Holiday Update (2021.44.25.2)- A Big Disappointment

[Tezlowski]

It's Amazing how flippant and borderline arrogant your responses are: "don't like it? just trade it in;" "not a problem for me so I can't see how anyone can have a problem." Evidently everyone else here is either lying or just needs to sell their car. I'm glad it works for you, but your willful lack of insight or appreciation of varying circumstances is frightening.

Yes I purchased a car with a touchscreen. There are a lot of things I like about the car, but I hate the fact that Tesla changed the car on me after I bought it. It's certainly enough that I doubt I'll consider another Tesla unless things improve but for now I'm stuck with it. The point that you seem unable to grasp is that a touchscreen requires extra attention to the interface to get it right but we got blindsided by a UI team with ADD.

You are also missing a critical factor in your phone analogy - a phone isn't a 5000 pound missile traveling 70 mph. If it takes you 10 seconds to figure out your phone it's no big deal. If you're staring at the screen in your car you've potentially killed someone. Distraction in cars can be deadly. It's amazing how ignorant some people are of that fact.

Wow, lighten up. First, you’re taking it way out of context and misquoting what was said. Never said anyone is lying, they’re your opinions, and you certainly don’t have to agree with me, lol, clearly you don’t. Never said I can’t see how anyone else could have a problem, clearly you do but you should have known what you were getting yourself into when you bought a Tesla. No need to be condescending. And your talking in hypotheticals, not facts, which we can do all day to prove our own personal points. For example, driving a 5000 pound rocket at 70mph while flipping through cards to check if your tire pressure is the same as it was 5 mins ago and you’ve potentially killed someone… so they should probably remove the… oh wait… they did… safer rocket for everyone. It’s analogy about resistance to change and you are proving the point with every post.

Since you went there, maybe the point that you’re failing to realize is that you should take time to learn and understand the UI so that you’re a safer driver with the car that you now so unfortunately have whether you like it or not to be the safest driver you can be under the circumstances. Of course distractions can cause accidents and that’s why they’ve automated so much and moved other things out of the way.

And sir, your car is fast but it is not a missile, come on now…

 

[Tezlowski]

The amount of time spent ranting and teeth gnashing on this subject is amazing, just saying…

Agreed, it’s comical at this point. Just sayin everyone should do their best to enjoy it and understand it as best as possible until some additional updates are made to try and make everyone happy.

 

[linux-works]

at the very least, I hope this lesson teaches people to be more shy about just taking updates based on manuf. 'trust us' nonsense.

perhaps if tesla saw a downturn in their installations from OTA updates, they'd get the message.

they wont change, but they'd get the message. what little it would do, I dont know.

tesla is done for. they are stubborn and their UI shows a direction that quite a lot of us refuse to accept.

I see big opportunities with other vendors. tesla's loss is someone else's gain. over the next 5 years, tesla wont be at all special; the features they have will be on every brand, in one form of a car or another. the lead is lessening and if tesla was smart they'd RETAIN CUSTOMERS INSTEAD OF CHASING THEM AWAY.

tesla really pushed others into the market and for that, I'm thankful. but they have served their purpose and now its time to either turn the ceo job over to someone mature and responsible, or just admit that it was a fun experiment but now the adults have to intervene.

 

[Jimt29]

Elon says….

Elon Musk’s 5-Word Response to a User Suggestion Is a Bad Sign for Tesla Owners

Tesla's boss thinks users shouldn't have to interact with their cars, even if they want to.

www.inc.com

I for one hope he listens and gives more control back to the Tesla drivers. Excellent article.

 

[Vin_L]

Bottom line….the new V11 UI sux. If the average uninitiated person sat down, and looked at the new screen, they’d have NO idea how to even access the audio system options in the car.
It was obvious, when one touch access allowed expansion or collapse of the window via the music note or the window itself. All you had to so is lift finger and everything was in one place. Simple, concise, intuitive.
I switch between HD radio, slacker favorites, and Spotify. It was all right there in one place, with no need to sacrifice basic automobile features that are familiar to everyone. Like defrosters, heated seats, radio, decernable climate controls, etc.
Before we had simple controls anyone could identify with and use, then a next layer with cool in-depth controls and graphic to geek out on. That’s genius.
Now, who could even tell how to access audio or heated seats or defroster etc. That’s trash.

