On controlled access highways cars should get there.No you are not ever the driver when the system is operating in L3 mode. 99/100 people does not understand what OEDR is and that the main difference between L2 is that the system assists with the OEDR in L2 and does the full OEDR in L3.
OEDR: The Key Differentiator Between SAE Level 2 And Level 3 Automated Driving
A recent article unfortunately characterized ProPilot 2.0 as an SAE Level 3 system.www.forbes.com
Also, ”fallback ready” (DDT fallback) does not mean ”F-ing hell! take over immediately!!!“. It means ”Sir, I am sensing I won’t be able to drive in a bit, can you please start doing the OEDR now and take over in 10 secs or I’ll stop safely”.
I doubt current cars will ever get there.
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How much are you willing to pay for FSD V12?
- Thread starter gflar
- Start date
I doubt it. We don’t trust vision-only for any unsupervised safety critical applications incl Radiologi, which is both trivial by comparison and not time critical.
I agree that's a good metric, but that's a metric for an autonomous system. I certainly look forward to the day when I don't have to monitor the car, and the manufacturer takes liability, but unfortunately that's not the FSD product as sold. The FSD product is a driver assist system. That's all we were promised in writing.
As for it being a gimmick, I don't consider it as such even in its current form because it lessens my burden of driving. I can relax in the car for a lot of scenarios. Others, I have to watch it carefully. In some cases, I don't even bother with it, and I drive manually. But even dumb cruise control has long been useful, despite being far more "gimmicky" than FSD.
CDennis100
Member
Fair points. As an infrequent renter, I find…
1. it’s not bad on the highway, even with traffic. Has its quirks for sure.
2. it’s halfway decent on empty city streets or when there is no traffic.
3. it’s basically useless (to my palette) with city traffic or anything non-standard.
So, Sunday morning commutes when I’m out and about…with few others around? Sure…it works.
But try to navigate during rush hour? No freaking way.
Cones, construction zones, people and other drivers doing stupid stuff (welcome to the real world), ummm….nope.
Find a great parking spot and then later see the “no parking” sign? Good luck asking Tesla to pay where your car “auto parked”
Even as a L2 system it’s useless to me in any situation other than when I’m the only car on the road.
Interesting take. I use frequently use FSDb in rush hour traffic in the Dallas area. It works quite well for me. However, if I were an infrequent subscriber, I might be more hesitant since I would have less familiar with what it can, and cannot, do.
CDennis100
Member
Makes sense. Hey, if it works for you and you are comfy with….use it!
For me, when I have a car behind me…left turns are just no good (impatient drivers).
Here in Indy we have lots of “circles” or “roundabouts” and the tech just isn’t there yet.
And the random jerks and twists here and there confuse me, let alone surrounding drivers.
Again, it’s great on empty streets but I’m not comfy in traffic.
Back to the OP question…my answer remains the same. Fun to rent every few months. I would not purchase at anything more than 5k. I would buy it now for 5k though…knowing what I’m getting now and what I think I’d be getting over the next few years.
Tiger
Active Member
What I would actually like is for it to hold my steering wheel in a fixed position if I am not moving it. I hate it when the wheels pull the steering wheel in various directions (on uneven paved roads), the autopilot could totally eliminate this in almost similar fashion as a drive-by-wire experience. Other than that, I don't put on mascara that often ..
I believe I saw recently that Tesla had filed a steer-by-wire patent, so it may be coming in future cars. There are, obviously, significant safety considerations required before taking direct physical connection to steering away from the driver!
dbldwn02
Active Member
I bought in 2017...so FSD will be working correctly when it does all this...
Still waiting for "regulatory approval"
Can't wait to ride share my 2017 car or have robotic Superchargers, sometime in the next decade or two.
Optimus' first paying job should be plugging in superchargers for tips.I bought in 2017...so FSD will be working correctly when it does all this...
View attachment 953772
Still waiting for "regulatory approval"
Can't wait to ride share my 2017 car or have robotic Superchargers, sometime in the next decade or two.
Tiger
Active Member
I meant, this can be implemented simply (with software update) by making autopilot drive straight if you are not touching the wheel, and let go effortlessly (instead the quite a jerk needed nowdays to disengage autopilot). Ofcourse it wouldn't be called autopilot, but something like "[x] activate steering wheel stabilizer".
Well, first off, Tesla has to decide to relieve the driver of the steering wheel attentiveness requirement. I'm not sure what the difference is between 'drive straight' and autopilot. I presume that your driving straight concept includes following curves in the road and not running into slower traffic - which sounds a lot like basic autopilot.
If all you want is an easier disengagement by using the wheel, perhaps that doable, depending on how the car senses steering input and how much tolerance it needs so that road induced deviations are not misinterpreted as driver inputs. But, Tesla likely set the current disengagement force with good reason.
Tiger
Active Member
The main problem is ... you can't trust autopilot to drive straight, so this would be a different option. It would be an add-on setting to the TACC, when you don't want to drive on autopilot, but you want the car to go straight and not try to follow the dents in the road.
GalacticHero
M3-AWD+
Is that a screen capture from right when you bought the car?I bought in 2017...so FSD will be working correctly when it does all this...
View attachment 953772
Still waiting for "regulatory approval"
Can't wait to ride share my 2017 car or have robotic Superchargers, sometime in the next decade or two.
You've totally lost me here. It sounds like you want the car to drive a fixed compass angle no matter what. Great if you want to drive into a bridge abutment or a ditch. Limited utility otherwise.
pilotSteve
Active Member
I have exactly the same text from when I purchased my 2016 S90D with "full self driving"..... Still waiting...
dbldwn02
Active Member
Yup. It stayed on the website through until early 2018 when HW2.5 came out.
HW2.5 was released in August 2017, and that's consistent with what I remember from back then. MCU2 was March 2018, HW3 was March 2019.
gtae07
Member
The backdriving of the wheel is a good thing--helps with awareness of "what's it doing now?" And if it needs to disengage while going around a turn, and it isn't turned as it normally would be, what should it do?
With steer by wire, separate the interior of the steering wheel from the wheel itself. Now you have all the steering wheel buttons and knobs at a constant position all the time. The only thing lost is the sense of the neutral position of the steering wheel. Something else would have to serve that purpose. Ideally, go beyond that and provide some sort of road wheel angle indicator.
My only problem with the proposal is that it makes it easier to accidentally interrupt software control. Without a torque sensor, just bumping the wheel could be enough to make the car go ballistic. I'd want a pretty obvious indication of whether the software was in control or not so that I'd subconsciously know. A small blue steering wheel in the corner of the display isn't nearly enough.
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