Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[Nocturnal]

Why isn't FSD being used in the Vegas Loop? Any thoughts? Seems like the perfect place. Perhaps the city hasn't allowed it yet, but why not test while the conference center is closed and build data to make the case to the city? (or is that exactly what Tesla is doing?)

 

[Chunky Jr.]

So when can we call them something other than ‘Recalls’?

• Compliance Update
• Functional Enhancement
• Safety Concern Resolution
• Making Stuff Better

Tesla recalls over 26,600 cars over windshield defroster software error

Tesla is recalling 26,681 vehicles over defective windshield defroster software that may reduce visibility and increase risk of crash.

www.cnbc.com

And on a silly note, some wannabe owner/analyst at the Camarillo Center was speculating that ‘idle fees’ comprise ‘5-10% of Tesla’s profits’.

An annoying bug that will be fixed in the next release.

 

[Chunky Jr.]

One more Twitter post that I think is worth sharing, hot off the presses and this time dealing with the Giga Berlin permitting process. Along with @avoigt I'd consider Tobias to be one of the best sources of information on Giga Berlin around:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1491458417172807680

I hope they put the correct cover sheet on their TPS report or it is back to square one.

 

[Dangerous Fish]

Those of us in Austin probably can't help but note that the Gigafactory is only 9 miles from the Circuit of the Americas (Formula 1) racetrack. They are on the same side of town and have a major highway (SH 130) connecting them.

That said, I would highly doubt whether Tesla would get access to the track as consistently as they'd require for testing, since lots of events happen out there at COTA, but the idea sure sounds cool to me. Fun to think you could put the occasional Performance versions to the test out there...

A F1 circuit would be the worst place to test a Tesla (and most production vehicles) as it's way too wide and fast and would punish brakes and tyres much more than is necessary to prove anything other than they're not up to the task of driving a F1 track!
You'd also only get a handful of laps in before needing to charge and the nearest Superchargers seem to be 25mins away.
This is why the Nurburgring is used so much by manufacturers - it's a public road but you can go as fast as you like, so perfect for testing road cars to their limits.

 

[thesmokingman]

A F1 circuit would be the worst place to test a Tesla (and most production vehicles) as it's way too wide and fast and would punish brakes and tyres much more than is necessary to prove anything other than they're not up to the task of driving a F1 track!
You'd also only get a handful of laps in before needing to charge and the nearest Superchargers seem to be 25mins away.
This is why the Nurburgring is used so much by manufacturers - it's a public road but you can go as fast as you like, so perfect for testing road cars to their limits.

Concur, F1 circuits are pointless for prepping a road car. F1 circuits are too manicured and smoothed to provide enough variation for a road car.

 

[JRP3]

A F1 circuit would be the worst place to test a Tesla (and most production vehicles) as it's way too wide and fast and would punish brakes and tyres much more than is necessary to prove anything other than they're not up to the task of driving a F1 track!

Why would they have to drive at full speed just for testing? Just because the track allows for high speeds doesn't mean they need to max it out all the time.

 

[Mengy]

Why isn't FSD being used in the Vegas Loop? Any thoughts? Seems like the perfect place. Perhaps the city hasn't allowed it yet, but why not test while the conference center is closed and build data to make the case to the city? (or is that exactly what Tesla is doing?)

I've been wondering this too. I think it will be used in the tunnels eventually, but I have to wonder why it isn't right now, because it seems to me like it would be an easy scenario for Tesla Autopilot to handle given what my Model Y does on the public roads today.

 

[Jack6591]

Agreed, but I would suggest that any union who's leaders are continually jailed and prosecuted for corruption should be disbanded.

Would you extend that same reasoning to other labor organizations? Say the American Bar Association and the American Medical Association?

 

[Dangerous Fish]

Why would they have to drive at full speed just for testing? Just because the track allows for high speeds doesn't mean they need to max it out all the time.

So what's the point in paying for and using a F1 track then? May as well use a small test track if they don't want to drive at full speed.
In fact, they will want to do both but a F1 track is pointless for either.

 

[StealthP3D]

Why isn't FSD being used in the Vegas Loop? Any thoughts? Seems like the perfect place. Perhaps the city hasn't allowed it yet, but why not test while the conference center is closed and build data to make the case to the city? (or is that exactly what Tesla is doing?)

Because people can't handle the truth.

More seriously, I think Elon looked at the probable way it would play out and decided it wasn't the right time yet. Not because the Vegas cars couldn't be made safe enough running in autonomous mode, but he wants to release FSD in a manner that is most beneficial to its wide rollout. Sometimes it's better to catch people by surprise. You may think people (in general) are well aware of the state of FSD but that's only true in the relatively very small circles that follow FSD development. To your average person, FSD is "Elon's Dream" that won't be ready for a decade, if ever.

