Very illogical decision on a very logical reasoned company?

[necho]

Lolachampcar, I see, you think similar ... have already asked this question the Tesla store, they got the order all cars that are cancelled have to be registered as demo cars ... also the Tesla employees told me they had a 2 week fight with headquarter, some even were told off to insist on the price decrease, they are all very p***** and said it's the first time they do not agree with their company ...

already thought to order 20 P85D in the most stupid configuration and then 1 day before delivery to cancel all ... that's how I feel about Tesla Sales department at the moment ... but only the local employees would suffer

Just out of curiosity, why does the original poster not cancel when the car is at the Service Center ready for delivery, eat the $2500 then buy the car as it sits for the new price like anyone else that walks in the SC and sees the car?

 

[lolachampcar]

If the local people are on your side, then cancel, let them register it as a demo then buy the demo for 1%/month and $1/mile less

 

[jpet]

nicho,
Perhaps Tesla has a hedge in place (paid for already) which protects them against such fluctuations in revenue from confirmed orders. Learning to do this the hard way from getting burned in the past may be the change the prevents flexibility today. This is just a guess on my part but it is something a smart company would learn the hard way to do.

It was a question asked at the Q3 analyst call and they did not hedge at the time. Because they have exposure to multiple markets / currencies, they expected some to go up and some to go down. The problem however is that USD has been going up against most other currencies making Tesla loose significant margin.

I know for sure that local sales has done all it can to minimize the impact of price increases towards customers that had not yet placed their order. These prospective customers received a phone call as soon as sales got word of a pending increase. In general, buyers in the EUR zone should be glad Tesla has not yet incorporated the full USD FX increase into the EUR price.

As to the CHF issue, this is an inverse story and Tesla probably has had less experience with this situation. It is up to Tesla to decide what to do but from a legal standpoint the price is fixed when you order the car so that you, as a customer, know exactly what you are due. My personal opinion is that Tesla should reconsider its standpoint vis-à-vis the existing contracts in CHF.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Lolachampcar, I see, you think similar ... have already asked this question the Tesla store, they got the order all cars that are cancelled have to be registered as demo cars ... also the Tesla employees told me they had a 2 week fight with headquarter, some even were told off to insist on the price decrease, they are all very p***** and said it's the first time they do not agree with their company ...

already thought to order 20 P85D in the most stupid configuration and then 1 day before delivery to cancel all ... that's how I feel about Tesla Sales department at the moment ... but only the local employees would suffer

You reserved a car from a company that doesn't negotiate on price, at the price they were asking when you reserved and now you're trying to negotiating on the price?

Don't like the no-negotiation business model, buy a car from somewhere else.
Want the current lower price, cancel, re-reserve and go to the back of the line.
Want to keep your place in line, pay the money.

Whichever you choose. Goodbye.

 

[breser]

For what it's worth Tesla did the same thing in the UK when there was a price dropped (and yes it dropped by more than the deposit price). They did the same thing with people who paid for the parcel shelf when it was added. They did the same thing when they added the parking sensors as standard and people paid for them. There have been exceptions to this where some people made a fuss and got them to deal with that one person differently. I think all of the exceptions have been on the small differences like the parcel shelf not big ones. But in general they refuse to change the price regardless of anything that happens.

If you don't like that you clearly have an option of canceling your order at the cost of your deposit.

 

[jpet]

For what it's worth Tesla did the same thing in the UK when there was a price dropped (and yes it dropped by more than the deposit price). They did the same thing with people who paid for the parcel shelf when it was added. They did the same thing when they added the parking sensors as standard and people paid for them. There have been exceptions to this where some people made a fuss and got them to deal with that one person differently. I think all of the exceptions have been on the small differences like the parcel shelf not big ones. But in general they refuse to change the price regardless of anything that happens.

If you don't like that you clearly have an option of canceling your order at the cost of your deposit.

The funny thing is that if Tesla wouldn't have lowered its price in Switzerland, there would not have been a problem...

