort. Usually the MCUs do mini reboot loops when they're going bad and have other glitches. I'm not having any other issues except for going dark or the random reboot when getting back in the car. It never happens while I'm driving. I'm slightly paranoid that Tesla may be manually rebooting it to bug me into installing the update. If they could force the update remotely they would have done it by now. Or they're actually trying to install it but the rear door handle fuse removal is working as reported by a few others.

If it doesn't get any worse, I can live with it the way it is now.

Apologies for drifting slightly off topic, but I hate to say it but that sounds very like many of the reports of imminent eMMC failure. I had it fail on mine. It started with more than normally poor performance on MCU. Slow to react, slow to wake up, wouldn’t connect to Internet, random screen reboots. Then pow! Totally blank screen.

The eMMC issue only affects MCU1 cars. It’s not actually a failure; it’s just that the chip only has so many read/writes available to it, and once it gets there, the Chip can’t cope any more. Caused by Tesla using an 8Gb Chip in the MCU1 (bigger chip in later cars) and the amount of totally useless OS logging to the chip. Completely crazy. It’s a very well known issue.

The chip is soldered to a daughterboard on the Main board. Tesla solution is to replace the entire MCU for £3500 incl labour. Alternative solution is to get an expert to replace the $10 chip, probably with a larger chip.

I notice you said your MCU was less than 2 years old. That is unusual, normally they fail around 4 years or 60,000 miles. I liken it to tires. They are meant to give you, say, 30,000 miles. Some last longer, some less. When the tread wears out, the tire hasn’t failed, it’s just reached its sell by date. Same with the chip. In MCU1 cars, it’s not a case of if it will fail, but when. They will ALL fail once they reach their Read/Write limit.

Lots of YouTube videos on this (explains the issue at 9:00)

and a several eMMC forums on here.
Hit by eMMC Issue

 

[Ferrycraigs]

This article was just posted about how Ap is partially responsible for a crash and good indication of the lack of respect from Tesla for the NTSB. Tesla Autopilot, distracted driving to blame in deadly 2018 crash

I think the primary factor responsible for this crash was the driver using AP as a Self Driving feature instead of a Driver's Aid, and playing a game on his phone instead of watching where he was going would not have help. I have a strong sense that if drivers would use AP as it is designed, most of these crashes would not happen.

 

[Ferrycraigs]

I just recently purchased a 2015 Model S 85D with 32,000 miles on it. The car is beautiful and runs superbly. Super Charging does take about 30% longer, but I charge at home, so no real issues. You guys are kind of freaking me out as to possible battery issues in my future. Should I be concerned? What are your thoughts? I am still under warranty until 2023. Thanks.

Well most of us are still under (battery) Warranty. The issue is our understanding of what’s covered under the Warranty, and Tesla's. Having an 8 year Warranty that they say doesn’t apply in our circumstances, doesn’t help much.

 

[boywonder]

Saw this and thought of us all!

 

[bhzmark]

You got to be joking, right? Did you see the battery report screen shots? It is not degradation.

I didnt use the word "degradation" in my post. Maybe you meant to respond to someone else with your debate about word choice?

My question remains: what other EV provides > 70% of original range available after >250k miles?

 

[Kim.T]

Apologies for drifting slightly off topic, but I hate to say it but that sounds very like many of the reports of imminent eMMC failure. I had it fail on mine. It started with more than normally poor performance on MCU. Slow to react, slow to wake up, wouldn’t connect to Internet, random screen reboots. Then pow! Totally blank screen.

The eMMC issue only affects MCU1 cars. It’s not actually a failure; it’s just that the chip only has so many read/writes available to it, and once it gets there, the Chip can’t cope any more. Caused by Tesla using an 8Gb Chip in the MCU1 (bigger chip in later cars) and the amount of totally useless OS logging to the chip. Completely crazy. It’s a very well known issue.

The chip is soldered to a daughterboard on the Main board. Tesla solution is to replace the entire MCU for £3500 incl labour. Alternative solution is to get an expert to replace the $10 chip, probably with a larger chip.

