FSD v12.x (end to end AI)

[JB47394]

Is it different in v12 or are you referring to something else?

I think he's after ad hoc changes while driving. The closest we get is to disengage, skip the exit, then engage. FSD will pick up the drive from the new location.

There are all sorts of opportunities for a collaboration between driver and FSD, but Tesla is focused on robotaxis. If the current hardware can't get us there, some collaboration features would be appreciated. Lane bias, voice changes to route, turn-signal-initiated turns, and so on.

 

[joelkfla]

V11 allows you to choose alternate routes displayed while driving. I use this often to take the next exit or similar situations. On rare occasion it's necessary to cycle through the map display to refresh available routes but I've never had it not give a desired option especially when close to the desired route change.

Is it different in v12 or are you referring to something else?

It gives options, but usually not the one I want.

Example: coming home from the south, FSD's route goes straight across an intersection onto a winding 2-lane road, followed by an ULT from a stop sign onto a busy divided highway, and then a left into my development. (That's also the one that Google chooses, btw.)

The other option is to turn left at the intersection, then turn right onto another divided 4-lane a mile down, then right onto another divided 4-lane, and then right into my development. All intersections are signalized, and all turns except the first are right hand. Basically, a clockwise approach rather than FSD's counterclockwise one. That's what I take, as it's safer IMO.

While my preferred route may be slightly longer, the travel times are about the same because my route has higher speed limits and all right turns. FSD never offers it as an alternate. I have to disengage, make the initial left turn, and then a short distance after completing the turn FSD switches to my preferred route.

 

[Supcom]

I wish FSD would have a way for the driver to alter routing decisions on the drive. I want to be able to say things like 'skip the next exit' and have FSD skip that exit because I'm familiar with the traffic patterns following that particular exit.

In such case, simply disengage before the exit and reengage after it has been passed. Car reroutes and off you go.

 

[Dennisis]

If I'm on the left lane FSD initiates the turn and cuts over to the right side ending the turn in the right lane.

Yes, I've had this happed several times so now I watch for it - caught me off guard the first couple of times and there was little time to react.

 

[PianoAl]

The visualization showed a spooky guy walking behind me as I drove 55 mph.

A few times the speed limit changed to 10 mph. I saved the dashcam, and I'll report back if I can figure out what happened.

 

[PianoAl]

Okay, got it. This is where the speed limit changed to 10 MPH. See the problem?

 

[aronth5]

the biggest issue that i've encountered with fsd v12.3.3 is incorrect map data. I've been in situations where the map is showing a lane is suppose to go straight, but the actual lane marking shows that its a left hand turn. Fsd ends up going straight instead of turning left.

It seems like fsd v12.3.3 doesn't read the lane markings and goes by the map data only.

In future versions, fsd should read the lane markings and if its different than the map data, it should use the lane markings as the guide.

Agree but what does FSD do when snow covers the roadway? Not much choice than to go by map data.

 

[j0shm1lls]

Okay, got it. This is where the speed limit changed to 10 MPH. See the problem?

View attachment 1037111

Yep, I totally see it.

 

[Hiline]

V11 allows you to choose alternate routes displayed while driving. I use this often to take the next exit or similar situations. On rare occasion it's necessary to cycle through the map display to refresh available routes but I've never had it not give a desired option especially when close to the desired route change.

Is it different in v12 or are you referring to something else?

Wait how do you choose alternate routes when there's no alternate route on the screen?

In such case, simply disengage before the exit and reengage after it has been passed. Car reroutes and off you go.

That's what I do. It's just inconvenient.

 

[Mardak]

Does this count as 12.3.3 driving over the curb? I definitely heard and felt the drop, but I suppose at least it entered at the crosswalk ramp…

Perhaps I should be more careful with the X as it's the widest especially at the rear? Model 3 seems to be 72.8" excluding mirror (presumably fully containing the 235mm tires) while Model X is 78.7" (275mm rear). So roughly 3" less space in each left/right sides that probably would have avoided the curb here.

 

[David Wang]

Agree but what does FSD do when snow covers the roadway? Not much choice than to go by map data.

The correct thing is to update the map data so that its accurate. But this particular road has been like this for years and the map data isn't correct. I don't know what the procedure is to get this information corrected.

 

[aronth5]

Wait how do you choose alternate routes when there's no alternate route on the screen?

That's what I do. It's just inconvenient.

Touch the navigation header and it will display turn by turn detail and if an alternate route is available you can select it and your navigation route will change. Unfortunately, I suspect this won't always give you the granularity you're looking for to make routing changes.

