My guess is it’s a combination of wet brakes, regen interfering with ABS, tires not noted for great wet braking and driver under estimating what his car will do in those conditions.
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Candleflame
Active Member
the hatchback is a small and light car and can afford to break late - tbh it looks like he slowed down as soon as he saw the orange light. It doesn't take much for them to slow down and he probably didn't even press the brake very hard. He looks like he slowed down when he saw the orange light as expected. Even though it is good practice to check the mirror for cars behind it is not his responsibility to ensure traffic behind him does not ram him - in fact, if he would have sped up he would have committed a traffic offense - namely trying to run an orange light.
The OP was driving too fast for the conditions, started tailgating and most likely when he braked hard the ABS kicked in to allow him to steer as braking would have been ineffective. I don't even know why he didnt slow down when he saw an orange light but decided to only start braking when the red light appeared.
THIS is the reason why the USA has such a high road fatality rate. People lack basic skills to operate a vehicle safely.
The OP was driving too fast for the conditions, started tailgating and most likely when he braked hard the ABS kicked in to allow him to steer as braking would have been ineffective. I don't even know why he didnt slow down when he saw an orange light but decided to only start braking when the red light appeared.
THIS is the reason why the USA has such a high road fatality rate. People lack basic skills to operate a vehicle safely.
Candleflame
Active Member
It can. when the wheels start to lock the ABS will stop the car from braking momentarily to allow the driver to steer rather than skid with locked wheels. If it is really slippery you won't get any braking at all - but being able to steer is still valuable.
I wouldn't be surprised (if this was last year) that the reason the Tesla slowed down was regen alone and nothing else. Regen back then was a lot stronger and sub 30mph you didnt really need the brakes, even when letting go of the accelerator pedal quite late.
I think I know where this occurred. I suspect another contributing factor is this is going downhill. Super easy pick up extra speed.
Dan203
Active Member
I had a similar situation recently and I'm not sure how to explain it. I was coming off the freeway on a relatively short ramp and the light at the bottom was green, so I maintained my highway speed to try and make the light. About halfway down the ramp it turned yellow and I realized I wasn’t going to make it so I slammed on the brake. The car actually had a hard time stopping and I ended up poking out into the intersection a little. I never felt antilock pulse at all. And I have the big brakes from the performance package, and it was completely dry (albeit cold), and yet it still felt like it took way too long to brake even with the pedal smashed to the floor.
I thought at the time.... "well they said this car is heavy, so maybe it can’t stop as fast". But since I've seen it compared to other similar sized cars and it's not that much heavier and has pretty good stoping distances in tests. Especially the big brakes on the Performance. So it concerns me a little that something might be wrong with the brakes. Maybe because I use regen 99% of the time the actual brakes build up some film or are not properly worn in? (my car only has like 2,200 miles) In any case it was a little scary and I was lucky no one was in front of me.
I thought at the time.... "well they said this car is heavy, so maybe it can’t stop as fast". But since I've seen it compared to other similar sized cars and it's not that much heavier and has pretty good stoping distances in tests. Especially the big brakes on the Performance. So it concerns me a little that something might be wrong with the brakes. Maybe because I use regen 99% of the time the actual brakes build up some film or are not properly worn in? (my car only has like 2,200 miles) In any case it was a little scary and I was lucky no one was in front of me.
smatthew
Active Member
Sorry, but the brakes on the model 3 are damn powerful. If it wasn't for the traction control I could easily chirp my tires through excessive braking.
Thanks everyone. Additional comments:
1. I was paying full attention to the road, so please do not assume distracted driving. Thanks!
2. About the speed I was driving at, I was driving at the same speed as other cars before the light. Don't know the exact number unless Tesla tell me from the logs.
3. Yes it is a downhill because it's a bridge on the highway, but the slope is negligible when it comes to the traffic light.
1. I was paying full attention to the road, so please do not assume distracted driving. Thanks!
2. About the speed I was driving at, I was driving at the same speed as other cars before the light. Don't know the exact number unless Tesla tell me from the logs.
3. Yes it is a downhill because it's a bridge on the highway, but the slope is negligible when it comes to the traffic light.
smatthew
Active Member
Tesla vehicles monitor the brake usage and will scrub the brakes to clean the rotors if needed.
smatthew
Active Member
1) Sorry, you were distracted and speeding. Why were you
- Driving faster than the cars around you?
- Braking later than the cars around you?
- Not pulling into the oh-sh** side-lane when it was obvious that you wouldn't stop in time?
If you think so then there's not much need to discuss further. I'm more hoping to get insights about Tesla's brakes & tires.
I just reviewed longer recordings before the accident, which showed I was actually driving slower than the other cars (including the Audi) and keeping a longer following distance.
Good point on the third question though. On my right is a bike lane, and I was focused on the ABS clicking & tire sound so don't have much time to 1) confirm whether there are bikers or motorists on that lane and 2) make the turn. That's more like being too careful and unexperienced to deal with this.
smatthew
Active Member
Honestly, I think you followed normal braking procedure, instead of emergency braking.
In a normal stop, you start lessening the braking force before the stop so it isn't so abrupt. In an emergency stop, you jam the brake pedal to the ground and pray you stop in time. I think you lessened the force, based upon analysis of the video.
Of course, another viable option is that if you had just been super-aggressively using the brakes (think track usage, not normal usage) you might have experienced brake fade.
For what it's worth, if I slam on my brakes, my Model 3 stops incredibly fast. Once I accidentally brake-checked another car while driving my Model 3. My car slowed down soo quickly it was scared the **** out of both drivers.
Mine is also at 45 psi. I'm seriously thinking about changing the tires. Thanks for the recommendation!
You say you waited until after the light turned red to start braking. We can see in the video that the other cars started to brake when the light turned yellow.
You may have been going slower than those other cars in the minutes before the video starts. But at the time the light chaged red you are going way faster than them because they had already been braking for a while.
If you had started to break when everyone else did the accident would have most likely been avoided.
Oh that's not the case. I use regen most of the time while brake pedal at traffic lights & stop signs when I need to stop. I use creep mode.
I was in real shock at that time so I think I have no reason to not jam the brake pedal and lessen the force. But I cannot recall exactly.
Sorry my bad. In my native language, 'red light', 'green light', 'traffic light' basically means the same thing, which is the traffic light. I didn't mean I brake after I see the light turned red, but it's after I see the traffic light changing.
But I agree that I started braking later than other cars, for example the Audi. I'll learn from that.
Does anyone have previous experience involving Tesla's investigation? How to get an update from them?
In my case, I was clearly promised that they'll look into it and reply, but then just heard nothing. I called later sometime and they said there's no record on their side so they don't know how to follow up on this.
In my case, I was clearly promised that they'll look into it and reply, but then just heard nothing. I called later sometime and they said there's no record on their side so they don't know how to follow up on this.
Candleflame
Active Member
red light ,green light all the same. trololo.
looks like you slammed on the brakes and triggered abs on the wet surface. Thus skidding.
I believe if you did not slam on the brakes you would have stoped in time.
Obviously apply brakes but if you put enough pressure on the brake pedal hard enough without activating abs would have stopped on time
SageBrush
REJECT Fascism
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