Hate to break it to you but the TM3 has a radiator just like the cracked one on your Camry
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hypothetical Question-Life Span of a 3?
- Thread starter Midwest Guy
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Msjulie
Active Member
FWIW I've been told the stress on the cooling systems of EVs is far less than an ICE engine - system not pressurized or running at temps above 200. I wonder how much that helps..
Radiators in general aren't necessarily tough to replace but it's clear the only thing Tesla wants you to do 'up front' is put your groceries in or maybe add some windshield washer fluid..
dgpcolorado
high altitude member
While true, the Tesla one runs at moderate temperatures, as opposed to the radiator in an ICE car, and should be subject to less thermal stress.
My concern is whether replacement batteries will even be available in, say, 10 years, should one be needed. By that time Tesla may have gone on to other chemistries and form factors and putting those into an old car is a non-trivial problem. Will they still be making old style battery packs? Would you want to pay the huge cost of a new battery for such an old car? I'm guessing no, not that my crystal ball is anything but cloudy on this topic.
Aftermarket. When new technology that really works to double or triple the range people will be out of warranty anyway. There’s got to be a way for Tesla to unlock these cars so they can live on to 1M miles as promised.
insaneoctane
Well-Known Member
One factor that potentially really helps the "odds" of Tesla offering battery replacements/upgrades is that there are 500,000 orders for this car as is. While there will be some tweaks over the course of the 2 years or so it takes to fulfill these orders, there will be a LOT of 2017/2018/2019 Model 3's. Having lots of them helps the odds that Tesla will offer a future path if batteries need replacement/upgrade in, say, 10 or 15 years.
Uncle Paul
Well-Known Member
To ideas I have heard for batteries that get too weak to be acceptable to the owner, and degraded.
1. Have the battery back tested and replace only those individual cells that are weakest with new ones. Little cost and can add years to the productive life of the pack.
2. Repurpose a degraded battery pack for use as a power wall. While it may not have enough oomph to provide 300 miles of range, it will certainly have enough capacity to back up and time shift power purchasing/usage to minimize costs during peak times.
1. Have the battery back tested and replace only those individual cells that are weakest with new ones. Little cost and can add years to the productive life of the pack.
2. Repurpose a degraded battery pack for use as a power wall. While it may not have enough oomph to provide 300 miles of range, it will certainly have enough capacity to back up and time shift power purchasing/usage to minimize costs during peak times.
dgpcolorado
high altitude member
People have been predicting that for years but it hasn't happened yet. I remain skeptical.
david_42
Member
I'm with USAA and going from a 2006 Kia to a 2019 Model 3 will increase my insurance about $50 every six months. That's two fill-ups for the Kia, AKA two weeks of commuting. Electricity should be about one fill-up a month, so by the fourth week, I've covered the insurance the next five months.
Of course there is. Vibration and thermal cycling.
Nothing just spontaneously breaks. When things fail, it is for predictable, physical reasons. Things overheat and something melts. Things stretch and something cracks. Things vibrate and it shakes apart.
That's why folks who need things to last for a long time are able to test them for a shorter time with more extreme levels of vibration and thermal cycling and draw useful conclusions.
With no engine and exhaust system driving the temperatures where all the parts live up, with no engine vibration shaking, and with the main computer liquid cooled, the usual reasons for wear are reduced - and component failure rates should follow.
Right when they released new 0-60 times
Tesla upgrades its electric motor on the road to have powertrains lasting 1 million miles
The above misleading piece has been discussed before.
This below from New Motors - 1 million mile life. Model 3 the last car you buy? sums it up best.
Electrek is a known Tesla fanboy site anyway. And, there is no evidence any drive units in any currently or previously shipping Teslas can even last anywhere near 1 million miles.
100 pc agree. I think the coming 10 years are going to be very interesting, probably the most interesting period since the invention of automobile. We will see autonomous driving, and major advancement in battery technology will make EVs a lot cheaper than ICEs. We will likely see a massive reduction in traffic accidents.
We already have PLENTY of examples of where Tesla longevity isn't particularly good, despite "less complexity". And, here we have a brand new motor design on the 3 besides so much else being brand new on the 3.
The 300K mile vehicle eHawk had a drive unit and battery pack replaced, which actually isn't too terrible vs. some others like:
2016 Tesla Model X Long-Term Road Test - Wrap-Up (look under Maintenance & Repairs) for 20 months and 24K miles
6th drive unit replacement and more
Drive Unit Replacement Poll
Drive Unit Replacement Poll
$2700 to fix MCU. Might DIY, but how much to reprogram new unit? (was a followup to Model S Not Ready For Commercial Use Prime Time. Can I afford to own this car?)
Early on, Model S DUs were terrible in terms of needing to be replaced for noise (mostly): Two Thirds of Early Model S Drivetrains May Fail By 60,000miles.
2013 Tesla Model S Long-Term Wrap-Up | Edmunds had a replacement for noise, another for failure the another for noise, besides a new battery pack and 12 volt all within 17 months and 30K miles.
Even issues with revision -Q: 100% drive unit failure rate?? and some more failures I pointed to at First Model 3 motor failure reported.
Look at automotive reliability and durability testing and look at the reply in post #6 given all the issues w/the doors on the Model X.
And there's Clunking sound is costing me a bundle to fix out of warranty and many folks having half-shafts replaced on the X, sometimes multiple times: Acceleration Shudder.
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Dan Detweiler
Active Member
...and you are quoting articles at least two years old, some 5 or 6. If you are convinced that the Tesla drive units are going to fail then nothing anybody can say will change that. I see a company that stands behind its product, is very intent on fixing any problems that come up (especially on the Model 3) and seems totally committed to the long term quality of its products.
You say tomato, I say tomahto.
Dan
Seems like drive unit revisions stopped with the vaunted revision -Q, yet they still continue to fail.
Here are some links in the posts I cited that are NOT over 2 years old:
Car died today. Gear indicators turned red.
A bad week - Drive Unit Need Service
New Drive unit for 2016 refresh
I'm sure I can find more DU failures within the past 2 years posted here.
Yet, you say that Tesla isn't old enough then complain about some failures being from 2 years ago or 5 or 6 years ago. Weird.
And, from the survey I pointed to, Tom Saxton himself said "Of the vehicles that have been reported to the Plug In America Model S owner survey, 32% of the 2012 model year cars have had their drive unit replaced at least once, 27% of 2013's, and 18% of 2014".
Tesla seems to be more a a company about hype (e.g. snake charger, insane mode, ludicrous mode, "infinite mile" (with caveats) DU warranty (and not on the 3 either), D, bioweapons defense mode, Falcon wing doors, "Autopilot", "full-self driving", lines at stores by taking deposits at them, etc.) than long term quality, which isn't as "sexy" to the media and the general public.
They do have a warranty. If Model 3 DUs start failing at a rate that starts attracting media attention, it'll be interesting if Elon extends the DU warranty on the 3, just like he did in response on the S. What's another several million $ here and there each quarter when each year is hundreds of millions in losses (over $600 million in loss just last quarter)?
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Dan Detweiler
Active Member
I don't think anyone disagrees. When we read posts of folks who expect to keep their cars 10 or 15 years, or expect the Toyota quality, we think there's a few things worth reminding. I personally expect build quality to be more similar with competitor brands such as BMW or Mercedes than say Toyota.
Kant.Ing
Member
Kant.Ing
Member
Don't forget quad motors and unidirectional wheels, and we will be able to ride on multiple axis gimbals with the robot itself doing crazy maneuvers at high speed!
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