High-usage supercharger station

[jerry33]

Specifically what route? I will make a note to avoid it. I thought I travelled that route recently, but maybe it another place other than what you mention. Most all of my travel is East West anyway. The only area I have needed to avoid is on I40 between Oklahoma City and Nashville where it is still practically impossible to travel by supercharger alone with any model Tesla at any speed. Maybe the 3 can now do it. I am amazed that hole still isn't filled yet. North Dakota.... another black hole.

Specifically the route that goes north of where I-135 ends (Salina SC) is the one I frequently travel , I-29, and I-49 (just to name a couple). Virtually any route that goes N/S through or along the border of Kansas, Nebraska, or Arkansas is going to be hard to drive in anything less than a refreshed S.

 

[Silicon Desert]

Try traveling from central South Dakota to south central Nebraska on only an 80% charge. Sure, you can charge to less than 80% and stay on the interstate but that will add several hours and hundreds of miles to your trip. If one spends a few more minutes charging above 80%, they can avoid driving hundreds of extra miles and get there hours faster.

Good to know. Practically all of my travel is via interstate, but who know when I might need to go there some day.

 

[outdoors]

Good to know. Practically all of my travel is via interstate, but who know when I might need to go there some day.

That is really an issue for some of us. I travel off the SC highway for work. As in well over a hundred or so miles one way off. I need that extra 10-15% to do things in a non supercharger town. Not all hotels or municipalities have L2 chargers. I try to have booked hotels that do, but I am not running down the street from a local L2 to walk into a meeting in the pouring rain. Have to see people the next day after a early drive. Not sitting at supercharger for a half hour before an 8:30am meeting.

Free Unlimited Supercharging.....up to 80% if we think we need to. Not so unlimited anymore.

I feel for the people in locations where charging at home is limited or live congested area. I just don't think a build out of SC's solves the problem if cars keep getting sold at the rate of late 2018. My concern that this could become real time determined and cause me travel headaches if it progresses across the country. Especially if it becomes demand based.

Example: 10/12 stalls occupied......80% cap for 2 hours as and example. Or rush hour based....

Can say that supercharging education really needs to be explained to people at point of sale. I have run across people that don't understand how supercharging tapers vs. home more or less non tapered charging works. Spending less time charging and more time driving. Most often folks not frequenting this forum. I am all for pulling in with 10% or less. I am a road tripper, but many folks don't get it.

 

[gaswalla]

Tesla starts limiting charge to 80% at busy Superchargers to reduce wait times - Electrek

 

[Gixx1300R]

Tesla needs to add more Supercharging stations. If they have a problem now just wait until more M3s are sold and the Model Y comes out.

 

[ewoodrick]

I believe that it is a holiday travel thing. I’m sitting at one now

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Not so sure about that. I have travelled ALL over the USA coast to coast several times and I have never needed more than 80% to get to my next destination or charger. I'm sure there is probably an unusual situation somewhere along the routes in America where this might be needed, but I haven't run across it yet. Frankly, I never want to charge above 80% anyway because I spend more time getting a lower charge rate above 80% than if I just get back on the road and charge at the next location a couple hundred miles later. Of course I am just talking about my experience in the MX 100. I can imagine this maybe being a problem with a 75 or even a 90 model.

Yes, it is in only a small percentage of locations where this is possible, and several sources of information are missing to note that people on trips away from home are not restricted. I think it is well thought out. but sure some folks will be upset

You should try a trip from Tonopah to Great Basin National Park (an awesome place to visit BTW) in a nice direct fashion with an 80% charge. It would be a little tight...lots of passes. It's right in your backyard!

 

[David99]

I think the message is worded poorly and doesn't convey the message of it's intent. As it is, it sounds like because of the high station usage there is a problem and it can only charge to 80%. It sounds like a weakness or problem providing 100% capacity. Leaves a negative impression.

The message should focus on making people move on with their trip as soon as they have enough.

As soon as you arrive there should be a pop up on screen. "This is a busy station. Please only charge as much as you need to continue your trip and vacate the stall for the next person needing to charge'.

Which brings up another point. My Tesla app used to notify me when I had enough to continue my trip while I was charging. It was very useful. I have not been getting this message for months. I double checked and supercharging messages are always on. I think that is much more useful than the negative message they have now.

 

[dgatwood]

I think that's great. It still allows you to manually adjust for more than 80%, but high-usage Superchargers should take no more than 45 minutes per stall with a few exceptions.

High-usage superchargers should also be upgraded to V3 superchargers, with a higher priority than building out new capacity pretty much anywhere else. If things really are bad enough that they're having to pull nonsense like this, the right fix is to double the number of stalls AND move to V3. In other words, build out a new V3 supercharger right next to the old one, and as soon as it is online, tear out the old stalls and upgrade them to V3 as well.

