USA MY RWD has soft limited LR battery!

[EVChris]

How did you buy a 2023 new in 2024? Does that mean you have the premium audio system?

I'm seeing 18 2023 RWDs in CA right now.

United States Tesla New Demo Model Y inventory

This is the New Demo Model Y inventory for cars in United States. The inventory is taken from Tesla directly and refreshed every few minutes, we also explicitly differentiate between New and Demo cars both of which Tesla list as New. In many countries we also gather used cars from various...

tesla-info.com

 

[mborkow]

How can I tell if it’s a 2024 or 2023 from the Tesla inventory site? It doesn’t say the year

23s are not eligible for Fed tax incentives (the 2024s show price after rebate)

 

[Kohan]

Charge to full 2023

 

[branden]

Spending time with a mid-March delivery Model Y RWD and will be doing testing with it including CAN data - if you have any requests, let me know.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1783334177724637506

 

[gt2690b]

Spending time with a mid-March delivery Model Y RWD and will be doing testing with it including CAN data - if you have any requests, let me know.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1783334177724637506

stupid question but is this the LFP battery ?

 

[E90alex]

stupid question but is this the LFP battery ?

No he’s in the US.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

.Another forum member documented pulling 251kW on his 2023 RWD (he was just about at 0% when he snapped the pic showing that rate).

Looks like they added software limiting for 2024? That curve is easily capable of greater than 162kW. I'm sure someone can line up and overlay a Panasonic LR curve on this. Should match exactly where not limited.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1784064907278786926

 

[kpanda17]

What am I missing? Old MY 4680 NMC upto 260 kw charging, new MY RWD LFP 160 kw
And maybe some RWDs are SW limited NCMs

But due to the glut of batteries Elon alluded to
Tesla maybe using LFP or NCM depending market conditions

Amazing

 

[E90alex]

What am I missing? Old MY 4680 NMC upto 260 kw charging, new MY RWD LFP 160 kw
And maybe some RWDs are SW limited NCMs

But due to the glut of batteries Elon alluded to
Tesla maybe using LFP or NCM depending market conditions

Amazing

The battery used depends on the market. They’re not just switching back and forth. US market appears to be soft limited Panasonic NCA. Most other markets will be using CATL LFP or BYD blade LFP for Berlin built cars.

4680 Y AWD had a high peak charge rate but it was very brief and started to derate rather quickly as seen from the graph above.

 

[Technokrat]

So which ones better or if that even matters to the average owner?

 

[kpanda17]

So which ones better or if that even matters to the average owner?

I have 2x M3RWD LFPs, amazing with 100% charge, 270 miles of range, slow charge but not a huge issue
But as per above in rhe USA, where I am, no LFP MYs

Think about it
NCM say 300 miles of range, 85% (10-95%) usable or 255 miles
Vs
LFP 270 miles of range, 90% (10-100%) usable or 243 miles
4.7% less
LFPs are great

 

[PNWLeccy]

I have 2x M3RWD LFPs, amazing with 100% charge, 270 miles of range, slow charge but not a huge issue
But as per above in rhe USA, where I am, no LFP MYs

Think about it
NCM say 300 miles of range, 85% (10-95%) usable or 255 miles
Vs
LFP 270 miles of range, 90% (10-100%) usable or 243 miles
4.7% less
LFPs are great

This term “usable” has always confused me. You can charge non-LFP batteries to 100% when needed, which I guarantee is rare, and charging at higher SoC when you need to supercharge on trips is much slower. Charging from 80-90% on NCM will be way faster than 90-100% on LFP when away from home.

I have had 2 long range teslas and a M3RWD. The LFP is great but people exaggerate the usability argument.

 

[mborkow]

For the first time since I’ve had my 2023 RWD Y, I charged above 80% so I decided to use the energy screen to calculate my pack’s capacity. I was at 86% charge with a projected range of 261 miles averaging 228 Wh/mi. The math says my pack is 69.2 kWh which seems pretty much in line with what we’ve seen from other 2023 RWD Model Ys.

