Wiki Sudden Loss Of Range With 2019.16.x Software

[North75]

And i'll just reiterate my fun fact from earlier: Similar coolant to that used in the Model S is used in fire sprinkler systems around the world that are installed in areas that can get below freezing. I've worked in this field in the past, and know quite a bit about it. When a fire sprinkler on one of these wet subzero systems goes off due to a fire popping the fuse in the sprinkler head, the first thing dousing the fire? Coolant. Hundreds of gallons of it can rain down on the fire as a spray/mist before water follows it. If this stuff could actually cause or worsen a fire... um, well, it wouldn't be used in actual fire protection systems like this. Common sense? It doesn't catch on fire. It doesn't cause fires.

I agree that the chance of the coolant catching on fire inside one of Tesla's batteries is probably extremely small, but apparently using coolant in sprinkler systems as anti-freeze can in fact be flammable and cause problems if the concentration is too high. According to this article there was in incident where someone was killed when the sprinkler system was set off by a kitchen fire.

#107 - The Use of Antifreeze in Fire Protection Systems

Looks like NFPA will not allow using propylene glycol or glycerin in sprinkler systems starting in 2022. There is also apparently a UL-Listed ant-freeze that you can use safely.

 

[thesnooch]

Bro! answer the question what is x and what is z? Or G T F O

I don't think we have a right to demand someone like WK057 do more than he has already done. The forum is a voluntary activity. It would be bad for all if WK went away again...[/QUOTE]

Ok - agree that we don't have the right to demand and agree that this forum is voluntary and public. But disagree with your last sentence. SEE YA WK!

Wait... how do I become a paid bot?! Damnit, this is the job I want!

lame af.

 

[JRP3]

Actually I take it back. MP3MIKE and JRP3 are most likely paid bots

You got me, I was programmed to "join" this forum 13 years ago by SkyNet to infiltrate this thread.

 

[wk057]

You got me, I was programmed to "join" this forum 13 years ago by SkyNet to infiltrate this thread.

I always miss out on the fun jobs.

 

[MP3Mike]

You got me, I was programmed to "join" this forum 13 years ago by SkyNet to infiltrate this thread.

Are you sure it wasn't Skie.net?

 

[thesnooch]

You got me, I was programmed to "join" this forum 13 years ago by SkyNet to infiltrate this thread.

ok then alex spiro

 

[thesnooch]

got em'!

 

[lightningltd]

When the slap fest is done, I think I may have figured out what X and Y may be...
Just let me know when its safe to post so my post doesn't get lost in all the slapping

 

[Chaserr]

He's done, we sorted out my use of adverbs. What is your hypothesis?

 

[aerodyne]

I agree that the chance of the coolant catching on fire inside one of Tesla's batteries is probably extremely small, but apparently using coolant in sprinkler systems as anti-freeze can in fact be flammable and cause problems if the concentration is too high. According to this article there was in incident where someone was killed when the sprinkler system was set off by a kitchen fire.

#107 - The Use of Antifreeze in Fire Protection Systems

Looks like NFPA will not allow using propylene glycol or glycerin in sprinkler systems starting in 2022. There is also apparently a UL-Listed ant-freeze that you can use safely.

But a Tesla does not sit for years without the pumps running. This would tend to mix the coolant. I am assuming the coolant is not 100% glycol or similar, that usually is not done in cars or aircraft for best anti corrosion properties.

 

[tga]

What just happened here? This is unintelligible, and I'm once again pretty confused. What am I frustrating myself with besides banging my head against a wall trying to get you to share a single link to a source for a claim you made multiple times that Tesla said something specific that they didn't? End the thread?! What?! And how did this become a personal attack against me? Things I don't like about me? What in the heck would that have to do with anything at all? How does this relate to your false statements?!

More twisting of your words. Standard MO for @Chaserr, and why I gave up engaging them and had them on ignore for a while...

 

[aerodyne]

When the slap fest is done, I think I may have figured out what X and Y may be...
Just let me know when its safe to post so my post doesn't get lost in all the slapping

Wait, let's have a vote first...

Dendrites?

Plating effects?

Cosmic rays?

 

[Chaserr]

without the pumps running

Another interesting hypothesis for why Tesla runs the pumps constantly maybe?