DON’T JUST SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS SH!T. START HAMMERING…
1 (888) 518-3752 Tesla customer no-service
Facebook
Twitter
Yelp
Google
instagram
you name it…

Thanks you for all the contact info. I plan on calling, emailing, and social media blasting them telling them how much I like the new UI over the old. Thank you

 

[sleepydoc]

Here's a take from a UX designer. He explains why this is so annoying to us.

Is Tesla’s v11 update… bad design?

The mistake even the best design teams get wrong, and how it can be avoided.

medium.com

From the article:

"people will tolerate being asked to learn a new way of doing things, provided they can see how it will help them save substantial effort or discomfort as time goes on.

In this case, though, the new ways of doing things didn’t help. Despite the effort they were putting in to learning them, many functions required more effort than they did before. It was like being asked to take a course on how to make less money"

Bingo. If they made things better, people would be a little annoyed for a day, then get used to it and actually like the new way. But the didn't make it better, they made it a bit easier in some cases and worse in many others but even after learning it, it's not better.

The guy in the YouTube video also pointed out something I've realized as I've used V11 more - the icons are smaller and actually a bit harder to hit/easier to miss.

 

[sleepydoc]

Thanks you for all the contact info. I plan on calling, emailing, and social media blasting them telling them how much I like the new UI over the old. Thank you

Be careful, you might give the poor guy who answers the phone a heart attack.

 

[Xdama]

Since you went there, maybe the point that you’re failing to realize is that you should take time to learn and understand the UI so that you’re a safer driver with the car that you now so unfortunately have whether you like it or not to be the safest driver you can be under the circumstances.

I think the point is that ultimately a car is a car NOT a toy which is what Tesla updating to such a degree is making it.
No one driving the same car each day should have to relearn it….just because some IT nerds thought it a good idea to move everything around. It’s a 2 ton potentially high speed CAR not a bloody Xbox with no consequence to messing up other than restart game

 

[Alan_F]

tesla really pushed others into the market and for that, I'm thankful. but they have served their purpose and now its time to either turn the ceo job over to someone mature and responsible, or just admit that it was a fun experiment but now the adults have to intervene.

As an all-Tesla household (2020 M3 SR+ and 2021 MY LR) and a minor TSLA shareowner I agree with you. You can call Musk eccentric, but that's just what we call crazy people with lots of money. If this update and Musk's response indicate the future direction of Tesla, I just hope my cars will retain a high resale value when I trade them for something better in a few years. With that attitude the car is going to get worse with every update. For the sake of my investment portfolio I hope a stable adult takes over the company sooner than later.

The idea that a driver or passenger decision to adjust their heated seats could be an error is absurd. Taking the same attitude to other inputs, the car should decide what music or podcast to play and at what volume. The car should also decide ALL the climate settings. It has an auto climate setting already, they just need to extend it to also selecting the temperature set point. There are two separate climate controls still on the bottom of the screen where the seated heat controls used to be. Apparently Elon believes that most user input to those controls is an error, so it would make sense to remove them.

If Elon really believes what he tweeted then he should only ride in Teslas operating under FSD with no human intervention allowed. That should result in a new CEO pretty quickly, although the cars are really safe so he'll probably get through a couple of collisions without major injury before a big one takes him out.

I like both of my cars, but that doesn't mean they are perfect. For the moment I wouldn't own anything else, but once the non-Tesla charging network in the US is better, or the SuperCharger network gets opened to other EVs, I hope to have a lot more choices for my next EV purchase.

Everyone definitely has a right to their own opinion on whether they like the new UI, but if anyone can explain why having the blind spot camera cover the next turn prompt when an app is full screen on the right is better than showing both at the same time, then I'd really like to hear why. Or if anyone would like to argue why the blind spot camera should be at the bottom left of the screen instead of closer to the top, I'd love to hear a case for that, because I am at a complete loss for why it is set up the way it is but I'm always open to the idea that maybe I'm just not seeing why the current design is optimal.

 

[S3XY1138]

Actually I don't think it is. I won't try to argue that it's dangerous on a routine basis, but there are specific circumstance that multiple people have described on TMC threads where driving required all their concentration and having extra distractions from the interface was a safety concern. The other point that is quite telling is that no one is trying to argue that the new interface is easier; they just say "it's not that hard."

