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EAP (Enhanced Auto Pilot) for $4k. Who’s in?
- Thread starter dandrewk
- Start date
Ok, so I now have EAP on my Model Y. What I want to know is:
If Tesla offers a subscription deal, will my offer for full FSD be at a cheaper monthly rate, given that I already purchased "half" of the package?
If Tesla offers a subscription deal, will my offer for full FSD be at a cheaper monthly rate, given that I already purchased "half" of the package?
Here is the definitive answer: No one knows right now.
Anything about FSD subscriptions is purely speculative.
Fernand
Active Member
@Mattopotamus Re: Express lanes. It behaves correctly. There's an option for using HOV lanes or not. If you enable it, the car will preferentially enter an Express Lane, and will not leave until it ends and/or it's legal, i.e. until the solid line ends. If "Use HOV" is off, it stays out of it, and will leave it if you force it in. It's one of the options you can change on the screen while driving (if you dare).
One time I didn't want to be in the Express Lane, but the car kept moving into it. I'd force it out, and pretty soon I was back in it ;-) -- I'd forgotten to turn off the Use HOV toggle.
=====
On the value of auto-lane change, it's
1) The ability for the driver to request a lane change with blinkers and the car finding the first safe opportunity. That's of huge value if you're nervous about blind spots and insane traffic. Frankly, I'm dependent on it, and if I have to drive a car without it, my deodorant fails.
2) It's part of NOA, where you press right button and say e.g. "Navigate Home". The car knows where it's going, how to get there, and it does it, using automatic lane changes and merges all over the freeways. Stay alert and keep a hand on the wheel, disengage AP as necessary, but it's more a spectator driving experience.
That's the "entrance to exit" bit. You get that with EAP. You engage NOA as you enter the freeway and it will drive you, changing freeways along the way, finally exiting the freeway closest to your destination. Then it dings and drops into plain AP. Currently you can use plain AP once you're back on city streets, but it won't make turn decisions like it did during the freeway portion of the drive.
That's for the next step: NOA gradually working on surface streets. Today's Advanced Summon and Stoplight handling aren't so much "party tricks" as necessary steps for that developing street driving capability.
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Is there really any tangible evidence for a subscription model FSD coming, or is this speculation due to an off-hand remark somewhere?
.
One time I didn't want to be in the Express Lane, but the car kept moving into it. I'd force it out, and pretty soon I was back in it ;-) -- I'd forgotten to turn off the Use HOV toggle.
=====
On the value of auto-lane change, it's
1) The ability for the driver to request a lane change with blinkers and the car finding the first safe opportunity. That's of huge value if you're nervous about blind spots and insane traffic. Frankly, I'm dependent on it, and if I have to drive a car without it, my deodorant fails.
2) It's part of NOA, where you press right button and say e.g. "Navigate Home". The car knows where it's going, how to get there, and it does it, using automatic lane changes and merges all over the freeways. Stay alert and keep a hand on the wheel, disengage AP as necessary, but it's more a spectator driving experience.
That's the "entrance to exit" bit. You get that with EAP. You engage NOA as you enter the freeway and it will drive you, changing freeways along the way, finally exiting the freeway closest to your destination. Then it dings and drops into plain AP. Currently you can use plain AP once you're back on city streets, but it won't make turn decisions like it did during the freeway portion of the drive.
That's for the next step: NOA gradually working on surface streets. Today's Advanced Summon and Stoplight handling aren't so much "party tricks" as necessary steps for that developing street driving capability.
=====
Is there really any tangible evidence for a subscription model FSD coming, or is this speculation due to an off-hand remark somewhere?
.
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Teefal
Member
Ok, read the whole thread and didn't find anyone point out the obvious. HW3 > HW2.5. "Yeah but EAP works on HW2.5" And GTA5 works on a PS3 too.
"HW3 includes a custom Tesla-designed system on a chip. Tesla claimed that the new system would process 2,300 frames per second (fps), which is a 21x improvement in image processing compared to HW2.5, which is capable of 110 fps. The firm described it as a "neural network accelerator". Each chip is capable of 36 trillion operations per second, and there are two chips for redundancy. Tesla claims HW3 has 2.5× improved performance over HW2.5 with 1.25× higher power and 0.8× lower cost. HW3 features twelve ARM Cortex-A72 CPUs operating at 2.6 GHz, two Neural Network Accelerators operating at 2 GHz and a Mali GPU operating at 1 GHz."
