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Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500,000 Vehicles Over Emissions Software

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I can't believe that they actually thought that they'd never get caught. Arrogance knows no bounds.
Maybe they calculated the risk, and thought it would be cheaper to set money aside for future legal settlements & buybacks, and just hope they got away with it for few years, than to actually invest (large amounts of) money into new Diesel tech that would do the job.

Someone made the decision to cheat, and I find it hard to believe that engineers made that decision.
 
How would a buyback work? Do they have to buy a several year old car back at the price they sold it or is there some way to calculate depreciation (apart from new pollution concerns)? My wife has a diesel BMW X5 and if BMW has been doing the same, I would love to have them buy it back at full price so we can get a Model X.
 
How would a buyback work? Do they have to buy a several year old car back at the price they sold it or is there some way to calculate depreciation (apart from new pollution concerns)? My wife has a diesel BMW X5 and if BMW has been doing the same, I would love to have them buy it back at full price so we can get a Model X.

I'd google 'Toyota Tacoma rust buy back'. Toyota was forced to buy back some of their vehicles because of major frame rust issues, but I can't remember the numbers. Recently, Nissan had to buy back some of their LEAFs as well (bad welds), but I don't remember seeing any public numbers for that case either.
 
A good follow-up 10 questions and answers on the Green Car Reports website:
VW Diesel Emissions Recall: What You Need To Know In 10 Questions

My favorite part:
We suspect the EPA will want to put Volkswagen's rotting head on a pike on the walls of the town, to discourage the blatant, flagrant arrogance that the company appears to have displayed.

Kamala Harris is the current Attorney General in California. She is running for the U.S. Senate. She just essentially won that upcoming election. She is going to go after these guys so hard they will wish their heads were rotting on spikes in the Mohave desert. The talking heads on CBNC this morning were already playing down the possible fine, saying it would be just a "fraction" of the potential $18 billion number being thrown around. I'll be e-mailing Kamala, the Gov, and all my representatives shortly requesting the maximum possible penalty that the state of California can extract from these nitwits. I wouldn't be surprised if the state attempts to preclude the company from selling any cars in the state. This is unprecedented. There are a lot of people who are going to be very unhappy knowing that the VW's driving by their homes the last 7 years have been belching out 35x the amount of NOx allowable under the law.

They are done. Stick a fork in them. :mad:

RT
 
If the government had any brains (tall order, I know) they would make a deal that causes VW to build out a generic DC fast charge network to the value of the fine. Ideally, it would be based on the Tesla model to extend what is already in place. And it would essentially be open-source, so that all other manufacturers could make use of it for their electric offerings.

Open source to alleviate the obvious concern that VW might put a software charge speed defeat routine in the station software to prevent other manufacturers from having benefit of the full charge current!!! :rolleyes: (Too soon??? :tongue: )
 
A good follow-up 10 questions and answers on the Green Car Reports website:
VW Diesel Emissions Recall: What You Need To Know In 10 Questions

My favorite part:
We suspect the EPA will want to put Volkswagen's rotting head on a pike on the walls of the town, to discourage the blatant, flagrant arrogance that the company appears to have displayed.

Kamala Harris is the current Attorney General in California. She is running for the U.S. Senate. She just essentially won that upcoming election. She is going to go after these guys so hard they will wish their heads were rotting on spikes in the Mohave desert. The talking heads on CBNC this morning were already playing down the possible fine, saying it would be just a "fraction" of the potential $18 billion number being thrown around. I'll be e-mailing Kamala, the Gov, and all my representatives shortly requesting the maximum possible penalty that the state of California can extract from these nitwits. I wouldn't be surprised if the state attempts to preclude the company from selling any cars in the state. This is unprecedented. There are a lot of people who are going to be very unhappy knowing that the VW's driving by their homes the last 7 years have been belching out 35x the amount of NOx allowable under the law.

They are done. Stick a fork in them. :mad:

RT
Just read that each pound of N2O has 300 times the climate warming effect as a pound of CO2. So, 35x N2O times 300x effect equals huge climate damage. Maybe California could sue VW for the cost of the wildfires this year (and for the next 100 years or so).

- - - Updated - - -

A good follow-up 10 questions and answers on the Green Car Reports website:
VW Diesel Emissions Recall: What You Need To Know In 10 Questions

My favorite part:
We suspect the EPA will want to put Volkswagen's rotting head on a pike on the walls of the town, to discourage the blatant, flagrant arrogance that the company appears to have displayed.

Kamala Harris is the current Attorney General in California. She is running for the U.S. Senate. She just essentially won that upcoming election. She is going to go after these guys so hard they will wish their heads were rotting on spikes in the Mohave desert. The talking heads on CBNC this morning were already playing down the possible fine, saying it would be just a "fraction" of the potential $18 billion number being thrown around. I'll be e-mailing Kamala, the Gov, and all my representatives shortly requesting the maximum possible penalty that the state of California can extract from these nitwits. I wouldn't be surprised if the state attempts to preclude the company from selling any cars in the state. This is unprecedented. There are a lot of people who are going to be very unhappy knowing that the VW's driving by their homes the last 7 years have been belching out 35x the amount of NOx allowable under the law.

They are done. Stick a fork in them. :mad:

RT
Just read that each pound of N2O has 300 times the climate warming effect as a pound of CO2. So, 35x N2O times 300x effect equals huge climate damage. Maybe California could sue VW for the cost of the wildfires this year (and for the next 100 years or so).
 
I want to chime in that, although I too am disgusted at this company's actions; the extent to which the EPA's allegations are true are in strict lockstep with the 'perfect' criminal nature of the deed: that is, there is exactly one reason to have created this software - to break the law.

