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Why are TACC, AP (and ?FSD) so bad?
- Thread starter mspohr
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- ap fsd phantom braking tacc
That's so different from my experience. I can't remember the last time that FSD disengaged. I drive 95% on FSD, of which 80% is on surface streets. Very little issues on the vast majority of my miles.
Ok so what is your point? Are you trying to say that because of your observation that mine is false? Now I may not have been totally clear in my opinion....I don't believe the car ALWAYS sees, displays and reacts to clearely visable speed limit signs. My observation doesn't preclude yours.
E90alex
Active Member
Mine will slam on the brakes for the new speed limit. Whether it’s reading the sign or using map data I don’t know but it slows down abruptly. This is on TACC or regular basic Autopilot.
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zoomer0056
Active Member
Agree, mine changes for speed limits slows down in curves, Slows for caution (yellow) signs.
And what I've been impressed with lately is if a vehicle is pulled partially of the road, a postal truck for example, it slows down and moves to the right to give them room. I suspect that this is something that many people haven't seen as I guess they see the vehicle and "know" that the car can't handle it and disengage FSD without letting the car try.
E90alex
Active Member
zoomer0056
Active Member
E90alex
Active Member
2023.2.12. It has done it in past software versions since I’ve had the car.
Tesla have been reporting the total miles driven by FSD beta, if I recall its now over 4 million (may be higher, I'm quoting from memory). Where are all the accidents? You can be sure they would be loudly reported in the press.
Of course, with beta testers being cautious, its hard to say how many disengagements prevented accidents .. almost all of mine for many months now have been "embarrassment" based (others have said the same), with the car being too cautious and getting honked at by other motorists. Even in dangerous cases it's not clear how many disengagements prevented the car from taking preventive action, since beta testers are pretty cautious (as they own the car etc).
So no, it's not nonsense. However, I do agree that there is a danger of complacent drivers "zoning out" as they put more trust than is warranted in FSD. This was one of the factors that drove Waymo to skip L2/L3 and go direct to L4/L5. But the same argument can be made for ANY driver assist, even dumb cruise control from decades ago.
To date, people have been saying again and again FSD would cause mayhem since the day it went into early beta, then when the beta was expanded to larger numbers, and then when it was released to anyone who wanted it. Where is all this "mayhem"? Or is it still "just about to happen"? Sure, there are real risks, and FSD has a long way to go, but let's cut back on the Chicken Little stuff?
And let's look at the NHTSA "recall" .. after all the excitement and "they will remove it" and "they will shut it down" shouting, all they actually did was ask for a few minor changes (that beta testers had been asking for anyway) .. and that was all. And that's from the NHTSA which is incredibly safety conscious. Do you think they would have only asked for that if the car had been crashing or dangerous in all their testing???
Yes, people have deliberately places speed limit signs at locations and the car has responded. As for the two sources of limits (signs and maps), I don't have data on how the car resolves these, but I would guess it chooses the slower of the two. And no, my theory isnt thrown into "chaos" by it misreading one sign . did I (or anyone else) claim the sign reading was perfect?
So, yes, the car reads speed limit signs. Nothing to see here.
aka "they were planning on changing it anyway". Even more probable "it's been in the V11 software for months."
So you just choose to ignore reports of signs not being read, displayed, or reacted to?
Again, yes with a Model S running AP1 only...as far as I know. Feel free to provide references to Model 3 testing of this.
There are many if you trust the NHTSA reports (which are public). I disagree with the press being loud wrt FSD. Quite the contrary, given the level of this bait and switch scam.
Yes it is nonsense, since your statement was "Yet the early numbers for FSD beta also look good". Now you're talking about miles, but that's irrelevant given the non-disclosed number of incidents - which typically companies with autonomous ambitions would report to the DMV by law. But not Tesla.
I don't think NHTSA is done. They have decided on a strategy, which seem to be "pick on all the unsafe operations". It's a smart strategy, and really the only way forward as I see it. I think NHTSA will keep doing this until Tesla promises that they've fixed it. Since it's impossible to provide such guarantees in an unbounded ODD, NHTSA will get their chance to strike down on this experiment if they chose to. Given Teslas track-record of non-improvement in terms of reliability, this won't likely take too long... <8 miles / DE for over 20 months, it's laughably bad.
No I haven't had a chance to get it delivered to my car and Tesla won't be able too either in the coming 2-3 years. This is something I learned by researching the UNECE R79 amendments and drafts. My car will be six years old by then, and it doesn't even have NoA - and Tesla won't refund. They keep selling FSD in EU to more sheep.
With regards to reliability, I look at the data. At first a looked at the reports by Dirty Tesla and more recently the Community Tracker: Home - it's alarmingly flat miles / DE. 4-8 miles for 30 months of public beta. Not bullish.
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Obviously you are an expert on it because you read the Internet!
The community tracker definitely should be considered a source of accurate data, after all it has awesome penetration with
That's 3 percent of 1 percent of the drivers with it.
As compared with you, a sample size of one? YouTube anecdotes?
Do you have a better data source? What's your miles / DE and miles to intervention? How's it trending?We all wish Tesla would report these KPI:s, and we all know why they don't and won't.
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I use it every day. Been doing so for quite a while.As compared with you, a sample size of one? YouTube anecdotes?
We all wish Tesla would report these KPI:s, and we all know why they don't and won't.
I'm not an expert on it. I've seen it grow since my first Tesla in early 2018. I've seen it barely working and I've seen it get much better. I know that there were road segments that it would completely balk on, I know that it doesn't think twice about them anymore.
I know that a few weeks ago it took me on a trip from McDonalds to Costco, 40 miles without a balk. And I know that there are others that have seen it do even better.
And since I read the Internet as well. That doesn't really make us even. If nothing else, with real experience, I'm able to quickly tell which Internet articles are BS, just because I have direct experience in know that they are wrong.
Of course not. But it's been clearly shown that the car DOES respond to speed limit signs. That doesn't mean it is 100% guaranteed to respond to ALL signs in ALL conditions. Do you know of any system that does provide such a guarantee?
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