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Cadillac ELR (Converj)

Discussion in 'Electric Vehicles' started by Takumi, Jan 12, 2009.

  1. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    You are correct but what people actually use and what they want are two very different things. There are more than a few people who won't consider the Model S because a 265 mile range isn't enough when that covers over 99% of daily commutes.

    The main point was for the money it offered little that was compelling over the Model S or even the Volt for that matter (if your main goal was EV driving). The fact they canceled the car proves that many of the criticisms of the car here were valid.
     
  2. Idleup

    Idleup Banned

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    Not sure i follow - the Volt isn't limited on range and the MPGe is higher on the Volt that the Tesla 85kw.

    Regards
     
  3. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    It's limited on EV range. That's what apt of people here care about. The MPGe on hybrid mode is higher than Model S? This thread is about the ELR. I'm glad you love your Volt but you've started posting a defense of it and why it's better than the Model S in multiple unrelated threads. Please confine your Volt posts to threads talking about the Volt.
     
  4. Idleup

    Idleup Banned

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    Sorry I was not trying to change the topic, the MPGe of the ELR is 82 MPGe and the Telsa 85 is 85 MPGe. The point I was trying to make is they are simular in operating cost.

    regards

    Mike
     
  5. Gear

    Gear Member

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    Can't basically every electric car owner do that?
     
  6. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    #886 dsm363, Feb 7, 2015
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2015
    I believe you said it was higher than the Model S though. It's only similar on operating costs if you drive less than 40 miles on the EV range. Otherwise it's about 28? mpg hybrid if I remember correctly. Do you get free gas traveling long distance like the Model S assuming you stick you routes there have Superchargers?
     
  7. Jeff N

    Jeff N Active Member

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    The ELR has a hybrid-mode EPA rating of 33 mpg combined and 35 mpg highway.
     
  8. Blastphemy

    Blastphemy Member

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    2016 ELR to receive "significant technical updates"

    http://jalopnik.com/cadillac-will-debut-a-whole-new-family-of-v6-engines-ne-1687711116

    Second question down:

    What are your plans for the ELR? - Only3Pedals

    ELR will receive significant technical updates soon. The car is beautiful to look at and great to drive. We've made the investment and it gives our portfolio something very unique. - de Nysschen

    I still don't believe "significant technical upgrades" means the same thing to us as it does to Cadillac. My prediction is that the 2016 ELR will be mostly the same as the 2014 ELR but with the Volt Gen II battery and engine (with 45 miles of EV-only range), new grill crest badge, and slightly fancier Adaptive Cruise Control re-branded as "Supercruise." 0-60 in 7.9 seconds EV and 6.7 seconds in Extended Range mode. No Sport+ mode that allows the faster speed before the battery is depleted. No other changes, except for some of the smaller C.U.E. enhancements found in the 2015 SRX, ATS, and CTS. Maybe Apple CarPlay and Android Auto, but very doubtful. And the price will remain the same at $75,995 for the base model.

    For Cadillac's sake, I hope I'm way off! It'll be interesting to see if the ELR actually makes an appearance in Geneva as was previously announced before Cadillac removed all references to the ELR from the revised press release.
     
  9. tenstringer009

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    It looks like the 2016 is getting more updates than expected (along with a price drop). At least they've incresed the performance. It'll be interesting to see how this ultimately compares to the new Volt as that'll be its closest competitor.

    2016 Cadillac ELR gets more power, $9,000 price drop
     
  10. palmer_md

    palmer_md Member

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    April 1st they announced that they cancelled the ELR program completely. Was that just an April Fools joke?
     
  11. rickgt

    rickgt Enthusiast owner/member

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    It IS a Volt... just with fancier sheet metal work and upgraded interior... and a big price increase.

     
  12. Blastphemy

    Blastphemy Member

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    The Cadillac boss said there wouldn't be a redesigned ELR, but that the current ELR would live out its lifecycle. Apparently that lifecycle includes an upgraded ELR! I guess if one parsed Cadillac's language for nuance, it would be the difference between "redesigned" and "improved" between 2014 and 2016. The $9,000 price drop will surely help, although I'm not confident the ELR can overcome its poor reputation (as evidenced by rickgt's comment). And what does Cadillac do with the 500-700 ELRs from 2014 still sitting on dealer lots? Good luck!

    You've obviously never driven an ELR if you believe that. Do some research and go drive one; you'll see some significant differences that sets the ELR apart from the Volt. Just because both use a Voltec system doesn't mean they're the same car. That's like saying every sedan with a V6 is the same car with just different levels of pretty.
     