When you are planning to blow millions of people's minds, you need to do it on your terms and your timeline. Not like an experiment that is pushing the limits every step of the way. FSD will come to Vegas tunnels when the time is right. From an economic perspective, the number of human drivers in the Vegas test loop is too inconsequential to be a real consideration. It's all about creating the proper narrative at the proper time.

 

[MountainRatMat]

Jeesh....I forgot to add the {/sarcasm} tag to my post. Not to self: must remember next time.

I'm surprised a photo from some time in the '70s triggered a thumbs down. But them maybe I'm not surprised...

All things being equal: I do think an indoor test track would make most sense, as it helps to keep things secret (those recent drone shots of the Cybertruck....) and you can simulate test conditions artificially as you like. GigaTexas certainly looks big enough for that, however there is probably much better use of the space if this wasn't planned from the start.

The external "test tracks" we see these days I think are more like production quality control tracks - less test track for true development work.

Tesla is the king of free marketing. Getting drone shots of a prototype Cybertruck is pure genius. Puts them back in the news cycle...and good news cycle for that matter.

They haven't had a problem keeping secrets, nobody knew what the Cybertruck or roadster looked like before the reveals of those vehicles.

 

[ZachF]

A F1 circuit would be the worst place to test a Tesla (and most production vehicles) as it's way too wide and fast and would punish brakes and tyres much more than is necessary to prove anything other than they're not up to the task of driving a F1 track!
You'd also only get a handful of laps in before needing to charge and the nearest Superchargers seem to be 25mins away.
This is why the Nurburgring is used so much by manufacturers - it's a public road but you can go as fast as you like, so perfect for testing road cars to their limits.

Elon/Tesla should build an American ‘ring

 

[rallykeeper]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1491174827033763840

And, we'll also see a 13G soon out of Vanguard...

Not sure why Sawyer views this as news. Blackrock and Vanguard (to a lesser extent) are predominately passive investors. Their shareholdings in any issuer by and large reflect the size of their funds and not any underlying investment decision. If they get bigger, their ownership will grow.

Likely, the only interesting manager to watch in 13G land will be Capital World. That's an active manager that has long been strongly invested in Tesla. Last year, they barely slipped out of being a 5% holder and could theoretically come back this year.

Of course, we should also keep an eye out for any new ones, but there aren't really that many active money managers left with the capacity to own ~$50 billion in TSLA (in order to hit the 5% 13G threshold).

 

[jerry33]

Would you extend that same reasoning to other labor organizations? Say the American Bar Association and the American Medical Association?

If they are corrupt, they are corrupt.

 

[SmokyPeat]

A F1 circuit would be the worst place to test a Tesla (and most production vehicles) as it's way too wide and fast and would punish brakes and tyres much more than is necessary to prove anything other than they're not up to the task of driving a F1 track!
You'd also only get a handful of laps in before needing to charge and the nearest Superchargers seem to be 25mins away.
This is why the Nurburgring is used so much by manufacturers - it's a public road but you can go as fast as you like, so perfect for testing road cars to their limits.

The Nurburgring was used as an F1 track for 25 years. I've watched races at COTA, and an electric production car event would be awesome, imo. They had stock Ferrari 458s race prior to the main event F1 race I watched there.

 

[CHGolferJim]

Would you extend that same reasoning to other labor organizations? Say the American Bar Association and the American Medical Association?

What is your opinion about the role of unionism in industries being disrupted and losing total employment (arguably UAW, etc.)? To continue to try to maximize wages and benefits for members potentially at the cost of total employment? Is union management and membership able to turn the page from past expectations, and adjust?

 

[CHGolferJim]

If they are corrupt, they are corrupt.

Is the generalization true that such organizations may have corrupt members, but in the case of many major unions it’s the bosses not the rank and file that have been corrupt? Teamsters, UAW, etc.

 

[ZachF]

What an incompetent government..........Hope you're happy Germany, you made it very clear to every company out there that was even remotely thinking of investing in Germany to stay away. Have fun catering to your dying dinosaur ICE manufacturers

Increasingly there are economists calling Germany “the sick man of Europe” again. Germany (and Japan) have had among the worst economic performances post-COVID of the major economies…

(It should be noted that both of these countries are also dependent on ICE machinery exports to drive their economies)

 

[The Accountant]

Edit: in thousands

 

[CHGolferJim]

Increasingly there are economists calling Germany “the sick man of Europe” again. Germany (and Japan) have had among the worst economic performances post-COVID of the major economies…

(It should be noted that both of these countries are also dependent on ICE machinery exports to drive their economies)

And, of course, Germany has the social/economic/political weight of the reunified former East to contend with. Several Germans I know believe it will take generation(s) to educate and move beyond the combination.