Again, you're reading too far between the words, and not reading what I actually said. What I did say was that AP1 behaved drunk in the early days too. What I did imply was that when used with 2 lane markings, it's pretty decent; just like AP1 was in early days. In the context it was a comparison of AP1 when it came out and people using it in the city (where it's not meant to be used) to people using AP2 in places where it's meant to be used but does poorly. What I didn't say is that AP2 is "OK". I actually never rated AP2, as that would require several hundred of miles of me driving it, which I have not driven AP2 for several hundreds of miles on various roads. And this was all in context [based on your quote] with using AP in an undivided road, which may have crests, sharp curves, oncoming traffic, faded lane markings, lane markings only on one side, etc. Not on the highway, where AP is supposed to be most useful. If you want to pick an argument, go somewhere else. I'm done replying to you on this topic.
I have AP2 and I find that it does a pretty OK job on the highway (currently <50mph). It, unlike AP1, IS intended for "local roads" and that's where it's performance is currently troubling. I still use it but in a very careful manner. Basically it does a great job when the road goes straight. It can even handle unmarked roads as long as there is a curb. I don't like that it will cross double yellow lines and that it will hunt Lane lines especially when first engaged but it's not inherently dangerous. You can't tell a knife company to stop selling knives because they might result in injury. Tesla can and should do a better job with AP2 but OP misses Tesla's true defects which is in communication and honesty.
This post is amazingly ignorant of lots of relevant facts already posted in many threads on this forum such as the disclosure of current AP2 status, and projections for future updates and functionality. Mr. DeKort -- do your own due diligence and inform yourself. You can start by test driving a Tesla and experiencing for yourself what you complain of. You can also read the NHTSA report on AP1 and review how AP1 was rolled out incrementally as well. In other words, do not write such outlandish claims while still ignorant of such basic information. And since you aren't even a Tesla owner, disclose whether you have any conflict of interest in any capacity. Such as a paid shill for a short-seller -- who is suffering mightily about now at 260 and might be interested in having someone pretend to be qualified and post ignorant ramblings. More informed discussion of AP2, its progress and lack of thereof, is contained in other threads.
I would think that would be one of the easier things to program if not the easiest and that's what's worrying.
This is the first iteration. It will improve quickly. I'm not concerned I just adjust how I use it as I establish a baseline for using that feature. Since initial reviews were poor I was very cautious and ended my initial testing pleasantly surprised. I am very selective in the roads where I use autosteer but I find what it does well it will do regardless of conditions (time of day or weather). Just used it in both rain and snow in one day thanks to Chicago weather. Worked consistently at least. Just don't use it on turns or big intersections or where lanes divide or merge or where people speed or where bicyclists or pedestrians are around (though my hw2 recognizes cyclists as cars it is not good enough to trust it). Despite the laundry list of restrictions I used local autosteer for five miles each way on my commute each day with incident since I got the update. It is useful and makes everyone safer and it will only get better. No need to be an alarmist once you understand and appreciate what it is and isn't currently and adjust that as it improves.
To the OP: Thank you for your seemingly honest concern for my and others safety WRT AP2. As an intelligent person, even if I had not read the entire manual for one specific aspect on the proper operation of the vehicle, there's this little thing called personal responsibility. Whoever made the video, which I've not wasted my time watching based on your characterization of it, allowed the car to drive the way it did. Why they allowed it seems to be to make a point that they were reckless in that they did not take control of the situation. As a licensed driver, it's your responsibility to maintain control of your vehicle at all times. They did not. Your choosing to point to their reckless antic speaks volumes as to your intent here... Thanks for playing. You may put your whistle away now and move on; There's nothing to see here.
I'll just chime in with a quick note. I've utilized AP1 since day 1 of public release and have driven tens of thousands of miles with AP1 since that time. It's not perfect, but it's mostly predictable and I generally know where it's going to have trouble. I recently did ~100 miles with AP2 in an X... And you know what? IMO, this should NOT be publicly utilized nor have even been released yet. Seriously. AP2 was all over the place and completely unpredictable on routes where I've used AP1 without incident over a hundred times. AP2 was nearly unusable. The initial release of AP1 was 20x more reliable, despite AP2 having a significant sensor advantage. I don't know who in their right mind thought it was a good idea to start rolling out AP2 hardware before they even had basic feature parity with AP1, but those involved should be sacked.
While I sort of see the OP's sentiment about "using Tesla owners as test subjects" as being questioned, I don't think its as bad as you make it out to be. I do think learning from the real world is A LOT better than testing in a lab. As with any software, there are staged/phased releases that come out with limitations and caveats and the users report customer found defects and issues. Yes there is life as the cost here, but only if used recklessly without being responsible. You need to have your hands and feet alert when you enable Auto-steer and only enable it when you are confident it can handle the scenario. Just one trial should give you a sense of confidence level on the streets you are attempting it on and the user is expected to "beta test" it per se with utmost care and responsibility. When AP2 goes primetime, and you see an issue with AP2 allowing you to enable auto-steer and stay engaged when it is dangerous, then there is reason to question the quality of the product, but even at that point it is the individuals responsibility to gauge the quality of the product and use it accordingly and when they feel confident that it can be productive and not counter-productive. At this stage I for one like that all the users are actively trying it out in the real world and providing real data as opposed to simulations and tests and to me that will ensure a more solid product when it is released as opposed to them saying AP2 is ready to go we have run million miles of "simulation" on it. As with anything that has a danger element associated with it "Use with caution" applies here as well. It can be mitigated by being responsible, careful and attentive. I'd like to add that although I made the statements above, I sort of agree with the notion that AP2 auto-steer is terrible at this point and it shouldve been tested more internally before using live subjects, there is a fine line to draw here between releasing a beta product vs releasing something really not stable and expecting to learn from "incidents" as opposed to safe miles. Good discussion overall
I also had AP1 on initial day and specifically recall it being rough and mostly unusable in many situations where it is now fine. There are plenty of threads and videos documenting this. Consider if you are comparing initial AP2 to current AP1 instead of initial AP1.
Is it me or am I the only one that doesn't really care that AP2 doesn't work yet. Ill tell you what I miss, rain sensing wipers. I spent 20 minutes in a light mist wondering why my wipers where being stupid before I remembered that "feature" was not working yet! I guess I am the stupid one...
Not proven and won't be until an independent authority can validate such a claim. Tesla saying it doesn't make it true, just like many things Tesla says.
You lost me at 'we should get the DoD involved'... Can someone more knowledgeable than I verify that the software can or was running in the background and learning prior to being active for the end user to deploy? That would put a massive hole in the OPs 6bn miles argument.
wow, it's only taken four pages and we are already at the "I would have thought it should be easy to program <insert feature here>" stage. Time to unwatch the thread already
Completely disagree. If you keep your hands on the wheel, like you're supposed to, you can feel the wheel beginning to move, and if you're paying attention, like you're supposed to, you will know that the wheel is moving in a way it's not supposed to and can immediately correct it. What idiot waits to see the car cross the lane into opposing traffic before doing something about it?