 

[efusco]

Have Ford, Chevy, BMW, Porsche or any other major manufacturers dropped the prices on their cars in Switzerland?

 

[necho]

There was exact the same situation one year ago in Switzerland, and at that time they adjusted all open orders to the lower price level, so everyone was expected the same this year. So it's a bit strange from Jerome to talk about consistency ...

If they have margin issues due to the EUR, why not keep the Swiss price level for some longer period and work out a proper strategy not to upset customers?

The local Tesla guys asked their colleagues from MB and BMW, they all do reduce the price on open orders ... MB by 18% ... but who wants an ICE?

Sure I will stick to Tesla, there is no alternative ... it only s**** if you have great engineers and not so great sales in that company but better than the other way around , ... as I learned once, only about 20% of the population is triggered by logic ...

For what it's worth Tesla did the same thing in the UK when there was a price dropped (and yes it dropped by more than the deposit price). They did the same thing with people who paid for the parcel shelf when it was added. They did the same thing when they added the parking sensors as standard and people paid for them. There have been exceptions to this where some people made a fuss and got them to deal with that one person differently. I think all of the exceptions have been on the small differences like the parcel shelf not big ones. But in general they refuse to change the price regardless of anything that happens.

If you don't like that you clearly have an option of canceling your order at the cost of your deposit.

 

[breser]

There was exact the same situation one year ago in Switzerland, and at that time they adjusted all open orders to the lower price level, so everyone was expected the same this year. So it's a bit strange from Jerome to talk about consistency ...

I know you think they're being inconsistent but from what I've seen the situation one year ago in Switzerland was an outlier.

I should have also pointed out the flip side is true. Tesla has not raised prices on existing orders. I've been on both sides of this. With my first car Autopilot started shipping and my car missed it by a few days, everyone got the parking sensors I paid for. They also lowered the HPWC by nearly half of what I paid for it. On my 85D order they raised the price of the AWD option by $1,000 but my order is not increasing in price.

I understand your frustration but I would probably just eat the cost increase. Roughly everyone else getting the car will be paying the old price. Think of it as the cost of getting it earlier.

 

[GreenT]

Have Ford, Chevy, BMW, Porsche or any other major manufacturers dropped the prices on their cars in Switzerland?

Very good question ...

 

[necho]

That's the funny part, I had ordered one P85D in Oktober, delivery delayed from beginning to end of May as birthday present, when I cancel and reorder the delivery time is still the same, but no, they want the bureaucracy way ...

I understand your frustration but I would probably just eat the cost increase. Roughly everyone else getting the car will be paying the old price. Think of it as the cost of getting it earlier.

 

[jpet]

If they have margin issues due to the EUR, why not keep the Swiss price level for some longer period and work out a proper strategy not to upset customers?

Indeed, the potential impact of upsetting existing customers is important. The only reason I see to lower the price is to increase sales, right? Now the question is how price elastic is a Model S buyer. Maybe just lowering half of what they have done now would have the same effect. The other half could then be used to lower the price for existing customers. And everybody would be happy...

 

[SeminoleFSU]

Very frustrated about a pricing decision for Switzerland by Jerome, may I ask for your thoughts?

I'm an owner of two fully loaded P85+ (Sig. and Prod.) and an X Sig. reservation holder, one of the first orderer of the S in Europe. In October I have ordered two P85D maxed out, one with soonest delivery (March), one scheduled for May. Due to currency fluctuations Tesla has dropped the price in Switzerland by about USD 8000, I thought same situation as one year ago, when they adjusted the price of the open orders (since its currency based price drop, so Tesla exchange the money to USD when final payment is received, yes and some remains in local currencies but the price drop is only a fraction of the currency drop, 5.x % vs 10.x %). But now Jerome decided to stick to the contracts.

I wrote him and tried to explain that it doesn't make any sense, but got a standard reply not answering any arguments. I freaked out most when he used words like 'because of consistency and fairness', since it's the opposite.

