SageBrush
REJECT Fascism
No doubt about it, convincing people to pay twice as much for a Model S is a tough job. And as Model 3 gets nearer to production it gets even tougher.
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What I meant is that they designed the car in a way, so that it would fit 75kWh of batteries. Tesla didn't design the car and then found out they could only fit 75kWh of batteries.
Garlan Garner
Banned
I'm not sure its that tough....its darn near impossible. <---hmmm that looks like a curse word....it isn't. (D A R N).
Rich folks just seem to think that other folks are rich like them and that its just a matter of making a decision as to which car to buy. If you don't have model S money then you just can't / shouldn't buy one. Its just that simple.
Let me go a step further and say that some Idiot banks have been giving loans to people who cant afford the payments and people have been over extending themselves to the limit. Monthly payment stress isn't necessary. I personally know of a person paying more for his model S than he is for his House AND he can't afford both. Sure - He got a loan from the local "Break-Your-Legs If-You-Don't-Pay" bank, because they don't care about what he could afford.
People of TMC - don't let a bank or a lending institution tell you what you can afford. Do your own math. If you can barely afford a Model S, then opt for the Model 3 and live comfortably.
Dan Detweiler
Active Member
Agree with your post in general. People don't need to over spend. I would just add that it isn't the bank's job to determine what you can and can't afford...it's yours. I guess the Libertarian in me is raising his ugly head again. I just don't like others telling me what I can and can't do. That's just me.
Back to your post though, I think for the vast majority of Model 3 reservation holders a Model S will never be in their budgetary realm of consideration. That's why they weren't Tesla owners in the first place. The Model 3 opened up Tesla ownership for a whole group of people that would never have otherwise been able to consider it.
Dan
PJFW8
Red Menace may hurt me
I agree! Nevertheless. there are some for whom the S and X are simply too large as opposed to too costly. . In spite of the "anti-selling" Tesla will not deliberately deliver an inferior product. The Audi A8 is too big (for me), that does not mean the A4 must be poorly equipped. Tesla will not let Model 3 buyers. There is room to help those straining to afford a Tesla and those wanting a smaller but well equipped EV.
Garlan Garner
Banned
I can't for the life of me understand how "anti-selling" the Model 3 would be advantageous for Tesla. I can find ways that I think they might try and anti-sell the Model 3, however all of the ways that I come up with aren't financially beneficial as they discourage this new class of potential customers.
Are you saying:
a) You don't see the advantage of anti-selling Model 3?
or
b) You don't think Tesla is anti-selling Model 3 at this time?
Garlan Garner
Banned
What I'm saying is that I don't see the bottom line of why they are anti-selling the Model 3. Why do they think that potential Model S buyers are holding off for the Model 3. What data do they have?
I think the bottom line is that Q2 sales are down (hopefully now helped by the new levers) and they think Model 3 is to blame?
Maybe the sales people are hearing from customers that they are waiting for Model 3 instead of going for a Model S?
Garlan Garner
Banned
Maybe,
However, I believe the slowdown is probably due to the fact that they are exhausting the market of a $100K EV. I would also be wondering how many leases are being turned in with no trade in for a new S. Those Model S leasing folks might be waiting for a Model 3....as to not have that $1000 +/- $400 car note.
Maybe, Maybe, Maybe.....who knows? That's what I'm interested in hearing Tesla say.
Will the real truth please stand up?
kingjamez
Member
I too am a bit confused by Tesla's continual comparison of Model 3 to S. As has been adequately discussed, they serve different markets 90% of the time. The buyer who has overlap between the two is rare, exists, but rare. Certainly not "normal" enough for Tesla to focus on it like they have.
I do see wisdom in anti-selling from a different perspective though. Long wait times. We don't know what the waiting list is right now, but Tesla doesn't need it to be longer. Longer will only make for more frustration as people who have already put money down start seeing Model 3 on the street and they don't have theirs yet. Tesla needed the pre-orders to secure manufacturing partners, that need has been met. Any further increase in pre-orders only frustrates the customer base.
-Jim
diamond.g
Active Member
Even in this forum folks are comparing it to Hondas and Jaguars. Sadly there are expectations that probably are not going to be met by the first run of the Model 3.
I think Tesla is comparing the 3 to the S the same way Audi would compare the A4 to the A8. They wouldn't compare it to a competitor (unless it is some metric that they beat them in like 0-60). Tesla went from saying the Model 3 is the bees knees to saying it is a smaller less feature filled version of the S. The established players don't have to do that often, the last time I can recall this kind of thing being brought up was the CLA release and the 2/4 series release, and even then they didn't tout those new lines as anything extravagant.
Generalization aside, I agree with getting what makes financial sense, but people are free to do what they want. Life is short. I initially developed my interest in Tesla this past March. My car was 13 years old and at 200,000 miles. It was time for a new car and I needed it this summer at the latest otherwise I'd be in a Model 3. Price didn't weigh in more than the fact that I couldn't wait for mid 2018 (not getting the full $7500 tax break was a small factor too).
People should just chill out, not worry about Tesla's marketing tactics, and wait for what'll prolly be a great car to hit the market.
People should just chill out, not worry about Tesla's marketing tactics, and wait for what'll prolly be a great car to hit the market.
Garlan Garner
Banned
We have no choice but to wait.....
I'm trying to give a heads up to potential customers. Not Tesla.
Sure people can do whatever they want, however it still remains that historically they shouldn't do everting they have the ability to do. Doing everything you want and can is what infants do. Adults should weigh out their decisions more and more as they get older.