I notice you said your MCU was less than 2 years old. That is unusual, normally they fail around 4 years or 60,000 miles. I liken it to tires. They are meant to give you, say, 30,000 miles. Some last longer, some less. When the tread wears out, the tire hasn’t failed, it’s just reached its sell by date. Same with the chip. In MCU1 cars, it’s not a case of if it will fail, but when. They will ALL fail once they reach their Read/Write limit.

Lots of YouTube videos on this (explains the issue at 9:00)

and a several eMMC forums on here.
Hit by eMMC Issue

Just to continue this off-topic.
The number of MCU that is failing is exploding right now. Here in Denmark (I guess all europe) there is 8 weeks delivery time ! One of the last persons that talk to Tesla where told - they will eventually all fail
Some have examined the chip, it is not only due to read/write, but also a combination of poor quality of the silicium.
My screen went black 48h before ski holiday a friday morning (2 x 1250km trip)........no holiday for our family

 

[Droschke]

I just recently purchased a 2015 Model S 85D with 32,000 miles on it. The car is beautiful and runs superbly. Super Charging does take about 30% longer, but I charge at home, so no real issues. You guys are kind of freaking me out as to possible battery issues in my future. Should I be concerned? What are your thoughts? I am still under warranty until 2023. Thanks.

OK, you state your "Super Charging does take about 30% longer". Considering that pathetic charging speed, do you consider your car almost useless for long trips?

Thanks.

 

[Droschke]

poor quality of the silicium

Would you consider that a defect in material?

 

[Kim.T]

Would you consider that a defect in material?

That is just a statement of one that is replacing the chip. I guess not many chip has been investigated. But the conclusion was that it is actually how many hours the screen has been turned on, not how many KM you drive (So maybe we are lucky that we don't get Netflix, youtube and arcade games........)
But if this is a general quality issue, then an independent investigation should be made

 

[Chaserr]

So maybe we are lucky that we don't get Netflix, youtube and arcade games.

That's a big part of the reason why. Using up more storage space will cause more EMMCs to fail in warranty. Logging damages the chip bit by bit and they are still logging as bad as ever, they just changed it to only log in Drive to reduce the warranty load. But increasing the size of the installed image by adding more applications increases the chances of MCUs running out of undamaged areas sooner.

 

[mjmiron]

I think the primary factor responsible for this crash was the driver using AP as a Self Driving feature instead of a Driver's Aid, and playing a game on his phone instead of watching where he was going would not have help. I have a strong sense that if drivers would use AP as it is designed, most of these crashes would not happen.

i agree the reason i posted the article was more to the effect of the lack of attention from NTSB and the reaction and timing of the entire process.

 

[dfndr90]

I'm sure I'm going to get flamed for this but...

I don't believe blanket statements like "your car is almost useless" are helpful to a new owner. @dfndr90's car will Supercharge slower than it did when it new (and I think many people here could quantify this). But no one except the owner can say whether that's acceptable or not.

Peace,

Bruce.

Thank you bmah. You are correct in stating my 85D charges slower at SC's. I do not mind. When I picked up the car, I drove from Grandview Washington to Boise Idaho which is about 411 miles. I had two stops. One in Pendleton, OR for about 15 minutes and the second stop in Baker City, OR for about 45 minutes then drove home and arrived with roughly 50 miles left. The Baker City stop may have taken a bit longer, but it was also 18 degrees F outside. I love the car and I think Tesla is still trying to figure things out with the batteries. Whether they will take care of those of us with older Model S's is yet to be seen. Cheers.

 

[SmartElectric]

every day for the last 5 days or so, it's been rebooting spontaneously 2 or 3 times a day

Tesla improved the firmware to reduce logging to MMC storage chip on the MCU. Since you have prevented OTA updates to your car to preserve the behaviour you prefer, you do not benefit from the software improvements made. As has been reported elsewhere on the forums, the reboot behavior matches a storage end of life condition, which may be what you are experiencing. Some owners report that constantly keeping the car active with external polling apps (TeslaFI, etc) will also more rapidly degrade storage due to the computer activity on the car 24/7. Recommend reviewing the forums for this and acting on it immediately to ensure you can retain your VPN certificates and other key items that are required to replace the storage chip with a larger new chip that should provide many more years of function.