I still think it's to keep temperatures low and control thermal runaway before it actually runs away while the volts are slowly reduced to the point that it no longer causes tiny electrical short circuits. 70% seems to be that number.

But if the coolant excuse pushes this horse past the finish line I'm all for it. The NHTSA knows about it, talks about it, and recalls for it all of the time. It also doesn't throw any shade on Tesla or electric cars. Every company has had a coolant recall at some point!

It's sad I want to be lied to, but I'm shopping for a new car and there really isn't any competition. It's Tesla or a gas car and I can't go back to gas.

 

[aerodyne]

Another interesting hypothesis for why Tesla runs the pumps constantly maybe?

I still think it's to keep temperatures low and control thermal runaway before it actually runs away while the volts are slowly reduced to the point that it no longer causes tiny electrical short circuits. 70% seems to be that number.

But if the coolant excuse pushes this horse past the finish line I'm all for it. The NHTSA knows about it, talks about it, and recalls for it all of the time. It also doesn't throw any shade on Tesla or electric cars. Every company has had a coolant recall at some point!

It's sad I want to be lied to, but I'm shopping for a new car and there really isn't any competition. It's Tesla or a gas car and I can't go back to gas.

I have some real if ancedotal (one car) data I can share, from the CAN bus via SMT.

When ever my car is accessed, on, driven or charging, the coolant and power train pumps always run between 20-30%.

When above 78-79% SoC, or when SuCing, the pumps run at 100%. This started about a year ago after the update named in this thread title.

Apologize in advance to those that already know this...

 

[North75]

But a Tesla does not sit for years without the pumps running. This would tend to mix the coolant. I am assuming the coolant is not 100% glycol or similar, that usually is not done in cars or aircraft for best anti corrosion properties.

I agree. Others have stated that Tesla uses 50/50% glycol and de-ionized water, which I agree is not flammable if the concentration stays there. If there is some mechanism that could cause the gylcol concentration to rise, then it can apparently become flammable. Chaserr kept mentioning the possiblity of the water evaporating causing the glycol concentration to rise. (at least that's what I understood him to say) I don't know if that could happen or not in a closed system.
I could see it happening after a fire had already started, but not so much starting a fire in the first place.

 

[wk057]

The glaring issue with the coolant leak causing problems narrative is still: No one's losing coolant.

 

[Chaserr]

I don't know if that could happen or not in a closed system.

It really can't. Not without a whole bunch of unusual circumstances falling together, like a coolant leak AND enough of it leaking to submerge a cell AND the cell having a high enough charge to turn that water to gas AND the car being parked on a sharp enough incline to submerge the end of those cells in the leaked coolant AND all of these to have been happening for a really long time.

I can see why Tesla investigated it and asked about the incline, and why the NHTSA is too, but it doesn't explain all the fires linked in this thread - especially the ones we see parked on flat ground. Tesla came to the same conclusion a year ago, because after batterygate they started chargegate and chargegate shouldn't matter much if they still thought it was coolant. The BMS already tapers based on temperature so if coolant was low it would slow down already. I even had a "COOLANT LOW" error pop up about 5 years ago so they know if it's too low, nothing needed to be changed. It's a terrific scapegoat if Tesla wants an out that doesn't expose any of their secrets, though, because it lets them recall batteries with an old well known excuse to that has been used longer than Tesla was around.

RE: No one's losing coolant... I've seen this error. They topped it off no charge.

 

[lightningltd]

(facepalm) I am ready to post the theory, buy slapfest 2.0 is still raging.

 

[Battpower]

No one's losing coolant.

I have read all the posts here I think. Not because I am supporting the theory of coolant leaks, but how do we know there aren't any? Is the coolant all in one circuit? I will try and find supporting evidence, but I believe I have read 2 or three posts refering to leaking 3 or 4 way valves under the frunk. Also, coolant inside electronics of drive unit. (less sure about that one, and you would surely hear about that if it was common.)

Is the coolant system sealed / presurized? Does it have relief valves? I still don't see any immediate link, but loss of coolant is possible, no?

As @Chaserr points out "I even had a "COOLANT LOW" error pop up about 5 years ago".

Must have gone somewhere.

 

[Battpower]

(facepalm) I am ready to post the theory, buy slapfest 2.0 is still raging.

I'm listening....