UkNorthampton
TSLA - 12+ startups in 1
Hmm, loads of different models, presumably something like this - https://www.fleetnews.co.uk/car-run...ype=&Manufacturer=mercedes-benz&Model=e-class
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where will we be in 3 years time?
- Thread starter bingbongbing
- Start date
What does that mean? It's an ICE running on fossil fuel! Still pouring carbon into our overheated atmosphere even if it has a reduction of some particulates and/or NOx when to compared to some other diesel monster vehicle.
SpareHeadOne
Member
I think that Tesla will have given up on FSD and will just give everyone who bought it one of the new Tesla robots to drive them as a chauffeur instead.
And some people will still be banging on about Apple things being overpriced.
And some people will still be banging on about Apple things being overpriced.
This is the sort of discussion I love on this forum. Lots of wildly differing opinions, everyone convinced they’re right but 90% of it is pure speculation. Let’s be honest, no one knows what the landscape will be like in 3 years for Tesla or any other manufacturer because it’s changing so rapidly. But it makes great reading 
Stranger Dings
Member
There are plenty of other reports too. Try this one.
Mercedes Vision EQXX set to smash range for EVs
My overall point is that a Mercedes concept is no different to Elon announcing the roadster or Cybertruck going on sale and then taking 5 years to make it; assuming they do eventually make them.
If Merc do start making decent EVs, Tesla have to improve massively. Crappy plastic window switches, plastic seats, poor wipers, phantom braking and useless auto dip headlights won’t be acceptable if others improve range and charging.
UkNorthampton
TSLA - 12+ startups in 1
Thanks, I thought it was a real car from way described. I had heard people laughing about this, didn't look at. It's a part of brand PR to put out nonsense spoiler articles promising the earth - concepts, hydrogen, "coming in 2/3/4 years" - just long enough to seem realistic, avoid customers switching brands. Surprised anyone falls for it, but PR seem to think they do.
Tesla concepts tend to look like final products, refreshingly so. No point making low volume cars when Tesla can make all existing models in greater volume.
Tesla concepts aren't always quite what you get either. The plaid was supposed to come with 600mile range and got downgraded. The roadster is still vapourware apart from a couple of play cars and the final price will be way higher than originally stated apart perhaps from pre-orders if they get honoured. The Mercedes concept is a good idea as a high end competitor for the roadster and if merc made it before the roadster then it'd sell well in that niche market
The Mercedes EQ XX has some clever battery and motor tech and the routing software that allows for wind and elevation to maximise range is pretty clever too. While we aren’t likely to see a production version of the XX, they have said they’ll use the battery and motor tech from around 2024. It’s also worth mentioning that Mercedes had pretty good self driving tech with level 3 available to order now, though it is limited to 60kph. Their voice commands actually work, unlike Tesla which are very hit and miss and the auto headlights and
wipers work work well too. I should point I’m no fan of Mercedes as the one I owned was probably the worst built car I’ve owned. It never actually broke down, just lots of faults to the point where I was on first name terms with the service team at the local dealer.
The point I’m trying to make is that there’s no guarantee that Tesla will stay ahead of the competition and will be less attractive if/when they open up the supercharger network. Throw in variable build quality and software oddities and over promising/under delivery on FSD, roadster 2, semi, cybertruck and robo taxi and it does make me wonder whether it will all end in tears. Having said that the DOJO supercomputer chip is a very clever design and should ramp up AI training by a big factor when it goes live either this year or next, so maybe we will get auto wipers that work properly at some point.
wipers work work well too. I should point I’m no fan of Mercedes as the one I owned was probably the worst built car I’ve owned. It never actually broke down, just lots of faults to the point where I was on first name terms with the service team at the local dealer.
The point I’m trying to make is that there’s no guarantee that Tesla will stay ahead of the competition and will be less attractive if/when they open up the supercharger network. Throw in variable build quality and software oddities and over promising/under delivery on FSD, roadster 2, semi, cybertruck and robo taxi and it does make me wonder whether it will all end in tears. Having said that the DOJO supercomputer chip is a very clever design and should ramp up AI training by a big factor when it goes live either this year or next, so maybe we will get auto wipers that work properly at some point.
