Chevy Bolt test mule photographed

[eloder]

I do wonder where they plan to fit a large enough battery in that small car ?

To use just the floor itself, like the Model-S, seems to small an area, so they must also plan to use the space under the seats and the console area ?

MY2013 Smart EDs fit just under 17 kWh Tesla-style, no vertical intrusion at all. I'm pretty sure ~35-50 kwh in the Spark (enough to hit 150-200 EPA) is very much possible in that configuration with ~5 years of technological improvements from the tech used in the smart.

I'm also not sure if this is accurate, but I read an article once comparing battery densities between cars. Using the density numbers from that article, if the Leaf was upgraded to smart or Tesla-like battery density, the Leaf would have a 200 mile EPA range (Leaf is near Spark size).

Also, I very much like how the Leaf looks. I'm not sure why it gets so much hate, it's pretty sleek (aerodynamic) in my eyes. Eye of the Beholder, I think Range Rovers and just about every non-X big car out there looks horrible.

 

[Trev Page]

I'm also not sure if this is accurate, but I read an article once comparing battery densities between cars. Using the density numbers from that article, if the Leaf was upgraded to smart or Tesla-like battery density, the Leaf would have a 200 mile EPA range (Leaf is near Spark size).

Everyone but Tesla is using "pouch" cells and to me those always seem to be very inefficient use of space. Look at the internals of a Leaf, Kia Soul, BMW i3 etc battery and compare it to a Tesla battery. They all look so "slapped together".

 

[TomServo]

EV adaptation will only take off when the mainstream manufactures finally wake up and apply all their energies/talents in the design and manufacture of mainstream EV's. Niche vehicles are nice but we need to get scale/sales into the millions. A car that can be purchased, serviced and charged at thousands of places in America by millions of buyers. I hope the Chevy BOLT is the car that starts that revolution.

 

[Krugerrand]

EV adaptation will only take off when the mainstream manufactures finally wake up and apply all their energies/talents in the design and manufacture of mainstream EV's. Niche vehicles are nice but we need to get scale/sales into the millions. A car that can be purchased, serviced and charged at thousands of places in America by millions of buyers. I hope the Chevy BOLT is the car that starts that revolution.

Except that Chevy has no intention of making more than a handful of them. It's already known that they won't have the batteries for the Volt and Bolt to build more than 'this is just us trying to look like we're doing something'. Tesla is the only manufacturer talking about hundreds of thousands right out of the gate AND the only manufacturer preparing via building a battery factory to support that kind of production AND the infrastructure to charge those cars.

 

[EVNow]

Except that Chevy has no intention of making more than a handful of them. It's already known that they won't have the batteries for the Volt and Bolt to build more than 'this is just us trying to look like we're doing something'. Tesla is the only manufacturer talking about hundreds of thousands right out of the gate AND the only manufacturer preparing via building a battery factory to support that kind of production AND the infrastructure to charge those cars.

I'm sure if you use enough carefully chosen ANDs, Tesla will be the only answer.

I've no doubt Bolt will only be made in S quantities.

 

[wallet.dat]

It is a deliberate decision. The ICE manufacturers do not want to sell an EV that looks like their ICE models because then it might steal sales from their existing product line. So they design "weirdmobiles" that they figure only the hardcore environmentalists will buy, and that will not cause them to lose sales for their ICE cars. Of course this approach is completely wrong, as clearly shown by Tesla: the Model S is a classically beautiful design that is also an EV, and sells like crazy despite its high price.

Yeah but then they went and designed the Model X :frown:

 

[RobStark]

I'm sure if you use enough carefully chosen ANDs, Tesla will be the only answer.

I've no doubt Bolt will only be made in S quantities.

Without all the ands you have a BEV that is functionally inferior to a comparably priced ICEv.

Ergo, no revolution.

 

[EVNow]

Without all the ands you have a BEV that is functionally inferior to a comparably priced ICEv.

Ergo, no revolution.

Speculation stated as fact.

 

[RobStark]

Speculation stated as fact.

Everything I or anyone else have stated about the future is speculation.

Including your statements.

Redundant to post disclaimer IMO.

Stating facts about the past makes for a very boring message board.

 

[EVNow]

Everything I or anyone else have stated about the future is speculation.

Again, speculation stated as fact.

There are reasoned guesses, opinion and then there is speculation. May be you think they are all same - which explains your wild statements.

 

[RobStark]

Again, speculation stated as fact.

There are reasoned guesses, opinion and then there is speculation. May be you think they are all same - which explains your wild statements.