Ever think that maybe different people having different experiences with AP is because some of us have the old hardware?
More here: Forking the codebase (and expectations)
"HW3 includes a custom Tesla-designed system on a chip. Tesla claimed that the new system would process 2,300 frames per second (fps), which is a 21x improvement in image processing compared to HW2.5, which is capable of 110 fps. The firm described it as a "neural network accelerator". Each chip is capable of 36 trillion operations per second, and there are two chips for redundancy. Tesla claims HW3 has 2.5× improved performance over HW2.5 with 1.25× higher power and 0.8× lower cost. HW3 features twelve ARM Cortex-A72 CPUs operating at 2.6 GHz, two Neural Network Accelerators operating at 2 GHz and a Mali GPU operating at 1 GHz."
Ever think that maybe different people having different experiences with AP is because some of us have the old hardware?
More here: Forking the codebase (and expectations)
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Fernand
Active Member
@Teefal oh, yes, definitely different. Not always as expected.
When I went from EAP w/ HW2.5 to HW3 (+"FSD") on the same software version, there were diffs. HW3 can do more, so the software e.g. handles surface street AP more ambitiously, avoiding cyclists etc. I thought it spilled over into freeway NOA, and I preferred the more bonehead HW2.5 way, still miss it.
By now I don't know, and we have stop sign/lights handling only on HW3, but I would expect differences. Same with common subsets like TACC that seem to act differently with/without the EAP/FSD option. I imagine the code branches early on based on hardware config, and the branches naturally don't have the same code.
And some people/cars have more/less complaints. For whatever reason: build date, attitude, camera cleaning, NOA workflow, maybe even related to the small 3oz weight I keep on the right side of the steering wheel to reduce torque required to respond to Nags, but I have not been plagued with problems like "phantom braking". Some people report anomalies all the time and say e.g. that NOA is useless. Others use it daily and love it.
I've rather thought it was a matter of "tolerance", where some people adapt to shortcomings and work around them, while others demand perfection, get angry and quickly give up. But who knows.
.
When I went from EAP w/ HW2.5 to HW3 (+"FSD") on the same software version, there were diffs. HW3 can do more, so the software e.g. handles surface street AP more ambitiously, avoiding cyclists etc. I thought it spilled over into freeway NOA, and I preferred the more bonehead HW2.5 way, still miss it.
By now I don't know, and we have stop sign/lights handling only on HW3, but I would expect differences. Same with common subsets like TACC that seem to act differently with/without the EAP/FSD option. I imagine the code branches early on based on hardware config, and the branches naturally don't have the same code.
And some people/cars have more/less complaints. For whatever reason: build date, attitude, camera cleaning, NOA workflow, maybe even related to the small 3oz weight I keep on the right side of the steering wheel to reduce torque required to respond to Nags, but I have not been plagued with problems like "phantom braking". Some people report anomalies all the time and say e.g. that NOA is useless. Others use it daily and love it.
I've rather thought it was a matter of "tolerance", where some people adapt to shortcomings and work around them, while others demand perfection, get angry and quickly give up. But who knows.
.
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EAP will not have surface street navigation. FYI for those who are reading.
I did another NoA trip today. Bay Area South bay to SF to Walnut Creek down to Dublin. NoA did all the highway changes for me. Even the I-580 to CA-24 that i was scared of, did it fine this time vs last time. The NoA disengages in tunnels, which is fine. I was imaging what would happen for those who has merging/diverging freeway in tunnels. Does NoA just not function there due to GPS thing?
NoA also disengaged right at the toll both - which was great because I wouldn't trust this on toll both flying by at 35-40mph. I dont even trust MOST drivers out there.
I used auto-lane change or passing lane function a lot today. It felt very safe tbh. I always check my blind spots before I confirm anyways. I even tested it once when there's a car passing by me, and the software recognized it and showed red lane line to denote it is unsafe to change lanes. I agree with @Fernand , maybe a placebo effect, but TACC while on NoA seems smoother than when it just keeps between the lines. I have more confidence in it right now on EAP than AP.