  13. Jeff N

    Jeff N Active Member

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    Basic performance improvement is to the "sport mode" which combines power from the ICE and battery pack. It now utilizes up to 174 kW to do 0-60 mph in 6.4 seconds. A "performance package" pushes the top speed to 130 mph.

    Within the next week or so we should hear about the new Cadillac CT6 plugin hybrid.
     
  14. Blastphemy

    Blastphemy Member

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    The 2014 ELR also has Sport mode. All it does is re-map the throttle response so one doesn't need to floor the accelerator pedal to achieve more aggressive acceleration. But 0-60, Sport mode is no faster than Touring mode in the 2014.

    The 2014 ELR achieves 0-60 in about 9 seconds in EV-only mode, and in 8 seconds in "Extended Range" mode (i.e., when the battery has been depleted and the engine must run to assist and recharge the battery). Using Sport mode in Extended Range mode is spirited, but by no means close to Model S territory.

    Unless Cadillac has re-engineered Sport mode in the 2016 ELR to force the gas engine to assist acceleration before the battery has been depleted, the improvement in EV-only mode will only be from ~9 seconds to ~8 seconds 0-60. But then that would be annoying if one couldn't drive in Sport model without the engine constantly kicking in. Let's hope Cadillac made the right engineering choices...
     
  15. Jeff N

    Jeff N Active Member

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    Yes, it wasn't terribly clear how the "0-60 in 6.4 seconds" works in terms of driver experience and mode settings. We do know that 6.4 seconds will require a lot pistons thrashing around. But, it's a nice spec improvement for a plugin hybrid on longer trips. I'm hoping the CT6 plugin can do similar things but with a new and more efficient engine and transmission.
     
  16. Blastphemy

    Blastphemy Member

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    Small bit of good news in CA for the 2016 ELR:

    http://www.hybridcars.com/californians-granted-15000-more-green-hov-stickers/

    Looks like prospective PHEV customers may very well have access to more green HOV stickers in California, pending signing of the bill by Governor Brown. The current limit of 70,000 has nearly been reached, but the legislature passed AB-95 which allows for 15,000 more stickers. This is good news for GM since both the 2016 Gen II Volt and 2016 ELR will be released later this year, and the green stickers are an added incentive for many prospective CA buyers (although not everyone, since HOV lanes are getting rather clogged in some places).
     
  17. Blastphemy

    Blastphemy Member

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    Blastphemy has driven a 2016 ELR!

    As some of you may remember, I leased a 2014 Cadillac ELR for about 15 months and had a lot of complaints. Now I'm driving a 2015 Ford Fusion Energi Titanium... and I was really loving it until I drove the refreshed 2016 ELR this afternoon!

    You aren't going to be reading any reviews for the 2016 ELR criticizing the acceleration or handling, that's for sure. Nor are you going to hear many reviewers grumbling about the engine noise (assuming they even notice it) in Sport Mode or Extended Range mode. Cadillac has made some significant improvements to the ELR for 2016, and I bet that if this was the version of the car released at the end of 2013 at its new price of $65,000 base, Cadillac would have enjoyed a completely different sales outcome. Now with competition from the redesigned Gen II Volt, the updated 2016 ELR may not have quite the shine it would have had two years ago, but the ELR is still in a class all its own when it comes to appearance and styling.

    The 2016 ELR I drove had the white Crystal White Tricoat exterior color, Jet Black interior, and 20" Satin Graphite painted aluminum wheels. What an amazing combination! The exterior of the car looked like it was covered with diamonds, while the interior looked plush and expensive. It still has the useless motorized cup holder cover and unnecessary power glove compartment release, but I guess some would argue the point of opulence is to include features that help wealthy people avoid all possible manual labor!

    Surprisingly, the first thing I noticed when sitting in the car was how extraordinarily clear and unexpectedly vivd the side mirrors appeared. I don't know why, but it seemed like I was looking at a hyper-real reflection with unusual depth and clarity. Can't explain why the mirrors looked like that to me, but the salesperson agreed with my assessment when I pointed it out. The reverse mirror in the car looks the same as it did in the 2014 model.

    The original 2014 ELR accelerated from 0-60 in about 9 seconds in EV mode, or as fast as 7.8 seconds in Extended Range mode (i.e., after the battery was depleted and the gas engine engaged, which for most owners was a rare occurrence). I'm not sure what the actual acceleration statistics are for the 2016 in EV-only mode (i.e., "Touring Mode"), but it feels a LOT faster. Perhaps not Tesla fast, but still very robust. When switching to Sport Mode (which now engages the engine to provide additional power), the acceleration is even greater and the car stiffens up for more aggressive handling. It's very easy to believe that the 2016 ELR will accelerate from 0-60 in a little over 6 seconds in Sport Mode, and - more surprisingly - probably in just over 7 seconds in Touring Mode. I didn't have any diagnostic equipment with me of course, but the ELR felt at least as fast as my wife's Toyota Rav4 EV which can go 0-60 in 7 seconds.

