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A/C Effectiveness in 5-seat configuration - Predictions?

Will 5-seat A/C cooling be as effective in high heat (> 95 F) as the 6&7 seat config?


  • Total voters
    7
  • Poll closed .
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I can understand hope, but after 8 months of Model X ownership, I have such little hope left, I am resolved to "What it is"

And regarding this thread I started, I now have my conclusion, shared by at least one, but Thanks to All for the discussion.

After thorough testing with wind meters in different ambient temperatures comparing 5-seat vs 6-seat configs, I am now educated and better understand the need to separate cooling from air flow, although they are intermixed when it come to what a person feels.

Given all Model X configs have the same A/C compressor, the cooling capacity is the same for all. The difference lies in the different seating configs air flow, since the 5-seater has only one fan for all the vents, while the 6/7 seater has two separate fans and venting systems.

Without a doubt, the lack of a second fan in the 5-seater is a CLEAR DISADVANTAGE to the 2nd row passengers in a hot environment, who presence in the seat makes no difference on activating the single fan, unlike the 2-fan system.

In testing, it takes the 5-seater single fan on HIGH PLUS 2 of 4 front vents closed to equal the air flow from the B-pillars as compared to the same B-pillar vent air flow when the 6/7-seater rear fan was on HIGH, both of which measured at 5 MPH on my meter. Open up all the front vents, and the 5-seater B-pillar air flow drops to 3 MPH, obvious even to the hand, especially the sweating face.

As far as cooling a person, it is a combination of humidity, air temp and air flow to provide cooling effect, and 2nd row passengers entering a hot vehicle and hoping for a solid air flow of cool air will be disappointed in a 5-seater when it is hot outside, more so if it is humid.

This is a significant deficit for the 5-seater, of which only now is this being realized given the initial delivery late last year in hte cooler months

Plus, given all the overhead glass that has the standard heat transmission of factory glass, this will significantly work against the A/C cooling, but the addition of a quality thermal-blocking tinting throughout the MX makes a real difference in the summer heat of the warmer climates.

My personal experience with adding Huper Optik everywhere including above the visor level of the windshield made a huge difference last summer.

Now that I am moving to a 5-seater in a month, I will once again add a thermal tint, and am resigned to closing up to 2 of the 4 front vents in the rare event I have 2nd row human passengers if they need that for cooling.

Such a shame that in the most high-tech vehicle with a price tag starting over $80K, that this sort of maneuvering is essential.

So the Poll at the top is accurate in it's prediction, and should it be refreshed, changed from predicting to current experience, and filled out only by 5-seat owners, I am sure it would be over 90/10, and if specifically focused on the 2nd row seat, all would agree to the inadequacy of the cooling effectiveness of the 2nd row passengers in the summer heat.

Undoubtedly, pre-cooling is not just a luxury, it is essential for comfort, especially in the summertime of a 5-seater 2nd row passenger.
 
On an unusually hot spell a week or so ago, the temp was in the high 90's, Sunny and dry.

Riding in my 5 passenger configuration, I asked the back seat passengers, how were they doing, Their reply was "Great".

That was the end of my scientific measurement.

No problem observed.

OMG, you mean it actually broke 80 degrees in San Diego??? How did you ever survive.. in the city of homes with A/C at around 80%.

Come visit me for a few days this May in Dallas (circa 96 degrees, blazing "no smog" sun) before I tint the windows, lets see how comfortable your passengers will be in the 2nd row....I'll be happy to shut down 2 of the front vents for them.

Classic California Egocentric Mentality... if it were for your state, we'd have even a bigger buffoon for a president, as hard as that may be.
 
OMG, you mean it actually broke 80 degrees in San Diego??? How did you ever survive.. in the city of homes with A/C at around 80%.

Come visit me for a few days this May in Dallas (circa 96 degrees, blazing "no smog" sun) before I tint the windows, lets see how comfortable your passengers will be in the 2nd row....I'll be happy to shut down 2 of the front vents for them.

Classic California Egocentric Mentality... if it were for your state, we'd have even a bigger buffoon for a president, as hard as that may be.
He said high 90's, not high 80's. But he also said it was dry. The A/C is much more effective when the air is dry. I've only been there once and a very long time ago, is Dallas/Ft. Worth a dry climate?
 
Ironically just yesterday my X was at the service center and I asked them to explicitly check the airflow to the rear vents. Both the service advisor and technician there when I dropped off my 5-seater agreed the air flow was very weak. Unfortunately this was the result of their investigation:
tesla-ac-response.jpg


I spoke with the service advisor afterwards and asked that he escalate the issue BEFORE everyone gets to the worst of summer high temperatures. I understand that every turn of the conduits to the back vents creates some "resistance" to the airflow so the air coming out the back will be a bit weaker, but it's disappointing at the least. I lived in Austin for many years before moving to IL so I share essmd's concern. I'm now going to look into proactively adding one of the heat reducing films (Spectra Photosync, Llumar, etc.) much like essmd.

I will *nicely* continue to follow-up with my service center to have them make sure "corporate" investigates the issue, and that's my best recommendation for anyone else. I fear nothing can be done (they're certainly not going to put wider conduits to the rear vents), but it's worth getting the right people to think of a creative solution. At a minimum if the right people don't hear from enough people, they won't even try.
 
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What's the best address to send feedback to for requesting that the 5 seater have the same two zone A/C as the 6 and 7 either standard or as an option?

Not that it will probably matter, but if they are all about standardization...