Right now, I still think $4000 is a lot of money. I could've bought 9 shares of $TSLA today with that. But I honestly do not think the subscription model will make these full price systems any cheaper. I'm gonna bet they will price it so you have to either do 1 year at time for $100-150/mo, or 6mo at $150-200/mo. No way will tesla allow such a loophole subscription plan to earn less than a full fledged $8k FSD or $4k EAP.
I hear y'all on that FSD goes with account, not car, thing. I totally want it that way. Like a software license. I don't think it will happen. Who knows, one can only hope. My refund period is over. I've bitten the $4000 cake and now I have to amortize it in my budget. this will push me to keep the car an extra year extending from my planned 15 years to 16 years($4k per year based on cash paid to acquire, not operating cost or what not($60k + $4.3k EAP after tax minus $1875 fed tax credit).
I did another NoA trip today. Bay Area South bay to SF to Walnut Creek down to Dublin. NoA did all the highway changes for me. Even the I-580 to CA-24 that i was scared of, did it fine this time vs last time. The NoA disengages in tunnels, which is fine. I was imaging what would happen for those who has merging/diverging freeway in tunnels. Does NoA just not function there due to GPS thing?
NoA also disengaged right at the toll both - which was great because I wouldn't trust this on toll both flying by at 35-40mph. I dont even trust MOST drivers out there.
I used auto-lane change or passing lane function a lot today. It felt very safe tbh. I always check my blind spots before I confirm anyways. I even tested it once when there's a car passing by me, and the software recognized it and showed red lane line to denote it is unsafe to change lanes. I agree with @Fernand , maybe a placebo effect, but TACC while on NoA seems smoother than when it just keeps between the lines. I have more confidence in it right now on EAP than AP.
Right now, I still think $4000 is a lot of money. I could've bought 9 shares of $TSLA today with that. But I honestly do not think the subscription model will make these full price systems any cheaper. I'm gonna bet they will price it so you have to either do 1 year at time for $100-150/mo, or 6mo at $150-200/mo. No way will tesla allow such a loophole subscription plan to earn less than a full fledged $8k FSD or $4k EAP.
I hear y'all on that FSD goes with account, not car, thing. I totally want it that way. Like a software license. I don't think it will happen. Who knows, one can only hope. My refund period is over. I've bitten the $4000 cake and now I have to amortize it in my budget. this will push me to keep the car an extra year extending from my planned 15 years to 16 years($4k per year based on cash paid to acquire, not operating cost or what not($60k + $4.3k EAP after tax minus $1875 fed tax credit).
israndy
Supercharger Hunter
FYI: EAP will not do stop sign and stop light recognition. It works just fine on the street until a stop or a turn on another street is needed. It can change lanes for you by hitting the turn signal, it does lane-keeping and TACC for you on surface streets.
Spacep0d
Active Member
I would be very slow to trust FSD on surface streets, but I know it'll get good enough soon....or better than a lot of SoCal drivers anyway. 
Okay, I have a little time to consider EAP. Still thinking about. Great posts in this thread.
Okay, I have a little time to consider EAP. Still thinking about. Great posts in this thread.
Mattopotamus
Member
The only bit of tangible evidence is this tweet from Elon in June of this year.
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it should be $1,000 for lane change alone
then the $4,000 then the $8,0000 for FSD
then the $4,000 then the $8,0000 for FSD
I would definitely pay 1k for lane change right now. That's really the only feature I miss from FSD.
Still an expensive option just to change lanes
but when it's priced against the more expensive one it does seem like a deal
Everyone would buy it.
willow_hiller
Well-Known Member
Can anyone see Upgrades on their Tesla App this morning? Yesterday I had Rear Heated Seats, EAP, and FSD available to pick. This morning it says "You have all of the eligible upgrades."
No doubt 1k is still a nice chunk of change, but I would spend it because lane change is a feature i'd use daily. Using the turn signal to change lanes without having to disable and re-enable autopilot is definitely nice. But it's not 4k nice.
janjablonski
Member
same here. Bought EAP for my MY a couple days back, now app saying I have all the eligible upgrades. Something to do with battery day?
Mattopotamus
Member
Would love for the glitches we are seeing with the upgrades page to be a sign that the subscription option is coming.
I think it's a safe bet to be related because I'm willing to bet it'll get announced today.
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