Here my arguments, may I ask for your thoughts, am I wrong?

i) One year ago, same situation, but price was adjusted on open orders (consistency?)

ii) up to now, no quote for my current P85+, obviously now also price of used cars dropped, so I only get the bad side of this price drop (fair?)

iii) my first car is produced and in transit to Europe, cancel and reorder add 3 month waiting time (have waited 4 1/2 years for my Sig. will survive it). Tesla will have to find a new buyer, and the new buyer is obviously only going to pay the lower price, so why not to keep a long time supporter happy and give it to him for the same price, Tesla only gains the reservation fee to make me unhappy?

iv) my second car has no VIN yet, if I reorder I will have same delivery time, but I have to cancel, reorder, repay fee to get the same as I have ?

Does this behavior for pricing make any sense to anybody?

I don't care about the price of the car, I think it's the best car on the market you can get and I would have paid more without hesitating. But I'm getting very annoyed if someone try to treat you unfair against any logic. Your thoughts?

Aren't central banks fun? End the FEDs. Return to sound (hard) money... not fiat currency.

 

[Jacina]

Have Ford, Chevy, BMW, Porsche or any other major manufacturers dropped the prices on their cars in Switzerland?

Yes significantly

Something everyone needs to know, around the 15th Jan the Swiss Frank significantly (20%) gained value vs ALL other currencies. It has nothing to do with the euro.

 

[necho]

I guess I would call it this time an outlier ...

Yes significantly

Something everyone needs to know, around the 15th Jan the Swiss Frank significantly (20%) gained value vs ALL other currencies. It has nothing to do with the euro.

 

[Lloyd]

Aren't central banks fun? End the FEDs. Return to sound (hard) money... not fiat currency.

Gold standard AND a ballanced budget???? Too much to ask.

 

[Taipan]

already thought to order 20 P85D in the most stupid configuration and then 1 day before delivery to cancel all ... that's how I feel about Tesla Sales department at the moment ...

@Necho, I understand your pain but that line got me chuckles

What would be the stupidest configuration -in terms of future resale value- to order today ?

I'd say the whole P85D with full options external (roof, 21", premium paint, winter 21" wheels) and internal (exec rear seats, SuperSound, alarm, carbon) but with one cave-out : no Tech Package with 17' touchscreen, AutoPilot and GPS etc.
Too bad you can't order non-leather seats anymore on the P85D, that would be a hell of lemon !
Still adds up to USD 135K

 

[necho]

Yeah, thats great idea, executive seats, plain white and no tech ... 20 of them makes 50k for that fun, cancel the last day :smile: ... the same time I feel very sorry for the employees in the Swiss store, it's quite a depressive mood there, they told me they fought two weeks and some risked their jobs arguing with the headquarter ... btw the guy illogical reasoned is French :wink:

@Necho, I understand your pain but that line got me chuckles

What would be the stupidest configuration -in terms of future resale value- to order today ?

I'd say the whole P85D with full options external (roof, 21", premium paint, winter 21" wheels) and internal (exec rear seats, SuperSound, alarm, carbon) but with one cave-out : no Tech Package with 17' touchscreen, AutoPilot and GPS etc.
Too bad you can't order non-leather seats anymore on the P85D, that would be a hell of lemon !
Still adds up to USD 135K

 

[Taipan]

... btw the guy illogical reasoned is French :wink:

Used to be French but as we say here, no judgement whatsoever, "perdu pour la France" (Lost for France).
PhD Mech Engineering at Michigan 95-99.
McKinsey 99-02
Daimler US 02-10
Tesla US aftewards

Now I agree with you 200%: Sales people at Tesla need to loot a clue.
Or revisit their hiring policy because the disconnect with the car price is just blah... meh... wtf...

 

[bonnie]

I hope that no one gets into trouble after all the comments reporting Tesla employees at the Swiss location saying how unreasonable headquarters was to deal with ... if anyone is overstating the conversation, might be good to clarify that. To not do so could negatively impact someone's job.