    The only grumble I have is that the driver has no control over whether Sport Mode engages the engine, but frankly EV-only Touring Mode is so much more improved you may not really care. You won't need Sport Mode to merge on to the highway, pass, or launch off the line to beat someone trying to cut in front of you at a light. I didn't have the opportunity to drive the ELR up any steep hills, so I can't comment on how the car feels doing that. I remember my 2012 Volt and 2014 ELR always felt zippy until I had to go from a full stop at the bottom of a hill, and then it felt like both vehicles struggled. Something tells me the 2016 ELR (or 2016 Gen II Volt) won't have that problem.

    One other surprise was that the fully-charged ELR I drove showed an estimated range of 48 miles! That's about 8 more miles than Cadillac promises, so I'm very confident that the increase in range is very real and will meet expectations.

    The 2016 model is similar (or identical) to the 2014 model in many respects - size, layout, passenger space, regen paddles, seat comfort, trunk space, etc. Still no cooled seats, but that's the only omission that disappointed me. Air conditioning, adaptive cruise control, and other such features found in the 2014 model all seemed to work the same.

    The ELR I drove didn't have the optional $1,295 Performance Package, so I don't know what benefits that may add to the car. I suspect it's just a different driving experience (i.e., stiffer suspension, stronger brakes, and more road feel).

    The C.U.E. system felt much more responsive, but the general functionality hasn't changed much. It still has many of the flaws found in the 2014 model, but the interface does appear cleaner and more efficient on some screens. A/C still can't be configured to turn on in Eco Mode instead of Max; still can't cycle the A/C modes without going to the main C.U.E. Climate screen; still can't see your Media Favorites (station pre-sets, etc.) on the A/C screen; and the HMI still has to completely index your media device (iPhone, Samsung Galaxy, etc.) for some reason. Thankfully, though, you can now control your device via Bluetooth (instead of just skipping forward or back one track at a time), including selecting albums, tracks, artists, etc. to play - all without connecting the USB cable.

    On top of that, if you have an Apple device, you can transfer to Car Play to use apps like Music, Maps, and Messages directly on the C.U.E. screen with no C.U.E. interference. I'm not sure the integration was as seamless and intuitive as I would have liked, but it's sure leaps and bounds better than what was available in 2014. Since the HMI indexing was taking forever, I didn't have a chance to see if the track/artist/album listings were in the correct order when only using C.U.E.'s proprietary Audio interface. But listings were perfect when using Bluetooth or Car Play.

    Regarding two of my biggest complaints about the 2014 ELR, I'm happy to say they've been mitigated somewhat, but disappointed that they haven't been completely resolved. (1) The Rear Vision Camera still doesn't look as high definition as it should during the daytime - at least as compared to my Fusion and Rav4 EV - but it's definitely a little better than the 2014 image. Unfortunately, I didn't have any chance to try it at night or in a dark garage to see if the crappy blurred undefined camera image from the 2014 model was fixed. (2) The "Vehicle Left On" triple-honk alert still can't be turned off, and it's still loud enough to be annoying, but it seems to have been toned down a little bit.

    I also wasn't able to test the brightness of the screens at night or on a cloudy day, nor test whether the Rear Vision Camera displays its image at full brightness even when the Illumination Control Wheel is dialed all the way down, and I forgot to see whether I could toggle the car into full Night Mode during the daytime (in the 2014 model, all that changes is the clouds on the map screen turn into stars).

    So will I buy the 2016 ELR? Well, it's definitely tempting! But no, probably not. I know myself well enough to anticipate still hating the triple honk and C.U.E. interface deficiencies. And since my wife and I are going to take delivery of a Model X sometime before March (assuming there aren't any unexpected production delays), any desire for the ELR will probably quickly fade away....!
     
  18. WarpedOne

    WarpedOne Supreme Premier

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    Thanks Blast!
    I suspect 2016 ELR has 'next-gen' volt drivetrain (with tweaks), that is going into 2016 Volts?
     
  19. GSP

    GSP Member

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    GM info released on the 2016 ELR says it still uses a version of the gen 1 Volt Powertrain (battery, transaxle, engine) with some minor improvements. It does not have the gen 2 system in the 2016 Volt.

    GSP
     
  20. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    Spoke to someone from GM yesterday while previewing the new 2016 Volt, and he strongly eluded that there will be a next gen ELR or some other electric Caddy, separate from the plug-in hybrid CT6 that has been discussed. No further details as to when.
     

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