Tesla has only 3 advantages yet dozens of disadvantages. The advantages are Supercharger system, excellent zero depreciation and supercharger system!
We all know the downside. It is a very low spec, ugly car. However as long as they have a growing and dedicated supercharger system, I will continue to renew my Tesla every year for free! My second car, the one I use every day in life will never be a Tesla as I prefer the better cars that the other manufacturers supply. At the moment the excellent, under rated Kia Soul, more efficient than the Tesla, better looking, easier to get into and a more comfortable ride and driving experience. I am sure that the Polestar 2 and the EV^ are also better cars to drive.
But in 3, 5 or 10 years time Tesla may still have the S?C advantage that they currently enjoy and will therefore dominate the market.
We all know the downside. It is a very low spec, ugly car. However as long as they have a growing and dedicated supercharger system, I will continue to renew my Tesla every year for free! My second car, the one I use every day in life will never be a Tesla as I prefer the better cars that the other manufacturers supply. At the moment the excellent, under rated Kia Soul, more efficient than the Tesla, better looking, easier to get into and a more comfortable ride and driving experience. I am sure that the Polestar 2 and the EV^ are also better cars to drive.
But in 3, 5 or 10 years time Tesla may still have the S?C advantage that they currently enjoy and will therefore dominate the market.
thesmokingman
Active Member
Come this March we will have had an X for 5 years, washed it at the weekend and when parked up next to our Lexus (the very definition of build quality) there are no obvious signs the Tesla had much more mileage.
There is literally no other EV on the market I would swap it for (apart from another new X which you cannot buy now and costs about £50k more than what we paid for ours).
In 3 years time I'll still be diving our X and I suspect just as happy. I use to swap cars every 2-3 years, 4 in one year was my record, but now I honestly cannot see us ever selling the X, its part of the family
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There is literally no other EV on the market I would swap it for (apart from another new X which you cannot buy now and costs about £50k more than what we paid for ours).
In 3 years time I'll still be diving our X and I suspect just as happy. I use to swap cars every 2-3 years, 4 in one year was my record, but now I honestly cannot see us ever selling the X, its part of the family
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I think the point for me is if another car, say Polestar has about the same range as a tesla, was cheaper and I could use the Tesla network, then I would be all over it. But if its not cheaper and still uses the public network, then its a definite no. For me the network and super ease of using the M3 is what trumps anything. we looked at all sorts of cars before buying the M3. Hybrids were all more expensive pretty much, and nearly all new electric cars that could do the same range and be as efficient.
Tesla atm is miles in front of the competition. The rest either need to reduce prices to compensate for using the other network or have better range.
Tesla atm is miles in front of the competition. The rest either need to reduce prices to compensate for using the other network or have better range.
I understand where you are coming from. The "just work" thing isn't true though. They are as unreliable as other smartphones. But yes, you can't directly compare them because iPhones are near the top of smartphone build quality, Tesla can't say the same in the car industry.
I think it's more a perception/image/fanboy thing for me. It's almost impossible to discuss both products objectively because people have an irrational "love" of things that, in the end, are just pieces of technology designed to make huge profits for the companies that make them
cryo
Member
Why do people keep stating so called Tesla killers at their base price???? then go on to state non existent tech/additions at that base price. Lets compare like for like, I'll start, non Tesla dealership, panoramic roof sir that will be another £2500, heated steering wheel and seats all round sir that's another £2000, heat pump sir that's another £1500/2000 etc. etc. The reason I bought a MIC SR+ is it will do the same range as the newcomers and has all the tech/additions in the price and after comparing the newcomers with the same tech/additions they were not in any way comparable on price and is some cases could only be described as closed shop dealership theft (yes Audi that's you) I must admit I purchased the heated steering wheel and rear seats for £275. Non Tesla dealership, heated rear seats and steering wheel upgrade for £275 you are obviously joking sir try adding another zero.