 

[tunnu]

For the first time since I’ve had my 2023 RWD Y, I charged above 80% so I decided to use the energy screen to calculate my pack’s capacity. I was at 86% charge with a projected range of 261 miles averaging 228 Wh/mi. The math says my pack is 69.2 kWh which seems pretty much in line with what we’ve seen from other 2023 RWD Model Ys.

They must have forgot to software lock your car. Your estimates are higher that anyone else.

 

[mborkow]

They must have forgot to software lock your car. Your estimates are higher that anyone else.

The 2024s have all been around 66kWh but the 2023s that have been measured have been between 69 - 70kWh. The 2024s have slightly less range, it seems.

 

[kpanda17]

This term “usable” has always confused me. You can charge non-LFP batteries to 100% when needed, which I guarantee is rare, and charging at higher SoC when you need to supercharge on trips is much slower. Charging from 80-90% on NCM will be way faster than 90-100% on LFP when away from home.

I have had 2 long range teslas and a M3RWD. The LFP is great but people exaggerate the usability argument.

Standard use protocol of LFP is 10-100
NCM is not and too many 100% charges damages it
I have both and just saying for the $$ you get tremendous value with LFP
In the current gen of LFP it does not work much past 270 miles because the pack size would hinder use in a vehicle needing more range, much lower energy density
Vs NCM as rhe goto for 300+ mile range vehicles
With its much higher energy density

Think we killed this one

 

[ucmndd]

Standard use protocol of LFP is 10-100
NCM is not and too many 100% charges damages it

There’s really very little difference from a “battery health” perspective.

The recommendation to charge LFP to 100% is a BMS calibration thing, not because the batteries actually like being charged to 100%.

The “damage” caused by charging NCA/NCM cells to 100% is vastly overstated.

 

[kpanda17]

There’s really very little difference from a “battery health” perspective.

The recommendation to charge LFP to 100% is a BMS calibration thing, not because the batteries actually like being charged to 100%.

The “damage” caused by charging NCA/NCM cells to 100% is vastly overstated.

lets be factual:
"LFP (lithium iron phosphate) batteries can be charged to 100% every day, which is different from most lithium-ion batteries, which should only be charged to 100% when necessary. Charging LFP batteries to 100% can prevent accelerated calendar aging, which is the natural aging of a battery that occurs whether it's in use or not. Charging to 100% can also improve the vehicle's ability to accurately determine the state of charge and estimated range."
"NCM...cathode’s particles are made of little crystallites that let the lithium move back and forth. The crystal structures shrink and expand in different directions as the lithium comes and goes. Just like a brittle piece of metal, the more expanding and contracting and stretching and bending that goes in in these crystalline structures, the more you’ll start to have cracking and breaking, which gives more surface area for buildup. So, discharging less puts less stress and damage on the lithium crystals, captain! It’s best to plug in after every trip and only use a quarter of the battery at most.
Avoiding 100% Is Key
Automakers want to get away from this problem by using single crystal particles instead of many small crystals that can more easily crack up and give surface area for buildup. Another way to avoid problems is with more nickel in the mix. But, the expansion of crystals happens more at 100%, and oxygen can escape from the battery cells even with smaller crystal structures."

 

[ucmndd]

lets be factual:

It’s customary to provide citations when presenting something as “factual”. Are these your words or a copypasta from somewhere else?

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Old MY 4680 NMC upto 260 kw charging

You posted right after a post comparing 4680 in AWD to the Panasonic 2170 Model 3 2024 RWD.

Then you started discussing LFP, totally different topic which was not being addressed or criticized.

The issue is that the 4680 sucks. In the Cybertruck the v2 version sucks very slightly less but still sucks.

It’s one of the biggest recent failings of Tesla. With a 4680 that met the original objectives they’d have cars & trucks with much better value. Consumers can figure this out…

Here is another way to look at it - the taper is super important, not so much the peak charging rate (if you have both minimal taper and high charge rate that is best of course).

https://twitter.com/x/status/1784318137359347740

The LFP isn’t a bad pack option but your comparison exaggerates the benefit. Just compare carefully with the pack energy and the efficiency. Historically efficiency of the vehicles with NCA packs has been slightly better than the LFPs. When we get EPA data on this RWD 2024 we’ll be able to do a more direct comparison.

But in any case the original post wasn’t even criticizing LFP - which is a very decent pack option.