Be honest: is SCing on a long trip annoying?

[jvonbokel]

If the average Joe is driving 90mph daily and the range estimate drops accordingly, he will be calling Tesla to complain and posting on the forums that his battery has degraded and his battery capacity has dropped.

This is a good point. I do wish they'd allow "Projected" Range as an option though. They originally did (very early on), but now it's just "Rated" or "Ideal".

Also, I don't have Navigation, so I don't know much about the Trip Planner, but It sounds like it does not take recent driving into account. Would be nice if that were available (even if only optional).

 

[Cyclone]

Also, I don't have Navigation, so I don't know much about the Trip Planner, but It sounds like it does not take recent driving into account. Would be nice if that were available (even if only optional).

The Trip Planner uses the last 5 miles to calculate projected range. Assuming one is plugged in charging, the prior 5 miles mostly covered atypical driving to hit the Supercharger vs. how real traffic/driving goes.

I wish it would use the last 30 miles instead. I also wish we could use a "Projected" Range based on "Since Last Charge" instead of "Rated" or "Ideal".

 

[Mike K]

The Trip Planner uses the last 5 miles to calculate projected range. Assuming one is plugged in charging, the prior 5 miles mostly covered atypical driving to hit the Supercharger vs. how real traffic/driving goes.

I wish it would use the last 30 miles instead. I also wish we could use a "Projected" Range based on "Since Last Charge" instead of "Rated" or "Ideal".

See, this is all reasonable. This is all I'm asking for!

 

[Mike K]

I understand completely what you're saying, but I think I have a theory on why Tesla does it the way they do. I also have an i3 and it does indeed adjust the range estimate accordingly. However, in the winter time for example, a full charge might only show 51 miles of range because the battery is cold. As you drive the car and the battery warms-up, the range increases. Sounds good, right? Problem is, when you go to leave the house for a little trip, that 51 miles is a little scary. I know that the range will improve as it warms-up, but some may not understand that and I feel Tesla doesn't want to be too alarming with their range estimate.

If the average Joe is driving 90mph daily and the range estimate drops accordingly, he will be calling Tesla to complain and posting on the forums that his battery has degraded and his battery capacity has dropped.

Lastly, I would bet that BMW would do it the Tesla way if they had a 60, 75 or 90kWh battery. My guess is that they need to be more accurate with only a 22kWh battery since many more trips will require range estimates. With Tesla, it's really only the long trips where it matters. Most people aren't thinking about range in a Tesla on a daily basis.

I see your point but I personally subscribe to the under-promise; over-deliver mantra. I would rather hop in the car and have it tell me I have 200 miles of range and be pleasantly surprised when conservative driving nets more more than that than to hop in the car and have it tell me I have 265 range when in all actuality I have 180 miles and such was the case on that recent trip back from AZ.

With the BMW I get in it and I know that unless I start going wild, the range it tells me I have is a dependable number. With the Tesla that's not the case. Usually it doesn't bother me but on road trips it's a special kind of frustrating having to buffer in an extra 80 miles because I know trip planner is calculating my estimated state of charge on arrival incorrectly.

 

[mikeash]

If Tesla's rated range frustrates you and you want an estimate based on past driving, then change your settings to show percentage instead of range, and use the Energy tab's projected range. The info is available and the stuff you don't want to see can be turned off.

 

[DCGOO]

If Tesla's rated range frustrates you and you want an estimate based on past driving, then change your settings to show percentage instead of range, and use the Energy tab's projected range. The info is available and the stuff you don't want to see can be turned off.

I think I looked how to change that setting before I left the SC after delivery. "Rated" miles never made sense to me. I just want to know how much "fuel" I have in the tank.

 

[jerry33]

The energy app projecting based on the last 30 miles has been very accurate for me. The trip planner projection works better for me than my prior vehicle's (2006 Toyota 4Runner).

I've done seven 700 mile road trips and the trip planner has been very accurate for me. Using the trip planner, I get my car down to to 5% power remaining as the trip planner projected without any real concern.

Now, as I said, this is very YMMV, but it works great for me.

The trip planner is based on speed limits and hills. I've found it to be conservative, which is fine. Before the trip planner, I used the projected range vs. rated range. As long as projected was more than rated, I knew I could go at least as far as rated. I never use the projected range anymore as the trip planner is better.

 

[skrenes]

If Tesla's rated range frustrates you and you want an estimate based on past driving, then change your settings to show percentage instead of range, and use the Energy tab's projected range. The info is available and the stuff you don't want to see can be turned off.

I got annoyed with the fairly useless "range" and it actually caused me anxiety because of it bouncing around. I switched to percent and I've been happy and anxiety free. Purely psychological. Now I just take percent and multiply it by 3x to 4x depending on most conditions, but can multiply by 2x or 5x depending on risk assessment and if the conditions are extremely poor or favourable. Bottom line is unless there were an interesting graphic with the "range of range" and an arrow showing where it thinks I'm at based on my current speed and where I'm heading, I can do a better job in my head.