Too often I hear....from older adults......"I wish I had "... "I should have"......" If I could just start over, I would".......
The mature adult does not just know what a good decision is....they follow it.
Kant.Ing
Member
I really don't think this is anti-selling Model 3, otherwise they should have thrown in the most optioned Model 3 (like P and D versions with even smaller f/trunk space, and the 75kWh option) for a fair comparison. I better believe this is to differentiate their products and tell everyone Tesla is not selling only expensive cars or fast cars any more!
Come to the $35K base price for Model 3, I believe Tesla has spent the most time and effort on this and driven hard on its suppliers. Every component will be cheaper and inferior than Model S, everything, including body/frame material, computer hardware and software, roof, trunk lids, tires and wheels, steering wheel, all automatic adjustable amenities functions, motors and powertrains, warranties, headlamps, sensors, airbags, interior furnishing, A/C, sound insulation, suspension, audio system, and brakes, and even Tesla reduces the profit margin to zero and rely much on upselling essential packages like ADAS/TACC/AEB for your tax credit money. There could even be a small incentive if you opt out any AP hardware or cannot live with a beta software.
People who want and can afford Model S will stay with Model S, they won't look at Model 3. Model 3 will look cool in a couple weeks, but it could soon become leaves or roaches many on the street.
It is really for product differentiation. On the bright side.
Come to the $35K base price for Model 3, I believe Tesla has spent the most time and effort on this and driven hard on its suppliers. Every component will be cheaper and inferior than Model S, everything, including body/frame material, computer hardware and software, roof, trunk lids, tires and wheels, steering wheel, all automatic adjustable amenities functions, motors and powertrains, warranties, headlamps, sensors, airbags, interior furnishing, A/C, sound insulation, suspension, audio system, and brakes, and even Tesla reduces the profit margin to zero and rely much on upselling essential packages like ADAS/TACC/AEB for your tax credit money. There could even be a small incentive if you opt out any AP hardware or cannot live with a beta software.
People who want and can afford Model S will stay with Model S, they won't look at Model 3. Model 3 will look cool in a couple weeks, but it could soon become leaves or roaches many on the street.
It is really for product differentiation. On the bright side.
How is it not anti-selling if Tesla is painting Model 3 in the worst possible light by listing the least optioned Model 3?
And, also, how would anti-selling be helped by showing the most optioned Model 3 on this sheet?
I don't get your logic. On the other hand, I agree Tesla is doing this to differentiate their products. So that Model S keeps selling...
Dan Detweiler
Active Member
In my view, I think this boils down to the fact that we are getting really close to Model 3 production and people are beginning to see that they can get a stripped down bare bones Model S or wait a bit and get a maxed out Model 3 with every bell and whistle for about the same money...maybe even less. I know I'd wait, even if a Model S was in my realm of possibility.
Dan
Dan
Garlan Garner
Banned
I don't think Every component of the Model 3 will be cheaper and inferior to the Model S.I really don't think this is anti-selling Model 3, otherwise they should have thrown in the most optioned Model 3 (like P and D versions with even smaller f/trunk space, and the 75kWh option) for a fair comparison. I better believe this is to differentiate their products and tell everyone Tesla is not selling only expensive cars or fast cars any more!
Come to the $35K base price for Model 3, I believe Tesla has spent the most time and effort on this and driven hard on its suppliers. Every component will be cheaper and inferior than Model S, everything, including body/frame material, computer hardware and software, roof, trunk lids, tires and wheels, steering wheel, all automatic adjustable amenities functions, motors and powertrains, warranties, headlamps, sensors, airbags, interior furnishing, A/C, sound insulation, suspension, audio system, and brakes, and even Tesla reduces the profit margin to zero and rely much on upselling essential packages like ADAS/TACC/AEB for your tax credit money. There could even be a small incentive if you opt out any AP hardware or cannot live with a beta software.
People who want and can afford Model S will stay with Model S, they won't look at Model 3. Model 3 will look cool in a couple weeks, but it could soon become leaves or roaches many on the street.
It is really for product differentiation. On the bright side.
It has already been stated by Tesla and Elon that the AP hardware and software is identical. The tires and such are also identical. One thing that is definitely not going to be inferior is the battery. The 2170 is not inferior to the 18650. Its advanced above the 18650.
The all glass roof of the Model 3 gave birth to the all glass roof of the Model S to the point where you can't get a hard shell on the Model S anymore. The Motor of the model 3 has been noted as being far more advanced as well to the point where they are using Model 3's motors in the new Tesla Semi.
Logic will also suggest that components in the Model 3 will be superior to the Model S simply because advancements in Technology are birthed daily. Tesla has a history of putting their latest technology in their current cars. The Model S made the spring of 2016 has been surpassed by the Model S that was made in the fall of 2016 because the technology was better in the fall.
I don't see this as anti-selling but more informing existing reservation holders and potential buyers. Based on this and information from Elon has convinced me to hold off on the first Model 3 vehicles produced. I'm guessing that I'm not alone among existing Model S owners. Reservation holders without Teslas will benefit by moving up in line.
This is no different from when the Model X was announced. I held a reservation for almost a year before deciding to get the Model S. I changed my mind based on information provided at the final reveal and I don't regret it.
Frequent and early information benefits everyone.
This is no different from when the Model X was announced. I held a reservation for almost a year before deciding to get the Model S. I changed my mind based on information provided at the final reveal and I don't regret it.
Frequent and early information benefits everyone.
