Will the Model S/X have a spare tire & if not, how is that ok?

[rabar10]

...it's actually illegal to do any on-road repairs on the 400 series highways in Ontario...

You learn something new every day -- as a temporary Canadian resident, I was not aware of this.

With or without a spare tire, would there be a jack or lug-nut wrench included with the car? I'm thinking a small compartment off of the frunk, but we haven't seen any evidence of this in the recent Betas. Don't know how closely anyone inspected the frunks in Santana Row...

 

[Doug_G]

If they don't have a spare, then there won't be a jack or wrench. The ones that come with the car are crap anyway.

 

[3lectronica]

We do not know. Measurements, so far, make it look *very close*. If it doesn't fit, it will just barely not fit; if it does fit, it will be tight to some of the edges.

(See other posters' comments. 27.7" diameter tires, and approximately 28" width in the frunk. 9.6" width tires and 10" deep frunk.)

Frankly, if I have to haul the spare out, I'm not going to worry about the paint job. But given how tight the fit is, I might worry about being able to get it out! I actually probably wouldn't get a spare just for local driving, but for a road trip... you *need* one. And on a road trip I'll probably have two people to get it out, so it should be doable.

When I was at my local store, they had 21" Performance wheel laying around since they were remodeling. I asked to see if it could fit in the frunk, and take pics. I think you could carry a full size spare, but just barely!

 

[Andrew Wolfe]

I'm not so sure. The tire diameter adds 6.8". I don't really see that much slack in the pictures. Did you?

 

[dadaleus]

Yea, it does not look promising to me. Maybe if it was flat you could squish it in, but would that damage the tire by being squished in a weird position so long? And then it looks like the fronk would be useless for anything else. Looks like the recessed area would be inaccessible. (Could keep emergency supplies there I suppose--knowing you have to take the tire out to get to them.)

I like the idea of a spare, but looks like its a can of sealant and fingers crossed for me.

But hey, thanks for doing that 3lectronica!!

 

[Lloyd]

Yea, it does not look promising to me. Maybe if it was flat you could squish it in, but would that damage the tire by being squished in a weird position so long? And then it looks like the fronk would be useless for anything else. Looks like the recessed area would be inaccessible. (Could keep emergency supplies there I suppose--knowing you have to take the tire out to get to them.)

I like the idea of a spare, but looks like its a can of sealant and fingers crossed for me.

But hey, thanks for doing that 3lectronica!!

You could likely fit a "Space Saver" Spare!

 

[dadaleus]

I could, but I'm wondering if there is any concern with that and the electric motor. Also need one that fits the bolt pattern.

 

[William13]

I measured it today with the 21 inch wheel. It will not fit a full size spare. It allows 24 to 25 inch diameter in the frunk. Maybe a very low profile tire on the 19 inch rim. I doubt you should drive this expensive low riding car very far or fast likely this sort of spare.

 

[strider]

If you're worried just get run-flats when your first set wears out.

 

[jerry33]

If you're worried just get run-flats when your first set wears out.

As long as you realize that run-flats will kill range. Very high rolling resistance tires.

 

[strider]

As long as you realize that run-flats will kill range. Very high rolling resistance tires.

Define "kill range". The run flats weigh 3lbs more each than the regular version (27 vs 30). The weight will have a small effect but due to the short sidewalls I don't see how there would be a noticeable difference in range. Not to mention, I would think the stiffer carcass of the run flats would actually HELP range as the tires would squish less.

 

[jerry33]

Define "kill range". The run flats weigh 3lbs more each than the regular version (27 vs 30). The weight will have a small effect but due to the short sidewalls I don't see how there would be a noticeable difference in range. Not to mention, I would think the stiffer carcass of the run flats would actually HELP range as the tires would squish less.

Rolling resistance is typically over 10% higher in run-flat tires compared to standard non-runflat tires (as a comparison, the difference in rolling resistance between radial tires and bias-ply tires is about 8%). Even worse when compared to low rolling resistance tires. it's not just the weight. it's the compounds that have to be used to be able to run without air add to the penalty.

 

[strider]

"Rolling resistance" is but one of many variables that go into vehicle range. 10% greater rolling resistance does not translate into 10% less range. Also, I repeat my call that the difference in run-flat vs standard decreases the shorter the sidewall. Until there is objective data we'll just have to wait and see.

 

[jerry33]

"Rolling resistance" is but one of many variables that go into vehicle range. 10% greater rolling resistance does not translate into 10% less range.