(yes Audi that's you) I must admit I purchased the heated steering wheel and rear seats for £275. Non Tesla dealership, heated rear seats and steering wheel upgrade for £275 you are obviously joking sir try adding another zero.
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absolutely agree with this. Tesla are great for their price. Like you mention, when we looked elsewhere, if we wanted the same kit the M3 had, it was another 7-8K on top of a £38k base price. With less efficient cars and not using the tesla network, is was a no brainer. The cabin might look basic to some but I actually prefer that compared to a dash/front of the car looking like a spaceship from the 1970s.Why do people keep stating so called Tesla killers at their base price???? then go on to state non existent tech/additions at the base price. Lets compare like for like, Il start non Tesla, panoramic roof sir that will be another £2000, heated steering wheel and seats all round that's another £2000, heat pump sir that's another £1500 etc. etc. The reason I bought a MIC SR+ is it will do the same range as the newcomers and has all the tech/additions in the price and after comparing the newcomers with the same tech/additions they were not in any way comparable on price and is some cases could only be described closed shop dealership fraud
So why own the Lexus? Probably for the same reasons I have my 29yr old Nissan and the wife has a Qashqai as well as my S - a combination of nostalgia, those journeys you just don't want to use an EV for - remote areas, going to popular venues and being parked up for a week with likely charger queues en route and no destination chargers free 'cos of the crowds and as a spare for when Tesla have yours in for 6-8weeks waiting for parts or you just want to get from A->B without dog-legging to go via a charger. And when in 3-4 years your battery dies and Tesla quote £20K for a new one will you bother?
Forecasting is a tad futile. Total number of global car sales was somewhere around 77milion compared to Teslas 1mill. It's an achievement but..
The real issues are whether battery production for 77mill cars is feasible from the raw material viewpoint and why would the volume makers re-tool when they have good sales? That doesn't mean they aren't researching and waiting for the time when they'll jump in with real choices and quality products at affordable prices after governments have built the networks for them. Meanwhile they knock out the odd EV as tasters and to get feedback.
Parking aid… that will be £3,400 sir..Why do people keep stating so called Tesla killers at their base price???? then go on to state non existent tech/additions at that base price. Lets compare like for like, I'll start, non Tesla dealership, panoramic roof sir that will be another £2500, heated steering wheel and seats all round sir that's another £2000, heat pump sir that's another £1500/2000 etc. etc. The reason I bought a MIC SR+ is it will do the same range as the newcomers and has all the tech/additions in the price and after comparing the newcomers with the same tech/additions they were not in any way comparable on price and is some cases could only be described as closed shop dealership theft
CarPlay.. not available sir…
I take your point but some people actually like to decide on these things
Fox86
Member
What you comparing it to, to say it‘s a ‘very low spec’? Having come from owning BMWs for the last 9 years (and loved all of them) and family members owning countless Audis, Mercedes, etc over the years, I can’t say the Tesla is a low spec car let alone VERY low spec.
Are there bits that could be better? Of course but I could get into any car and say the same
I’ve driven a Polestar 2 and it was a lovely car, more practical with the hatch back and from some angles it‘s better looking. However if you want ‘low spec’ get in one that hasn‘t had the £££ option packs put on it which makes it a lot more expensive than a Tesla M3. Better to drive? In my opinion, no you sit higher and the car was less responsive. Couple that with poorer efficiency and it didn’t really add up for me.
Everyone’s priorities in a car are different, yours sound very different to mine.. . For one I’d like it if the seat could go even lower down in the Tesla, so you feel like your sat on the floor like in a BMW
I just had to google the Kia Soul and I get looks are subjective but I’d happily put money on the Tesla getting voted better looking than a Kia Soul in any pole outside of a Kia Soul owners forum.
The styling and interior on that are not to my taste, but then it be a pretty boring world if we all like the same thing
Ah the old "grid can't cope" line...
Can the grid cope with the extra demand from electric cars? | National Grid Group
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