I'm looking at you, Mountain View, Sunnyvale, Cupertino, San Jose/Coleman Avenue, etc.

The really hilarious part is the fact that Mountain View supercharger has been at barely over 50% usage since I got here tonight, because so many Google employees took a long holiday weekend. Today was literally the first day I've come to this supercharger between 5:30 and 7:00 P.M. without seeing a line since the first week of January, and this is when they decided to show that message???

 

[gnuarm]

I think that's great. It still allows you to manually adjust for more than 80%, but high-usage Superchargers should take no more than 45 minutes per stall with a few exceptions.

When the Superchargers are packed, as quickly as a stall is exited it is taken. So the new car isn't likely to be charging at 120 kW and will not be able to utilize the fastest charging during some portion of it's fastest battery limit. In other words, counter productive. So most likely it will still be an hour or more even for an 80% charge when chargers are full. That's what happened to me. In fact just the other day I had to take a shared stall, but when someone pulled out I was able to move to that stall. This is a station that is seldom half full.

Folks passing through on a 120+ mile drive should take advantage of the relatively fast charging before the speed tapers, then head out to the another Supercharger on their route (hopefully the next one won't be high-usage.

Yes, but as I've explained above, they won't see that because of the shared capacity limits between charger stalls.

Drives in within the region ought to top-off at home or at their workplace. I can't think of too many scenarios where charging beyond 80% at a busy SC is a necessity. The only one I can think of are for drivers with the S60 and need hit the upper range to make it to the next Supercharger on their route. I know there are some folks who don't have their place to charge at home or work, but I don't think that represents a significant number.

Not everyone can charge at work and many can't charge at home. Few apartments offer a way to charge even at 120 volts. Same with many townhouses. I recall digging for a number and found only about 60% of families have a home suitable to EV charging.

There are plenty of times I want to charge to 90% because there simply aren't charging options where I'm headed without going significantly out of the way. Sorry, but there just aren't enough Superchargers around to always find one convenient to your trip. So I make sure I'm topped off when I do charge. Being limited in getting a near full tank is a bit like the 10 gallon limit during the days of gas rationing.

Tesla should have the data on users' habits of initial SOC%, time spent at SuC, end SOC%, and SuC location utilization frequency. I thought they did the right thing by initiated idle fees when over 50% utilized and offering a 5-minute grace period (as well as app notification when near full). I'm for making the infrastructure more efficient and less frustrating for everyone.

They've already failed on that count. Tesla likes to brag about how fast they will be building the charging network, but they never follow up on their promises. I think in both 2017 and 2018 they said they would double the size of the network. They didn't even get close.

Something that needs to be kept in mind is the "other half", ICE owners. They don't understand the good or the bad of charging. They will get to "see" the bad at crowded charging stations and the conspicuous absence of charging stations in most cities. That's why it is important to continue to expand the Supercharger network and work out the congestion issues... even if they have to spend money.

 

[jerry33]

Yes, but as I've explained above, they won't see that because of the shared capacity limits between charger stalls.

Which is why V3 needs to be rolled out to those busy locations ASAP.

They've already failed on that count. Tesla likes to brag about how fast they will be building the charging network, but they never follow up on their promises. I think in both 2017 and 2018 they said they would double the size of the network. They didn't even get close.

I thought they meant the number of stalls, not the number of locations. I might be wrong, but I think they came pretty close to doubling the number of stalls. The number of locations (In North America) have been growing at about 100 per year. I don't see this changing unless they put far more people on it because getting new locations is a much slower process than adding stalls to an existing location.[/QUOTE]

 

[gnuarm]

Which is why V3 needs to be rolled out to those busy locations ASAP.

Even less likely than Superchargers since the limitation is available money.

I thought they meant the number of stalls, not the number of locations. I might be wrong, but I think they came pretty close to doubling the number of stalls. The number of locations (In North America) have been growing at about 100 per year. I don't see this changing unless they put far more people on it because getting new locations is a much slower process than adding stalls to an existing location.

I guess they can claim anything they want if it can't be verified, but I haven't seen any indication there were enough stalls added to existing stations or stations that are significantly larger enough to impact the issue in any significant way. The size of the Frederick installation was cut from 12 to 10 before it even was approved.

