Tesla Announces CCS1 Adapter Coming to S. Korea Early 2021

[Xebec]

I thought someone in one of these threads (too many CCS1 threads now) said that the signaling was the same in CCS1 and CCS2, only the pin arrangements were different? If so, then presumably the circuit boards have been able to communicate CCS signals since the European model came out. (Or, there's a software switch that needs throwing)? I would find it less likely that each locale has a different board, more likely there's a single versatile board and only the chargeport socket unit varies by country or continent. If I were Elon, that's how I'd do it. Less hassles, less parts less everything.

That would be ideal, and maybe possible:

"Unlike the connector and inlet, which depend on the geographical location, the charging communication is the same around the globe"

Combined Charging System - Wikipedia

 

[M0rpH3x]

The newest Model S/X, and the Model 3/Y are capable of CCS signaling (in europe they are, and I'm 100% sure they didn't develop specific boards for them). For the older models, there is a retrofit to allow the car to understand the CCS signaling, very simple to install, right under the rear seats. If CCS ever comes to the US, I'm sure it will be the same.

 

[smogne41]

The newest Model S/X, and the Model 3/Y are capable of CCS signaling (in europe they are, and I'm 100% sure they didn't develop specific boards for them). For the older models, there is a retrofit to allow the car to understand the CCS signaling, very simple to install, right under the rear seats. If CCS ever comes to the US, I'm sure it will be the same.

The US spec 3 and the EU spec 3 have totally different controller boards for charge port communications. Damien Maguire has a video that shows them side by side, search youtube for his "Tesla Model 3 Charge Port Hacking : Intro" video and go to about 9:30 in. It makes sense, the US Tesla charging standard is a very different and simpler (in a good way) protocol, CCS is a complicated mess. The US board is about ~20% smaller and uses a much smaller microcontroller than the UK/EU CCS board.

 

[smogne41]

However, important to note (as you can see in the video above), the charger controller boards are in the same size enclosures and have the same headers, so all the interfaces to them are mechanically identical. So an upgrade to the hardware would not be hard.

 

[M0rpH3x]

However, important to note (as you can see in the video above), the charger controller boards are in the same size enclosures and have the same headers, so all the interfaces to them are mechanically identical. So an upgrade to the hardware would not be hard.

Interesting. I wonder if there is something more apart from CCS that differentiates the boards. At any rate, in the worst case everybody would need a simple retrofit.

 

[M0rpH3x]

I did some research (by just comparing the parts catalog of US and a random country in Europe). For Model S/X, it seems that the CCS ECU is required for CCS charging, and the US models lack it, so now I'm almost sure they are not CCS capable. The Model 3/Y situation is different, the charge port controller is not the same, and I would be inclined to think that the CCS protocol was not implemented (because of consistency).

 

[jsight]

Looks like it is going through an approval process now:

https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/n4b0ig

 

[phigment]

Wow.. that's a lot smaller than the 3rd party Setec version. I hope it gives more than 50kW

 

[jsight]

Wow.. that's a lot smaller than the 3rd party Setec version. I hope it gives more than 50kW

It definitely should. It seems like a software limitation in the Tesla side that affects the setec one. This one could definitely be better, but it's hard to say how much better.

Although, tbh, I'd be fine even with just 50kw as long as it consistently gets that instead of the wonky CHAdeMO charge curve.

 

[dgatwood]

Yes. Biden said frequently in his campaign speeches that one way to create jobs with clean energy was installing thousands of EV chargers across the USA. If these are going to be Detroit-compatible (what are the odds?) the cheapest route is CCS-only. When CCS is the best alternative to Supercharger in an area, or more available, this adapter would be indispensable.

The only problem I see is that these chargers tend to appear at best in pairs. To get other EV adoption as good or better than Tesla, 4-charger and 8-charger setups (like Tesla's chargers) will soon be necessary. Ditto for L2 chargers in hotels, etc.

Agreed. Were it not for the fact that right now, almost nobody is using them, if they actually managed to get significant increases in non-Tesla EV sales, those little two-head stations that everybody seems to be building are going to fill up instantly, and because they're scattered everywhere, if you need a charge, it will involve driving around until you find one that isn't full, knowing that other people are doing the same thing.

I don't see non-Tesla EV sales improving much until there are a lot of charging stations with 8+ or even 12+ chargers per site, and unfortunately, I don't see anybody building the sites until there are enough cars that need them.

Then again, Tesla isn't entirely immune to that problem; there are a few really annoying Tesla locations like Casa Grande, which gets lines around the block for its six stalls.

 

[Boeingpilot]

Agreed. Were it not for the fact that right now, almost nobody is using them, if they actually managed to get significant increases in non-Tesla EV sales, those little two-head stations that everybody seems to be building are going to fill up instantly, and because they're scattered everywhere, if you need a charge, it will involve driving around until you find one that isn't full, knowing that other people are doing the same thing.