REGARDLESS, there is a wonderful humor here: they shouldna ha' placed Herr Doktor Heisenberg on VW's board, doncha see?:wink:
 
A good follow-up 10 questions and answers on the Green Car Reports website:
VW Diesel Emissions Recall: What You Need To Know In 10 Questions
That article is a great summary. It mentions the urea / AdBlue theory that I mentioned and also the curious fact that VW appeared to have kept the cheat in the updated engine with the urea system. I see two possibilities: those engines aren't affected or VW carried over the software (too lazy or they wanted to keep the performance boost).

The BMW X5 xDrive 330d diesel crossover (with urea system) was also tested by the same researchers that discovered the problem, but that passed no problem. So it appears BMW didn't do the same thing.
 
This whole business is very interesting on many levels.

I would be very interested to know if there was any unusual activity in the VAG stock on the days leading up to the announcement by EPA. Any insider sells? Unusually high shorting activity?

The stock is lightly traded on the US and Paris exchanges, but heavily traded on the Frankfurt exchange. I couldn't find any option chains and hence no historic price data - it would be interesting to know for example if demand for short-term puts increased in the days leading up to the announcement. Direct stock lending and shorting is not easy data to get access to for us, but the authorities and the stock exchange themselves of course have all this data...
 
Here is for reference, 1998 case with Caterpillar Inc., Cummins Engine Company, Detroit Diesel Corporation, Mack Trucks, Inc., Navistar International Transportation Corporation, Renault Vehicules Industriels, s.a. and Volvo Truck Corporation

"U.S. and foreign diesel companies deliberately tried to thwart federal pollution controls with their engine designs. Government lawyers accused the manufacturers of using "defeat devices" that enabled engines to pass federal vehicle emissions tests even though they belched prodigious amounts of sooty fumes at highway speeds."

http://tech.mit.edu/V118/N52/diesel.3.2.52w.html



"Diesel Manufacturers Settle Suit With EPA; Will Pay $1.1 Billion"

And here EPA's page of same case:
http://yosemite.epa.gov/opa/admpress.nsf/0/93e9e651adeed6b7852566a60069ad2e?OpenDocument
 
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Here is for reference, 1998 case with Mack Trucks Inc., Cummins Engine Co. and Caterpillar Inc etc.

"U.S. and foreign diesel companies deliberately tried to thwart federal pollution controls with their engine designs. Government lawyers accused the manufacturers of using "defeat devices" that enabled engines to pass federal vehicle emissions tests even though they belched prodigious amounts of sooty fumes at highway speeds."

http://tech.mit.edu/V118/N52/diesel.3.2.52w.html



"Diesel Manufacturers Settle Suit With EPA; Will Pay $1.1 Billion"

Too bad the article didn't reference how many vehicles were effected... my guess is a lot less than ~500k...

I think this is probably going to kill the diesel engine for light duty vehicles in the US...
 
I think this is probably going to kill the diesel engine for light duty vehicles in the US...
I'm not sure about that... assuming the other guys are compliant (BMW, M-B), the technology is feasible. If bringing the culprit models into compliance is really just about AdBlue and perhaps detuning slightly, even those models could continue. Since 2000 I've owned three VW diesels (Jettas and a Passat) and a '09 E Class diesel (no AdBlue). By wife traded her 2010 A3 TDI for a newer '15 TDI. They've all been great cars, with great performance and economy. And owners are for the most part very devoted to their TDI's.

I think it will start some serious discussion, but it won't be enough to kill diesel all on its own.
 
...I have a very dear friend who used to work in the German auto industry at a VW supplier who, when I posted about this on Facebook, replied with a puzzled "but this is rubbish, of course everybody does this, it's how the game is played" kind of answer. This is a person I respect very much, and seeing that response drove home to me how deeply rotten the system must be...

This whole situation reminds me of the sports athlete steroid scandals where more and more people joined in figuring "hey!, everyone else seems to be doing it, so it must be OK, right?"
100 wrongs don't make a right...
 
I'm not sure about that... assuming the other guys are compliant (BMW, M-B), the technology is feasible. If bringing the culprit models into compliance is really just about AdBlue and perhaps detuning slightly, even those models could continue. Since 2000 I've owned three VW diesels (Jettas and a Passat) and a '09 E Class diesel (no AdBlue). By wife traded her 2010 A3 TDI for a newer '15 TDI. They've all been great cars, with great performance and economy. And owners are for the most part very devoted to their TDI's.

I think it will start some serious discussion, but it won't be enough to kill diesel all on its own.

We'll see what's required to bring these cars up to compliance... every non-VW diesel car I've seen has spent a lot of time in the shop dealing with emissions systems issues. If meeting emissions requirements was easy then VW would not have taken this risk. At minimum I would expect the TDI to disappear for a few years as VW fixes this issue; this happened before when they couldn't meet CA emissions standards. That would leave only high end Mercedes and BMW diesels. A ~$40k+ sedan marketed to people seeking high mpgs would be an easy target for the model 3.

I agree diesel will remain for trucks... for starters the emissions requirements are lower.
 
AE in the UK is reporting that VW have stopped sales of some models in the US, so this is already costing direct $$$ in lost sales today.

It will be interesting to see how far this goes in Europe too.
I have to say that it is curious how no rival manufacturer has spotted this, or the implication is that maybe this deceit is more widespread, even if VW are the worst culprit.
It seems your testing regimes are much better in the US, we have to put up with ludicrous (soory) claims about 70+mpg on vehicles in brochures that barely reach 50mpg real world.
About time this was sorted too.

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/volkswagen/92893/vw-halting-us-sales-of-diesel-models-after-accusation-of-cheating-emissions-test