 

[cmarshack]

Mods - Please jump in here. This thread is already 565 pages, we do not need a tangent on the MMC failures, there are already threads for that.

This thread is for the sudden decrease in range/battery capacity caused by a Tesla pushed software update. Everything else should be discussed in another thread.

Thanks

 

[SmartElectric]

Mods - Please jump in here. This thread is already 565 pages, we do not need a tangent on the MMC failures, there are already threads for that.

This thread is for the sudden decrease in range/battery capacity caused by a Tesla pushed software update. Everything else should be discussed in another thread.

Thanks

MODs
Is on topic to discuss owners who have prevented OTA to their cars to preserve behavior prior to Tesla update which affected range/charging speed. Obviously, there are hundreds of posts in this thread discussing the topic of remaining on older firmware to prevent losing range via OTA. This is just a counter example where not allowing OTA may be impeding improvements to the car which could actually be helpful for safety, or in this case, longevity of the vehicle.

 

[Chaserr]

Agreed. We all know OTA is bad. It causes battery and power downgrades, it causes EMMC failures, it causes garbled text, it slows down every aspect of the car from checking weather to charge speed to 0-60 acceleration. In short OTA has countless numerous negative impacts. We know not to update any more. But this isn't a general thread to complain about every Tesla problem.

 

[mymagiccarpet]

Saw this and thought of us all!

Thanks this can actually be used very nicely. Do you have a full image, or link? Thanks.

 

[johnman10]

Thank you bmah. You are correct in stating my 85D charges slower at SC's. I do not mind. When I picked up the car, I drove from Grandview Washington to Boise Idaho which is about 411 miles. I had two stops. One in Pendleton, OR for about 15 minutes and the second stop in Baker City, OR for about 45 minutes then drove home and arrived with roughly 50 miles left. The Baker City stop may have taken a bit longer, but it was also 18 degrees F outside. I love the car and I think Tesla is still trying to figure things out with the batteries. Whether they will take care of those of us with older Model S's is yet to be seen. Cheers.

Its been 9 months you know? Not much hope left anymore, I believe. Best case scenario is a recall or something like that, where Tesla/Elon comes up with some legit excuse, trying to calm the mob (us) and trying to justify why it took that long. This will happen only if they see that either the DP19005 or the lawsuit goes bad for them. If it was Tesla's intention to solve this willingly, they would not lie to us at the service centers claiming normal degradation within acceptable limits. They would tell us 'there could be something wrong here, we are working on it, please be patient until we find a way to fix it'. And I believe most of us would be ok if we would hear that. They have chosen a different path though

 

[Chaserr]

At this apoint Tesla won't be able to make excuses until after the federal hammer is slammed, the recall is probably going to be an involuntary one stemming from NHTSA investigating why Tesla didn't report this 9 months ago. They had months to get in front of it in the press but only made it worse when it finally does go public, and 5 days to do it within the NHTSA's time limit for manufacturers and made it far worse by forcing an investigation. I hope the 89kwh pack is their excuse because it's a good one that might help make owners a little less bitter. I would have paid for that upgrade last year, and if you dig back in my posts I actually begged them to let me.

 

[Ferrycraigs]

Just to continue this off-topic.
The number of MCU that is failing is exploding right now. Here in Denmark (I guess all europe) there is 8 weeks delivery time ! One of the last persons that talk to Tesla where told - they will eventually all fail
Some have examined the chip, it is not only due to read/write, but also a combination of poor quality of the silicium.
My screen went black 48h before ski holiday a friday morning (2 x 1250km trip)........no holiday for our family

There is a place in Eindhoven that replaces the Chip, with a bigger chip, for about €550