I don't see non-Tesla EV sales improving much until there are a lot of charging stations with 8+ or even 12+ chargers per site, and unfortunately, I don't see anybody building the sites until there are enough cars that need them.

Then again, Tesla isn't entirely immune to that problem; there are a few really annoying Tesla locations like Casa Grande, which gets lines around the block for its six stalls.

Not to get off topic, but a very good point. No one wants to wait on a charger. At my work (airport) there is an older 4 station supercharger, it's often full. The airport authority has installed 10 CCS1 chargers (150kw). The other daythe SC was full up. I just said, screw it, drove over to the CCS chargers, used the credit card and my Setec adapter. Was getting 78kw. since that's what you get at a full V2 SC station, no loss, except for money (I still have FUSC).

 

[e of pi]

There's a fair number of multi-unit CCS stations going in, and being constantly full would help a lot with (1) supporting those companies like EVGo, PetroCanada, EA/EC, and others that are installing larger station layouts and (2) causing people who previously weren't willing to invest in more stations to think about getting more. If you have two stations and they're empty a lot of the time, why get four, but if you have two and they're constantly full, it's easier to argue you should get two more.

 

[jsight]

All of the ea stations here have at least 4. Usually at least 3 are working too!

 

[DoubleDD]

Wonder if this is why the Chademo adapter is "Sold Out" on the Tesla site. Please make this happen soon.

 

[cwerdna]

Electrify America's sites tend to have 5 SAE Combo handles + 1 CHAdeMO handle, across 3 DC FC units.

The EVgo installations I've seen tend to only have 2 dual-standard DC FCs. I know of one location with three.

Since someone liked my post, this is the most eggregious CHAdeMO vs. CCS EA site I know of: PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You. It has 1 CHAdeMO plug and 19 CCS plugs!

Here's a 4 DC FC EVgo site: PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You. The Plugshare entry might be wrong. It says there are 5 CHAdeMO and 4 CCS. It's likely just 4 of each.

I've been to this EVgo site with 4 DC FCs: PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You.

 

[dgatwood]

Since someone liked my post, this is the most eggregious CHAdeMO vs. CCS EA site I know of: PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You. It has 1 CHAdeMO plug and 19 CCS plugs!

Here's a 4 DC FC EVgo site: PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You. The Plugshare entry might be wrong. It says there are 5 CHAdeMO and 4 CCS. It's likely just 4 of each.

I've been to this EVgo site with 4 DC FCs: PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You.

That's okay. If it's built like the ones out here, there are probably only ten parking places within reach of those 20 chargers.

Yup. Looking at the picture, half of those chargers are completely and totally useless unless you're driving an electric motorcycle, and maybe even then.

So in practice, there are 9 CCS charging stations and one dual CCS/CHAdeMO station, but the 9 CCS stations have a redundant cable....

 

[Jeff N]

So in practice, there are 9 CCS charging stations and one dual CCS/CHAdeMO station, but the 9 CCS stations have a redundant cable....

It’s not just in practice… there actually are only 10 chargers that can charge only a single car (or motorcycle) at a time. The dual CCS-cabled dispenser/charger units are done that way, according to Electrify America, because the liquid-cooled cables are not as flexible and having them mounted on both left and right helps them reach to the various locations where carmakers are putting the CCS ports on their vehicles. Most put it on the left front but Porsche puts it on the right front and some cars in the right or left at the rear corner of the car.

 

[acarney]

Did anyone catch that the equivalent to the FCC granted approval to the device? Wouldn't that indicate some communication device in there... either some chips that talk to the car or talk to the charger, or both. I would think UL or someone would be the approval if it was just a passive chunk of plastic with some metal bits in it to carry the electricity. Might not be as passive as thought, which would probably be a good thing. I assume there will be some max limit, maybe supercharger V2 speeds, which the unit will have to make sure it stays below. You probably could have that handled just via a software update on the car, but if there is some additional handshake chip that can limit the max charge as well that might really go to make it a safe plug and play device.

 

[frnkblk]

Did anyone catch that the equivalent to the FCC granted approval to the device? Wouldn't that indicate some communication device in there... either some chips that talk to the car or talk to the charger, or both. I would think UL or someone would be the approval if it was just a passive chunk of plastic with some metal bits in it to carry the electricity. Might not be as passive as thought, which would probably be a good thing. I assume there will be some max limit, maybe supercharger V2 speeds, which the unit will have to make sure it stays below. You probably could have that handled just via a software update on the car, but if there is some additional handshake chip that can limit the max charge as well that might really go to make it a safe plug and play device.

Are you saying the FCC did grant approval on something? If so, can you share a link?

 

[acarney]

Are you saying the FCC did grant approval on something? If so, can you share a link?

Post #27 in this thread, looks like someone linked to something on Reddit.