That is correct. It might be more or less than 10% and it will vary with the type of driving done. Tire rolling resistance has the biggest penalty during starts and lower speed driving. As speed increases, the aerodynamic resistance makes up a greater proportion of the power required to move the vehicle.

Also, I repeat my call that the difference in run-flat vs standard decreases the shorter the sidewall. Until there is objective data we'll just have to wait and see.

This will sound like a cop-out, but all the data I have seen isn't available to be released. Something to consider is that the lawyers of both the vehicle and tire manufacturers would love to have 100% run-flat tires because it will greatly limit liability and the cost of proving that the tire failure wasn't the tire's fault because the driver didn't put in any air. Tire manufacturers spend a considerable amount of money defending their tires in court.

 

[hcsharp]

...
This will sound like a cop-out, but all the data I have seen isn't available to be released. Something to consider is that the lawyers of both the vehicle and tire manufacturers would love to have 100% run-flat tires because it will greatly limit liability and the cost of proving that the tire failure wasn't the tire's fault because the driver didn't put in any air. Tire manufacturers spend a considerable amount of money defending their tires in court.

I consider the gas mileage data from Consumer Reports to be reasonably objective. They consistently report significantly lower mileage with run flats. Most of the run flat tires they test are low profile.

 

[jerry33]

I consider the gas mileage data from Consumer Reports to be reasonably objective. They consistently report significantly lower mileage with run flats. Most of the run flat tires they test are low profile.

That matches what I've seen.

 

[neroden]

OK. So it looks like I'm going to have to put my spare tire (for long road trips) in the rear trunk, which will utterly kill storage space.

I *do not go* on a long road trip without a spare tire, because if I get a blowout by running over giant chunks of metal and glass in the road (it happens, it can be impossible to avoid it on all four wheels) I pretty much have to cancel my trip and rearrange my schedule. I told yet another Tesla representative this. She said they'd have roadside assistance. I said, who provides that in the middle of Ohio, far from a Tesla store? She said, a trusted local firm they contract with. What I forgot to ask was, will these firms always have the correct size of spare wheels and tires available? The answer is presumably no.

I don't think Tesla Motors understands why you need spare tires. They had spare tires even back when tires were solid rubber. You need them when *road conditions are crappy* and you have a decent chance of getting a major gash in the tire. Road conditions are getting crappier every year in this part of the country. Patching is little good if you're in the middle of a long trip; you really ought to get a new tire before your trip is over, so you have to reschedule.

 

[neroden]

The Model S (and, likely Model X) does not ship with a spare. To save weight, it comes only with a tire repair kit. The assumption is that you'll have, and use, roadside assistance.

I seriously do not understand why Tesla thinks "roadside assistance" is a substitute for a spare tire. You cannot expect "roadside assistance" to have a spare tire of the correct size, can you? The sizes are not *that* common!

 

[ckessel]

I seriously do not understand why Tesla thinks "roadside assistance" is a substitute for a spare tire. You cannot expect "roadside assistance" to have a spare tire of the correct size, can you? The sizes are not *that* common!

In 20 years I've never remotely had need of a spare. The few times I've had a tire give, I get towed to the nearest tire shop by my insurance and get it fixed there. A spare is mostly dead weight. There are quite a few cars that don't have spares (my RX8 doesn't). Now, if you live in the middle of nowhere on roads that are prone to creating flats, I can see a serious need, but I'd think most folks near an urban area wouldn't need a spare.

 

[hcsharp]

I seriously do not understand why Tesla thinks "roadside assistance" is a substitute for a spare tire. You cannot expect "roadside assistance" to have a spare tire of the correct size, can you? The sizes are not *that* common!

I only had to call roadside assistance once. They had no contracted service providers anywhere close to my rural neighborhood. So the operator began calling local flatbed services to find somebody. I knew most of the garages and tow/flatbed operators within miles of here and I even told her the names of a few (they're not all listed in the directory where she was looking). All of them were either busy or declined to take the job when they found out what kind of car it was (Tesla). She initially offered to pay their full rates, and then later called a couple of them back and offered more! Finally out of desperation she began calling places up to 1.5 hours away! Apparently their contract with Tesla guarantees you will get a tow no matter where you are. I ran out of time and cancelled roadside assistance and rounded up some of the neighbors to help me push the car out of harms way. The next day Tesla sent a ranger and picked it up. To stay on topic, low profile tires put you especially at risk. That said, I'm not sure a spare is worth the extra weight when you can use tire foam.