 

[lzolman]

Fallen way behind again, of course. Busy with eclipse. Nameless did most of the driving for the 7-hr drive home from Jackman, ME to just north of Boston. It did OK, meaning it was the cause of no fearful events. I had my wife with me and fearful events are a no-no. So FSDS did its now appropriately-named job, and I continue to be cautiously optimistic about the future.

Some points of failure, pretty sure it would be 12.3.3 through all of Maine that isn't an interstate, but these were really back roads:

1. Speed limit signs at night. Ugh. My indicated speed limit kept changing around randomly. When V11 got confused by the speed limit I just quickly scrolled to the one I wanted and that was the end of it (until another sign came along and it would read it correctly.) Now, you're playing guessing games with that scroll wheel.

2. Randomly slows way down, go pedal gets applied, back to sorta normal I guess. Head scratcher.

3. Tailgates. I wish I knew how to say to FSDS "Back the hell off".

Now, last thing I want to share is my own damn fault but perhaps it may serve as a cautionary tale: by the time we got within a mile of our house via an interesting (fun) road with tight curves, I was rather tired and a bit slumped with both legs kinda to my left. We approached the tightest left curve and I let go of the yoke so it could spin freely, but I forgot about the position of my legs and the yoke caught on my right knee area and disengaged just as we were in the middle of that curve. I managed to correct before we ran into the guardrail but it scared the bejeezus out of my wife (who was already pissed at me for something else) so, yeah, watch those legs you yoke folk.

 

[frankvb]

Okay, got it. This is where the speed limit changed to 10 MPH. See the problem?

Reminds me of driving on Hwy 85 near Phoenix a few years ago

 

[willow_hiller]

Touch the navigation header and it will display turn by turn detail and if an alternate route is available you can select it and your navigation route will change. Unfortunately, I suspect this won't always give you the granularity you're looking for to make routing changes.

Just for clarity, I believe the view has to be in the "Full route" mode, instead of the "Car view" or "North view" mode. The map needs to be zoomed out to display alternate routes.

 

[PianoAl]

3. Tailgates. I wish I knew how to say to FSDS "Back the hell off".

Yeah it was tailgating today a few times. I hate tailgaters, so that bugs me.

watch those legs you yoke folk.

That's a significant problem that I never considered.

 

[rlsd]

My car moved backward today when it was waiting to enter the street from the parking lot.
It moved about 1 foot, then stopped, then moved again 1 foot. There was another car behind.
It seemed it moved forward back 1 foot but I was not sure. Maybe it thought it was too close to the creeping line. Disengaged.

 

[FOOLSLFDRVNG]

My car moved backward today when it was waiting to enter the street from the parking lot.
It moved about 1 foot, then stopped, then moved again 1 foot. There was another car behind.
It seemed it moved forward back 1 foot but I was not sure. Maybe it thought it was too close to the creeping line. Disengaged.

It does creep forward slowly instead of just stalling like 11. Maybe if it feels too risky it rolls back.

I had an incident when leaving my driveway with the navigation to turn left. Since there are a lot of cars parked and hard to see I’ve seen it alter its course and just turn right and go around another block instead. This is what a human driver would do.

 

[aronth5]

Parking assist. Do others find the 8mph too low when trying to find an available spot? I find in a lot of larger parking lots everyone is going 8-12 mph and parking assist isn't viable. Hoping Tesla speeds the parking process which I believe they have indicated they will do and provide an option to remove the start button. Hoping these are all things Tesla will do as new releases come out. When you have time and other cars aren't around parking assist works pretty well. And as others have mentioned need support for diagonal parking which I encountered today.

 

[Mardak]

Not sure all of this is necessarily a regression though. It might require more training to get more refined, but being controlled by AI E2E means that the car may not follow lines like gospel (as programmed on v11) in order to achieve other goals like a smoother ride...just as a human would cut across

Maybe my description of encroaching was too generous, but these are cases of 12.3.3 switching lanes in the intersection if I did not disengage when it starts to encroach. Here's a couple examples of approaching the intersection that I made sure was safe to allow it to continue straight instead of the correct behavior of shifting left:

Even the lead vehicles weren't enough for end-to-end to realize it should stay left. Would you agree that this 12.x behavior is wrong and worthy of calling it a regression if 10.2 fixed this behavior long ago? I suppose to be fair, humans do sometimes just cut across too, so is it just preference for smoother ride?