I drove our Forester today for the first time in a month and a half and one thing that struck me was how easy it was to adjust the heating controls - I could do so without looking down at all. There's a knob to adjust the temperature setting that I could grab an turn without looking at it. Another knob for the vent setting and a button in the middle to tun on the defroster. Again, I could change settings without taking my eyes off the road at all. Ditto the wipers and the seat heater switches.

People argue that Tesla's touchscreen is 'the future.' It may have some advantages in terms of flexibility, but physical switches are the clear winner when it comes to ease of use. If you're going to use a touchscreen then getting the design right is critical.

I counted you complain about how hard it is to turn on the seat heater buttons over 50 times. How is that working out for you? Lol
As you state you live in part of the country which is always very cold day and night. Wouldn’t that mean you just leave them on? So you would actually never have to touch any buttons?

 

[patmurphey]

Now we rant about things that aren't even in the update? I guess I'm entitled to my 2 cents. I like the update with a few things that could be better. The blind spot view should be higher on the screen and the front seat heat icons larger (not important to me because the new auto feature works so well). Most things should be set before you drive. Yeah, some controls are different, but I don't see them as worse.

 

[sleepydoc]

Wow, lighten up. First, you’re taking it way out of context and misquoting what was said. Never said anyone is lying, they’re your opinions, and you certainly don’t have to agree with me, lol, clearly you don’t. Never said I can’t see how anyone else could have a problem, clearly you do but you should have known what you were getting yourself into when you bought a Tesla. No need to be condescending. And your talking in hypotheticals, not facts, which we can do all day to prove our own personal points. For example, driving a 5000 pound rocket at 70mph while flipping through cards to check if your tire pressure is the same as it was 5 mins ago and you’ve potentially killed someone… so they should probably remove the… oh wait… they did… safer rocket for everyone. It’s analogy about resistance to change and you are proving the point with every post.

Since you went there, maybe the point that you’re failing to realize is that you should take time to learn and understand the UI so that you’re a safer driver with the car that you now so unfortunately have whether you like it or not to be the safest driver you can be under the circumstances. Of course distractions can cause accidents and that’s why they’ve automated so much and moved other things out of the way.

And sir, your car is fast but it is not a missile, come on now…

From your previous post, "they work for me the majority of the time so don’t care to hear 'when they work' lol." That's at best dismissive and basically implying that anyone for whom the don't work is making it up. Not sure what other context I'm supposed to use there.

As for 'But you bought a car with only a touch screen… soooooooo…??? Trading it in?' and 'I should have known what I was getting my self into when I bought a Tesla.' Just how was I supposed to predict the future? This isn't me saying "I don't like the seats" or "I can't handle a screen." I based my decision on the UI that Tesla had in 2020. Up until now every update I have installed has been an improvement. Maybe a few things here or there that I didn't like or took some getting used to, but the overall trajectory has been up - that's been one of the joys of owning a Tesla. Until now. Now we have V11 foisted upon us. We can't go back; we're stuck with it. I also paid for FSD. To get the latest FSD update I'm required to get V11 so I don't have a choice, either. If I could go back, I would, but to imply that someone who's unhappy with the new UI has only themselves to blame is rather contemptuous.

Thank you for assuming that I haven't taken the time to learn the UI. I have learned it and I base my opinions on 3 weeks of use. I never said anything about spending 5 minutes checking tire pressure. I did say that the interface required more interaction and was distracting and that distraction is potentially deadly. Are you actually trying to argue that the new interface is easier when they've hidden things like the seat heaters and defrost and it requires more interaction to do almost everything? Automation only takes the place of controls when it works flawlessly. The automatic high beams? Nope. Automatic wipers? nope. Auto defrost? That doesn't even exist. Automatic cabin heat? Nope. Automatic seat heaters? These are probably the best of the automatic systems but I still need to change them about 40% of the time, so nope. This is the same as voice commands - it's a nice supplement but does not take the place for a good UI. If your UI requires these to be functional then you've failed. If I was resistant to change I wouldn't have purchased a Tesla in the first place. Assuming anyone with a complaint is "resistant to change" just says you can't actually consider their point of view.

Oh, I'll call it a 5000 pound battering ram gong 70 MPH. Maybe that's better?