 

[P100D_Me]

Someone on here posted an excellent idea that would be great to see Tesla roll out, their suggestion was when you currently look at the Superchargers on your phone or in the car it simply says something like 1 of 6 available. What would be nice is a more detailed report like:

Stall 1 - 77% charged
Stall 2 - 23% charged
Stall 3 - Free
Stall 4 - 67% charged
Stall 5 - 38% charged
Stall 6 - 73% charged

From that you can see that with one free there is nobody waiting and three of the cars will probably be done in about 15 mins or less. Or even if all six were being used they are about to become free and you even know which charger to wait at.

 

[gnuarm]

Someone on here posted an excellent idea that would be great to see Tesla roll out, their suggestion was when you currently look at the Superchargers on your phone or in the car it simply says something like 1 of 6 available. What would be nice is a more detailed report like:

Stall 1 - 77% charged
Stall 2 - 23% charged
Stall 3 - Free
Stall 4 - 67% charged
Stall 5 - 38% charged
Stall 6 - 73% charged

From that you can see that with one free there is nobody waiting and three of the cars will probably be done in about 15 mins or less. Or even if all six were being used they are about to become free and you even know which charger to wait at.

Yeah, that has been suggested before. I'd be more interested in knowing which of several empty stalls to take to minimize my wait time. The car could suggest which stall to pull into based on the charge rate of the paired car which is invisible at the moment. Pairing with a slower charging car will get me out of there faster meaning I won't be slowing someone else's charge even if the chargers aren't all full.

The only way to do this now is to pull into and start charging at each stall, one at a time. Gaithersburg is a 12 stall site and it's a bit of a bother getting a spot where the paired car has also just started.

 

[gnuarm]

I believe that it is a holiday travel thing. I’m sitting at one now

Not always. There are numerous chargers in California which are packed most days. One in Gaithersburg, MD is often packed in the afternoon. I've never had to wait more than a few minutes, but once I had a lunch meeting and I coudn't get a charging spot so after waiting 10 minutes and another Tesla pulling up (and more than one other driving away) I had to park elsewhere, cut my meeting short and go back to charge for only part of what I needed due to time constraints. PITA!

 

[Silicon Desert]

You should try a trip from Tonopah to Great Basin National Park (an awesome place to visit BTW) in a nice direct fashion with an 80% charge. It would be a little tight...lots of passes. It's right in your backyard!

Oh yea, thanks for the reminder. I need to go again. That's a great place. I was there 3 years ago on vacation, but at that time I went in the ICE car. There were no convenient destination charging places and no superchargers around there and I didn't have the Tesla yet anyway. I would not have been able to make it both ways to either Tonopah or West Wendover (200 miles + one way). I don't know. Maybe that has changed now.

 

[Silicon Desert]

Tesla needs to add more Supercharging stations. If they have a problem now just wait until more M3s are sold and the Model Y comes out.

yea for sure. This worries me somewhat. So far this year, it is averaging about 9 or 10 new locations per month and hasn't changed much in the last 2 years (rate of additions). I recall Mr. EM saying a couple years ago there would be 1,000 locations in the USA by end of 2018, but we are not much over half that amount. Cars are being sold at a much faster rate.

 

[azred]

If you drove North-South in the prairie states you would need it because many of the SCs are 200 miles apart. North-South SCs are just not built out. I wouldn't call it unusual, because it's common, and there's no timeframe for when it might get better because the needed SCs are not even gray dots on Tesla's FindUs site.

You have stumbled on the Snowbirds Should Stay Home section of Tesla’s Master Plan. This section of The Plan seeks to slow annual migration from the plenty of water even it’s mostly frozen North to the water-challenged Sun Belt. It also explains why North Dakota may never have Superchargers. Most of the state’s residents are Snowbirds, so why encourage their behavior is Tesla’s attitude.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Tesla starts limiting charge to 80% at busy Superchargers to reduce wait times - Electrek

Much more clickbaity than an accurate headline saying "Tesla starts defaulting charge to 80% at busy Superchargers to reduce wait times."

 

[gnuarm]

I charged at Gaithersburg, MD last night with some 8 or 9 of 12 stalls in use. I plugged in and noticed the charge limit was not at 90%. Thinking maybe I had left it at 85% I unplugged the car and tuned it up to 90% and plugged back in. It was reset to 80%. Then just as some are saying I could set it anywhere I wanted.

It charged at 120+ kW in spite of the car on the adjacent charger. So I trotted off to get a bite to eat. After some time I was done eating but needed to visit the restroom. The car had just finished charging so I set the limit up again using my phone app and charging started again without dropping the limit to 80%.

So when all is said and done, the impact of this change would be expected to be pretty much nil. If you are on a trip the car will tell you when you have enough charge to continue so this even if it were active it would have little impact. Anyone wanting a higher charge than 80% can easily get it even remotely.

So other than a few individuals, I expect the overall impact of this change to be small. It will still have an impact on public perception.