SW2Fiddler
We Are Cognitive Dissidents
I have one too (wife who uses me as a Gas Valet). But a BEV would mean a much shorter fueling trip for you and me, wouldn't it? To The Pluuuug!
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Chevy Bolt - 200 mile range for $30k base price (after incentive)
- Thread starter FredTMC
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- bolt chevy Electric Vehicles review
JohnSnowNW
Active Member
I agree, but then these people wouldn't be in the market for a 200 mile range BEV. So, the point is that if you're going to offer a 200 mile BEV, and claim it's competition for the Model 3, you're going to have to bring more to the table than the vehicle itself.
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Yes, disappointing since that wouldn't allow me to travel much around Colorado or to Utah, Wyoming, Montana, South Dakota, North Dakota, Idaho, Nebraska, Kansas, Nevada, Oregon, Arizona, New Mexico, Oklahoma, Texas or pretty much any other state not on the east or west coasts.
Sure, some of those states have CCS chargers...but I wouldn't be able to go from metro area to metro area with only a 200 mile range and for many parts of those states, there's not a CCS charger within 500 miles.
mknox
Well-Known Member
For sure. But I was thinking along the lines of how many traditional cars will have a multitude of engine options. Having a Bolt available as a BEV and as an EREV (or whatever the Volt system is called) could be one way to go.
I love it. "Gas Valet".
Surely the duty of plugging in her car would fall to me at home, and that would not be a problem. It's when she wants to take that longer trip on her own that I see difficulties. I suppose renting an ICE for the trip would be another option...
The Bolt will not be released for another 12 months (at least, with some delays volume deliveries could start in Q1 2017). A lot will happen between now and the end of 2017, see my previous posts on CCS charging networks.
GM (and Ford) will want a better infrastructure as soon as they start shipping EVs in larger numbers. BMW and Audi already committed to this - including upping the CCS standard to 150 kW by around 2017.
Europe is a good example, there are now over 1500 CCS stations available 24/7 - coming from basically zero stations 24 months ago: CCS/Combo Charge Map - Europe
And this is only the beginning based on the current CCS standard and a few car models supporting the standard.
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stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
This is off topic, but the way GM pushed the "Voltec" system was that it was going to be installed in multiple vehicle types, but so far only the ELR got it (and that car was a disaster). I think they squandered an opportunity (it could have been them instead of the Outlander PHEV being the king of PHEV sales in Europe).
It appears that GM is going to ship variants of the Voltec drivetrain in the Malibu Hybrid and the Cadillac CT6:
47-MPG Chevrolet Malibu Hybrid: Volt's Sibling Without A Plug May Be First Of Several: MORE UPDATES
The Malibu is not a plug in, but the CT6 seems to be.
I rented a Cadillac ATS recently with the Cadillac CUE system - wow, that's a disaster.
Once the CCS charging station network is built out (and hopefully they aren't all in car dealership parking lots), then TMC members will take notice. Until then, Tesla is the only manufacturer with a charging network that allows long distance travel in an EV. People here are psyched about the Model 3 because it will be able to use that same long distance travel charging network. If GM announced that they were partnering with a gas station or restaurant chain and were planning on installing thousands of charging stations allowing nationwide travel, then you can bet people here would be talking about GM and the Bolt more.
I hope that the Bolt comes with whatever CCS rev that is getting established in 2017. It would be tragic if it ships with CCS Combo 1 and misses out on the revision, assuming it can take advantage of the revision. Otherwise, there might be a lot of buyer's remorse for early adopters if they are buying it in early 2017.
A revision to CCS that actually makes it a reasonably usable standard is a good thing for Tesla, not a bad thing. It would be interesting to ask Tesla what their long term future view is on the Supercharger connector.
Now, the CCS standard that makes it a real, usable standard would cause interesting issues with CHAdeMO. Does Nissan continue to push CHAdeMO? Will Nissan/Renault choose to ship a CCS adapter? The issues for Nissan/Renault are far more pressing than Tesla since CHAdeMO is a slow and bulky standard.
A revision to CCS that actually makes it a reasonably usable standard is a good thing for Tesla, not a bad thing. It would be interesting to ask Tesla what their long term future view is on the Supercharger connector.
Now, the CCS standard that makes it a real, usable standard would cause interesting issues with CHAdeMO. Does Nissan continue to push CHAdeMO? Will Nissan/Renault choose to ship a CCS adapter? The issues for Nissan/Renault are far more pressing than Tesla since CHAdeMO is a slow and bulky standard.
Isn't CCS just as bulky as CHadeMO or will the next iteration be smaller?
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stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
At the risk of bringing it further off topic, CHAdeMO is bulky because it was intended for commercial use before. CCS is bulky because it supports AC on the same socket (while being backwards compatible with J1772). A CHAdeMO car needs two separate sockets to do both.
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JRP3
Hyperactive Member
If this car had a Tesla badge and be confirmed for production in late 2016 with the exact same specs and prices there would probably be a collective orgasm...
More like a gasp of horror that Tesla put out such a bland, poorly specc'd vehicle.
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
Just like the bulky(?) Tesla plug does?
I didn't add that it was also backwards compatible with the existing J1772 standard (the post has been edited). The Tesla socket requires an adapter (in the US). This was discussed in the other thread reasons why CCS was made the way it was and why they couldn't use the same tricks Tesla did.
http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/show...point/page25?p=1242537&viewfull=1#post1242537
While I've generally seen the Bolt as a positive development for BEV's as a whole, I don't have the greatest confidence that some sort of multi-vendor consortium is going to be able roll out a comprehensive DCFC network any time soon. Nor do I see any single manufacturer likely to do it solo. And, as has been discussed, the current[1] CCS spec leaves something to be desired, on a number of fronts... the chances of that being fixed and adopted prior to any wide-spread roll-out makes the situation even worse.
For those reasons, I tend to think the Bolt will more likely be a step up from vehicles like the Leaf, in that it might drive[2] adoption for folks looking for a commuter/daily driver, not necessarily a road trip car.
[1] See what I did there?
[2] And again!
If Bolt was available today, I would buy one in a heartbeat to replace the iMiev for my daughter, because she has started Uni in September, and the iMiev is OK for her as a daily driver, but she can't make the trip between home and Uni with it (it is a stretch in good weather, not possible in winter).
However, if it comes out in 2017, I might wait for the Model-3 instead -- will be putting down a deposit as soon as possible anyway.
However, if it comes out in 2017, I might wait for the Model-3 instead -- will be putting down a deposit as soon as possible anyway.
SmartElectric
Active Member
Not quite. It will use a drive train more like the BMW i3, namely, the electric motors will only power the wheels, the gas generator only powers the battery. The drive train is being developed independently and with different technological solutions from any existing PHEV currently available.
The New Metrocab
anticitizen13.7
Not posting at TMC after 9/17/2018
Chevrolet Bolt to be unveiled at CES in January | The Verge
If this car had a Tesla badge and be confirmed for production in late 2016 with the exact same specs and prices there would probably be a collective orgasm...
There is no need for angry comments.
There are some general reasons why the community here is not excited: (1) It looks like a weird mobile (2) It lacks the support of a Supercharger network (3) Nothing is known about its performance or driving characteristics.
If I'm going to spend $38,000 on a car (price before the U.S. federal tax incentive), it better look good, have great performance and driving dynamics, and be practical for all of my needs, including edge cases where I may need to drive as much as 400 or 500 miles in a day. A long EV range is not enough.
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