 

[S3XY1138]

From your previous post, "they work for me the majority of the time so don’t care to hear 'when they work' lol." That's at best dismissive and basically implying that anyone for whom the don't work is making it up. Not sure what other context I'm supposed to use there.

As for 'But you bought a car with only a touch screen… soooooooo…??? Trading it in?' and 'I should have known what I was getting my self into when I bought a Tesla.' Just how was I supposed to predict the future? This isn't me saying "I don't like the seats" or "I can't handle a screen." I based my decision on the UI that Tesla had in 2020. Up until now every update I have installed has been an improvement. Maybe a few things here or there that I didn't like or took some getting used to, but the overall trajectory has been up - that's been one of the joys of owning a Tesla. Until now. Now we have V11 foisted upon us. We can't go back; we're stuck with it. I also paid for FSD. To get the latest FSD update I'm required to get V11 so I don't have a choice, either. If I could go back, I would, but to imply that someone who's unhappy with the new UI has only themselves to blame is rather contemptuous.

Thank you for assuming that I haven't taken the time to learn the UI. I have learned it and I base my opinions on 3 weeks of use. I never said anything about spending 5 minutes checking tire pressure. I did say that the interface required more interaction and was distracting and that distraction is potentially deadly. Are you actually trying to argue that the new interface is easier when they've hidden things like the seat heaters and defrost and it requires more interaction to do almost everything? Automation only takes the place of controls when it works flawlessly. The automatic high beams? Nope. Automatic wipers? nope. Auto defrost? That doesn't even exist. Automatic cabin heat? Nope. Automatic seat heaters? These are probably the best of the automatic systems but I still need to change them about 40% of the time, so nope. This is the same as voice commands - it's a nice supplement but does not take the place for a good UI. If your UI requires these to be functional then you've failed. If I was resistant to change I wouldn't have purchased a Tesla in the first place. Assuming anyone with a complaint is "resistant to change" just says you can't actually consider their point of view.

Oh, I'll call it a 5000 pound battering ram gong 70 MPH. Maybe that's better?

“Oh, I'll call it a 5000 pound battering ram gong 70 MPH. Maybe that's better?”
Do you have any data backing up your claim that the new UI is dangerous?

 

[TomServo]

So what “fixes” can we expect in future updates as Elon has alluded too?

Will these “fixes” make it BETTER or WORSE? Looking forward to those discussions.

 

[S3XY1138]

So what “fixes” can we expect in future updates as Elon has alluded too?

Will these “fixes” make it BETTER or WORSE? Looking forward to those discussions.

I hope the seat heater buttons are somehow moved 3 clicks away. Will be fun to see the Karen’s heads explode!

 

[Xdama]

“Oh, I'll call it a 5000 pound battering ram gong 70 MPH. Maybe that's better?”
Do you have any data backing up your claim that the new UI is dangerous?

Pretty sure the consensus of opinion from all other vehicle manufacturers is that blind spot monitoring should be in the wing mirror NOT a centralised screen on the dashboard. Maybe not data as such but certainly pretty evident to most Also that even though wipers are mainly auto nowadays they still have a 1 level operation via a stalk not push a button to call ip a sub menu on a screen.
Maybe … just maybe there’s reasons for those being as they are.
Same as other manufacturers don’t rely on just cameras for forward detection of objects they use radar (that Tesla decided to remove). They don’t use cameras because cameras can’t see in fog or shitty conditions. That is why FSD in Tesla (current form) won’t be accepted in UK.

 

[Xdama]

I hope the seat heater buttons are somehow moved 3 clicks away. Will be fun to see the Karen’s heads explode!

Hope they make them default to ON so you have to delve 3 lvls to switch them off

 

[S3XY1138]

Hope they make them default to ON so you have to delve 3 lvls to switch them off

They are default on, if you leave them on.

 

[Xdama]

They are default on, if you leave them on.

I meant default to on every time you restart the car even if you turned them off last time you got in. Much like BMW starting in Comfort mode or VW’s having to switch off lane assist (if you don’t want it) every time you start the car.

 

[SalisburySam]

So what “fixes” can we expect in future updates as Elon has alluded too?

Will these “fixes” make it BETTER or WORSE? Looking forward to those discussions.

I'm very much looking forward to Elon's fixes. I'm expecting the font will decrease on the speed display, but maybe something else. As to the discussions? Whatever happens those will continue to be entertaining.