Edit:
Also wanted to add that I love trip planner! It's within 1% accurate for me, once I've hit the road. At the supercharger, I always let it get at least a 20% buffer since I drive about 10-20% faster than the speed limit. I've never had to slow down due to limited energy except for one time when I drove from Calgary to Lake Louise and then back to the Canmore supercharger (some 260+ km's in -17 C weather with snow on the road, and leaving it all day to cold soak the battery), and even then, I only had to drive the speed limit

 

[Tony8489]

I live in the L.A. area and have had my S90D for 3 months during which I've driven it to Mammoth 4x, most of that on TACC at 80 or 85mph.

I probably drive my car similarly to MikeK but don't understand at all why he has a problem tracking consumption. On the charge screen (bolt icon) the consumption tab displays a graph of your past 5, 15 or 30 miles. That graph has level lines showing consumption at rated and your actual average over the 30 (where I usually leave it) miles. There's also a jagged line showing your instantaneous w/mi over those 30 miles, which goes sky high climbing upgrades and plunges into green negative consumption on steep downgrades with regen braking. Furthermore at upper left is your actual numerical w/mi and at upper right is your projected range assuming your future consumption is the same as the past 30 miles.

Right now our car is sitting in the garage with 224 rated miles showing on the dashboard green bar. But the consumption graph shows last 30 miles consumption was 434 w/mi and the remaining range at that rate is only 149 miles. That's anomalous; at a steady 80-85 on level ground the w/mi would be in the 350-375 w/mi range.

On a trip if you put your destination into the nav system it shows you how many miles to that destination. You need to monitor that upper right projected range number to see it's comfortably larger than the nav system distance to destination.

I am not using evtripplanner but I am using a spreadsheet downloaded on this Forum to estimate in advance what consumption will be. 100 miles driving at 80mph will use 135 miles of rated range for example. Then there's the add 10 miles rated for climbing 1,000 feet and subtract 6 miles for 1,000 feet downhill. There are temperature adjustments too, but haven't used them yet as the trips have all been at 60-90 degrees F.

The spreadsheet tells me how much to charge at Superchargers, but the consumption screen monitors progress along the way. We came home from the All Star game in San Diego late last night and I charged down there assuming 75mph. It turns out the road was fairly empty and I was doing 80 most of the time. So I came closer on consumption than I expected. But I monitored that difference between the graph and distance to destination all the way. The difference never dropped below 11 miles and we arrived home with 14 miles rated range. I would have dropped the TACC speed in 5mph increments if the difference had gone below 10 miles.

The question in this thread is a valid one for prospective buyers. I analyzed my most frequent L.A. - Mammoth road trip carefully as each travel route is unique. Coming home from Mammoth with one supercharger stop is exactly the same as in an ICE because there would be a dinner stop in any case. Going up there requires 2 Supercharge stops due to the uphill and so adds ~45 minutes compared to an ICE, as we're typically driving midday because I'm retired. We decided that was OK, but it would be an extra 35 minutes on the 3 stops combined with a 70D, so that informed our choice to get the 90D.

I have an also retired friend whose main travel destination is Las Vegas and drives even faster than I do. That's typically a 3 1/2 hour nonstop drive for him but due to the two 4,000 foot climbs would also require about the same amount of stops as my Mammoth round trip. He is not interested in a Tesla until it can drive to Vegas nonstop. I calculate that as requiring about 450 miles of rated range the way we or MikeK would be driving.

 

[DeadEnd]

We supercharged our trip from Hartford area to slower lower Delaware today. Not a hassle at all. Actually we waited in the car at most 5 minutes. We super charged on the NJP while the girls went to the restroom and we got frozen yogurt. Then we topped off at the Newark super chargers and got a coffee at Starbucks and hit up the rest rooms. Really enjoyed the trip. Only wish I used auto pilot more because my right ankle aches after 6 hours in the car.

 

[sickfox]

I thought about this question and though of my trips from SF to LA or from SF to LV. And my answer is it depends on the travel. Is your long trip travel for pleasure (vacation maybe?) or business?

If my travel is for pleasure (we went from SF to LA recently), I know that I'm not rushing to get to my destination and mentally, I've already added the hours to my travel time.

now if I'm on business trip, (went to SF to LV last month) time is money! I want to get to my destination ASAP so I can prepare for business and maybe sometime for pleasure. so SCing is annoying in this scenario.

For those who've done significant long distance trips, doesn't this get tiring/annoying? Compare it to an ICE car where you could literally go 4-5 hours without stopping (and maybe more) if you wanted to.

Going back

 

[javawolfpack]

I come from a special land of unicorns and ferries known as California. In this special state we have certain stretches of road with higher speed limits. As literally nobody does the posted speed limit basically ever, a 70mph speed limit translates to 85 - 90mph without any fear of legal retribution. Well, maybe 90mph might draw some attention but certainly not 85.

I assume you meant fairies not ferries? Might be Southern CA, many places I've driven in Northern CA seem very likely for speed traps and quite a few drivers have been pulled over near them.