When the very earliest releases of the 5 seat configuration, end of 2016/beginning of 2017, and the adsennce of vents ported to the rear/pet section of the vehicle, I hesitated on perfecting my X order. I had the Costa mesa local service personnel, the sales personnel and the sales manager enquire of the parties that they told me they could reach (although they said they were not sure if they were addressing my questions to the correct areas), if; the hardware for HVAC was the same across all X's, if a retrofit was possible, why there was a change in HVAC at all, especially with pet health concerns and no available hard data on cooling for the vehicular zones/safety for occupants of all areas in high ambient temps, etc..

At any rate, I continued to contact the personnel and never received any substantive response. I cancelled one X order, reordered and cancelled again, before losing interest, as both this HVAC issue, which to me is hug,e and the quartenary ghosting/windshield issues seemed as though no reliable change was going tooccur to change the physical characteristics related to those issues. Quite frankly,, given the proclivity for TESLA owners//prospective buyers to be perspicacious with regard to minutia and this being a macro issue, I am amazed that the HVAC issues have not been more of a non starter than seems to be the case, based on what has been written on this site, as even if the current 5 seat HVAC is acceptable to a given owner of the vehicle, subsequent owners maybe not so... Another lease preference I suppose...

Thank you very much

Fury
 
Ironically just yesterday my X was at the service center and I asked them to explicitly check the airflow to the rear vents. Both the service advisor and technician there when I dropped off my 5-seater agreed the air flow was very weak. Unfortunately this was the result of their investigation:
View attachment 224677

I spoke with the service advisor afterwards and asked that he escalate the issue BEFORE everyone gets to the worst of summer high temperatures. I understand that every turn of the conduits to the back vents creates some "resistance" to the airflow so the air coming out the back will be a bit weaker, but it's disappointing at the least. I lived in Austin for many years before moving to IL so I share essmd's concern. I'm now going to look into proactively adding one of the heat reducing films (Spectra Photosync, Llumar, etc.) much like essmd.

I will *nicely* continue to follow-up with my service center to have them make sure "corporate" investigates the issue, and that's my best recommendation for anyone else. I fear nothing can be done (they're certainly not going to put wider conduits to the rear vents), but it's worth getting the right people to think of a creative solution. At a minimum if the right people don't hear from enough people, they won't even try.
In the housing industry, it's called balancing the registers. You don't just hook things up willy-nilly. You size the ducts taking air travel distance and resistance, so that you get proper air flow to all the registers. Them stating it is that way because the front vents are closer to the fan, means they didn't exercise any (or very poor) design calculations for air flow.
 
When the very earliest releases of the 5 seat configuration, end of 2016/beginning of 2017, and the adsennce of vents ported to the rear/pet section of the vehicle, I hesitated on perfecting my X order. I had the Costa mesa local service personnel, the sales personnel and the sales manager enquire of the parties that they told me they could reach (although they said they were not sure if they were addressing my questions to the correct areas), if; the hardware for HVAC was the same across all X's, if a retrofit was possible, why there was a change in HVAC at all, especially with pet health concerns and no available hard data on cooling for the vehicular zones/safety for occupants of all areas in high ambient temps, etc..

At any rate, I continued to contact the personnel and never received any substantive response. I cancelled one X order, reordered and cancelled again, before losing interest, as both this HVAC issue, which to me is hug,e and the quartenary ghosting/windshield issues seemed as though no reliable change was going tooccur to change the physical characteristics related to those issues. Quite frankly,, given the proclivity for TESLA owners//prospective buyers to be perspicacious with regard to minutia and this being a macro issue, I am amazed that the HVAC issues have not been more of a non starter than seems to be the case, based on what has been written on this site, as even if the current 5 seat HVAC is acceptable to a given owner of the vehicle, subsequent owners maybe not so... Another lease preference I suppose...

Thank you very much

Fury
I think your observation of a lack of response from the owners may have to do with the fact that the car become available for delivery in the middle of winter, which portends a coming storm of complaints as summer approaches for some, and is here for others. Another factor is that for others that don't often have passengers or pets in the back, this won't be much of a problem.
 
With high voltage cabling going to it, I would speculate that assembly is for battery cooling rather than cabin. Curious why they would place it on the other side of the car from the other components, but maybe that's where they had room for it.
The AC Compressor in the front also has High Voltage cabling... there's only one front compressor, right? Meaning, there is one AC system and it cools the battery and 'people air'. This may actually be the location of the rear unit (when there is one...).
 
The AC Compressor in the front also has High Voltage cabling... there's only one front compressor, right? Meaning, there is one AC system and it cools the battery and 'people air'. This may actually be the location of the rear unit (when there is one...).
But I thought the only 'extra' with the 6- and 7-seaters was an extra fan for the rear ducts? Only one A/C compressor.
 
But I thought the only 'extra' with the 6- and 7-seaters was an extra fan for the rear ducts? Only one A/C compressor.
Now you mention it, yeah, it's supposed to be just extra fans, etc. So, I got nothing. We need some SC or internals expertise here...

The order page for 6/7 says 'Rear AC and Heating System included'. Which can mean anything you want it to mean. ;)
 
Given all Model X configs have the same A/C compressor, the cooling capacity is the same for all. The difference lies in the different seating configs air flow, since the 5-seater has only one fan for all the vents, while the 6/7 seater has two separate fans and venting systems.

Without a doubt, the lack of a second fan in the 5-seater is a CLEAR DISADVANTAGE to the 2nd row passengers in a hot environment, who presence in the seat makes no difference on activating the single fan, unlike the 2-fan system.
This where I think we started.... assuming this was correct. ;) And that the overall compressor system is the same in both.

That hardware in the rear is suspicious....