Obfuscation posturing as sophistication.

Which explains your pertinacity.

 

[WarpedOne]

There are reasoned guesses,

True. And above is a well reasoned guess.
Problem is not what we see, it is what we do not see - No battery production capacity. Will Santa bring the batteries for 100k annual 200m EV?
Will Chinese make them? For all non-tesla future EVs?

 

[RobStark]

Problem is not what we see, it is what we do not see -

And commitment to a fast charging network across countries and continents.

As if all of a sudden people will not car about driving 500 mile roadtrips or 2,000 road trips.

Even if people have not taken this kind of road trip in the last 10 years they would rather have the ability.... just in case. If it does not cost extra to have access to quick refueling networks they would rather have it than not. Whether it is gasoline stations or Tesla Superchargers.

 

[WarpedOne]

Yes, but charging network is "only" the icing on the cake, a step beyond +200m EV.
All except tesla and marginally also nissan are betting 'others' will build fast charging networks. "Others" being governments and other public entities. With their own money of course.
I for one would welcome a 250mile EV even without a dedicated fast charging network. SC's are supernice but +250m under the butt every morning would drive me long way every day.
As to those long trips ... I can adapt (or adopt) if need be.

Remember Tesla sold ~2700(?) 220mile EVs without a fast charging capability in 2008.
7 years later and a single other company is not even close to second that achievement.

 

[Trev Page]

You'd be correct however were getting closer to what Tesla refers to a "compelling mass market EV". Part of that means you need to have answers that satisfy objections to potential buyers. Range and charging are the two topmost objections I hear in each and every discussion I have when the EV subject comes up. Range is pretty much sorted out with 200+ real world miles. Charging for *long distance* travel however is another matter. Tesla fully understands this and this the Supercharger network is crucial to their success and making sure their mass market EV is no more inconvenient than a regular ICE vehicle. Once the mass public weighs this fact Tesla will come out on top at least for the foreseeable future given the magic $35k competitive landscape. It's the whole chicken and egg situation but at least Tesla is making sure we have both so we don't have to chose.

 

[JRP3]

http://www.cnet.com/news/chevy-confirms-chevy-bolt-ev-in-testing/

Josh Tavel, the Bolt EV's chief engineer, said there are some 55 preproduction, camouflaged Bolts driving around right now, going through the sorts of testing preproduction cars receive -- tuning suspension and minimizing unwanted sounds, that sort of thing.

 

[ggies07]

http://www.cnet.com/news/chevy-confirms-chevy-bolt-ev-in-testing/

interesting, thanks for the link.

Side note - I'm getting tired of seeing $30,000 for this car in article headlines. It is NOT that price, it's $37,000, and for someone who lives in a state (TX) that only gives $2,500 for tax credits, it is certainly a lie.

Why is this annoying? Because it tries to undercut the price of the Model 3. Already can't compete on a level playing field......

 

[stopcrazypp]

http://www.cnet.com/news/chevy-confirms-chevy-bolt-ev-in-testing/

You beat me to it. Here's Inside EVs' coverage:
http://insideevs.com/chevrolet-bolt-55-pre-production-cars-exceeding-200-miles-range/

It seems GM is putting all hands on deck to rush this car out to the market before Tesla.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

And commitment to a fast charging network across countries and continents.

As if all of a sudden people will not car about driving 500 mile roadtrips or 2,000 road trips.

Even if people have not taken this kind of road trip in the last 10 years they would rather have the ability.... just in case. If it does not cost extra to have access to quick refueling networks they would rather have it than not. Whether it is gasoline stations or Tesla Superchargers.

Yes, but at this point it isn't necessary for GM to do anything like that. What GM needs to do is build a good BEV, that will sell at a decent price, use up current capacities and then set the stage to have GM and LG Chem invest and expand. If after the Bolt is selling well, GM _still_ pushes EREV + long-range BEV, and doesn't take long-distance BEV seriously,_then_ you can say they're just doing enough. In all this, do remember that there's a cliff at 200,000 cars that manufacturers don't want to hit until they're ready to sell a large volume of cars, because of the poor structure of the Federal tax credit.

GM has Volt 2, Bolt and an EREV/PHEV coming. Oh, and a 48mpg mid-size hybrid. GM is not exactly a reluctant part of electrification.

 

[stopcrazypp]

Why is this annoying? Because it tries to undercut the price of the Model 3. Already can't compete on a level playing field......

From everything I see, this seems to be GM's effort to claim "first" over the Model 3, so obviously they will turn on the marketing hype machine to the max.