I'm waiting on my Tesla; however, this thread has been very informative. I will say that my girlfriend is excited about the Supercharger centered travel as she likes to take longer breaks and doesn't enjoy being in the car for extended periods. I'm in the camp that I've marathon driven 1000+ miles in a day, and beaten the Google estimated travel time by limiting my stops to only refueling as I carry my own food/etc in the vehicle. I think personally, I hope to not need to do much such driving in the future anyway, and look forward to as a friend put it the most relaxing road trips he's ever had, as he has a P85 Model S. Regardless, definitely going to require a bit more planning before jumping in the car

 

[Cebe]

Supercharging/charging is annoying in trips where you need to make a stop with Tesla, and no stops with ICE car. Say, 250 miles. Even then, it's mental until you record some trips and realize you're sitting at 90-95% "efficiency" (time driving vs. time charging), and that your four hour trip is only 20 or so minutes longer; and as many have pointed out, you're not dead to the world when you get there.

It's also annoying when you have to stop for the night, where you otherwise didn't have to. I haven't done on of those trips yet - where I could push through in an ICE, to not have to stop for the night, but takes too long in a Tesla to require that extra stop. My multi-charger stops seem to lead to 80-85% efficiency, so, assuming the same speed in both types of cars, so, probably something in the 800-900 mile range.

I'm guessing, ignoring the annoying passengers that make you want to get somewhere as soon as possible and every second counts, the most annoying trips are going to be the 250 mile and 850 mile ones.

 

[Model S M.D.]

I also switched to % Battery rather than the (useless IMO) rated miles remaining. Once you figure out how many miles are equal to the percentage points, this makes life alot easier and less stressful. I don't use remaining hours on my cell phone, so makes sense to use a percentage. I realize running out of juice in a car is different than your phone, but I still think you get the point from a psychological perspective...

 

[SD Diver]

Took my first "long" trip in the Tesla last weekend: San Diego - Paso Robles and back. Left with 100% from San Diego making it to the Oxnard SC with about 50 miles left. Spent 35 minutes at the empty SC - back to 90% (229 miles). Next stop was Atascadero SC, where I spent 20 minutes. Turns out that the hotel, as well as a number of the wineries had destination chargers. Way back hit Buellton then Redondo Beach. Not bad at all - got to stretch the legs and grab a Starbucks. Next weekend - Las Vegas!

 

[andyaycw]

I'm guessing, ignoring the annoying passengers that make you want to get somewhere as soon as possible and every second counts, the most annoying trips are going to be the 250 mile and 850 mile ones.

I'll have to echo this sentiment. Passengers who are aggressive or backseat drivers themselves and want to get somewhere ASAP, the 250-300 mile trips can be annoying only because of the possibility of that passenger pushing you to leave without as full of a charge as you might like. It's actually funny to think they know better than an actual owner. So I'd have to say: MS owners, be wary of who you take on a road trip!

I took a trip from Garden Grove to San Diego (~100 miles) yesterday in my 70D. Fully charged before I left registered 236 rated miles on the dashboard, and by the time we were ready to leave San Diego, I arrived at the SD Supercharger with about 30 miles remaining. 15 minutes later it had charged up to about 120 miles, and one of my passengers insisted I'd have enough to get home.

Instead of trying to explain that 120 miles on the dash is probably more like 100 or 110 depending on how I drive (he's an aggressive driver and kept urging me to basically "floor it" every chance I got), and considering no one knew how far it actually was back home (we had decided to take side streets to avoid the freeway traffic), I just said for peace of mind, let's stay here for another 5-10 mins.

We charged to 150 miles at the Supercharger, and by the time I dropped everyone off and arrived back at my house, I had close to 30 miles remaining. Meaning, if I had listened to him and left the Supercharger at 120 miles on the battery, I may not have made it home.

 

[jerry33]

I'll have to echo this sentiment. Passengers who are aggressive or backseat drivers themselves and want to get somewhere ASAP, the 250-300 mile trips can be annoying only because of the possibility of that passenger pushing you to leave without as full of a charge as you might like. It's actually funny to think they know better than an actual owner. So I'd have to say: MS owners, be wary of who you take on a road trip!

I've found that by the time the passengers are back from their pit stop, the car is ready.

 

[Owner]

Now that would mean flying because in any car electric or ICE that is a long drive like 10+ hours!

now if I'm on business trip, (went to SF to LV last month) time is money! I want to get to my destination ASAP so I can prepare for business and maybe sometime for pleasure. so SCing is annoying in this scenario.


Going back

 

[jerry33]

Now that would mean flying because in any car electric or ICE that is a long drive like 10+ hours!

I fly when there is a large body of water between myself and my destination. (If I'm not the pilot, I don't care much for the current sardine experience.)

 

[AB4EJ]

SC stops don't bother me, I kind of enjoy the excuse to stop & rest, and have some indulgence like Starbucks fairly often. I can see how this would be irritating to persons who have a steel butt and like to drive straight thru on long trips (apparently they don't know that this is less safe due to fatigue).

I guess the funniest comment I have heard on this topic is a post by a MS owner whose wife complained, "I have to eat when the car is hungry!"