I just let it confuse everyone around me about what’s going on, you know, zero interventions.
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Wiki MASTER THREAD: Actual FSD Beta downloads and experiences
- Thread starter jebinc
- Start date
Now you're getting close to Whole Mars Catelog's league!
And sometimes even disabling the turn signal becomes a PITA with the right turn signal suddenly becoming a left turn signal then a right. Zero interventions my _ss!
I quit watching after this one. FSDj was stuck behind a double parked truck for almost 2.5 mins. The initial lead vehicle quickly noted the double parked vehicle and quickly negotiated a lane change. Check out the planner path while it negotiates an opening. With all those wacky path calculations it's no wonder FSDj couldn't find an opening.
Came back from some running around this morning and was first in line in a left turn lane. The light turns green, oncoming traffic clears, and j11.43 just sits there. I had the feeling it wouldn't make the traffic light so I finally nudged it through.
11.4.3 still enters left turn lanes with little regard for when the left turn lane begins. There can be traffic lined up with no traffic in the left turn lane and the planner drive into the back of stationary traffic before entering the left turn lane. As before, 11.4.3 seems to be keying on distance from the intersection and not with respect to visualization. NN training seems to generalize that many left turn lanes are short distanced (maybe 2 cars in length).
Turning into my residential neighborhood remains the same as it's been for a while. Stiff braking with a last second turn-in and predominate angle posture in the median. If oncoming traffic delays the left turn, leave ego's rear end out in traffic. Defintely unsafe and inconsiderate.
11.4.3 still enters left turn lanes with little regard for when the left turn lane begins. There can be traffic lined up with no traffic in the left turn lane and the planner drive into the back of stationary traffic before entering the left turn lane. As before, 11.4.3 seems to be keying on distance from the intersection and not with respect to visualization. NN training seems to generalize that many left turn lanes are short distanced (maybe 2 cars in length).
Turning into my residential neighborhood remains the same as it's been for a while. Stiff braking with a last second turn-in and predominate angle posture in the median. If oncoming traffic delays the left turn, leave ego's rear end out in traffic. Defintely unsafe and inconsiderate.
I've been keeping a list of situations which often require interventions, and all repeatable at least in these locations. Now the 11.4.3 is out, here are my 11.4.2 issues. I'm looking forward to see if any of these have improved.
11.4.2 Progress
Improved (maybe, somewhat) from 11.3.6
Regress
Still Bad, Not Fixed from 11.3.6
Generally OK still.
11.4.2 Progress
• No previously noted problems fixed.
Improved (maybe, somewhat) from 11.3.6
• Reduced random blinker activations along winding residential road, but still routine.
• Problem merging into freeway through lane when the on-ramp goes into a short merge lane which shortly becomes exit only. 11.4.2 did OK sometimes, but still sometimes failed to merge and took the off-ramp, even with no cars nearby.
• FSD more available than 11.3.6, but still blinks off sometimes. E.g. steering wheel must be nearly straight to engage.
• Responds quicker to blinker requested lane change. This may be OK now.
• Gives longer to cancel automatic lane change. This may be OK now.
Regress
• Abrupt slow down well before stop sign. This is a regression, it was fixed in 11.3.6.
Still Bad, Not Fixed from 11.3.6
• Bad lane choice, took left turn lane when route was straight through.
• Takes center of 2 lane section at intersection, blocking free right turn lane. Line divider marking is badly faded, but road is 2 lanes wide and route is a left turn shortly.
• Stopped mid intersection when it saw red light for cross street.
• Still ignores "Oncoming Traffic Does Not Stop" sign, at a 3 way stop at a 4 way intersection.
• Thinks one onramp has a speed limit of 30 till very close to merge area, failing to match freeway speed.
• Pauses for a two count at all stop signs. One beat would be plenty, and if it doesn't satisfy the NHSTA, then we need to fix the NHSTA, not FSD.
• 30 mph speed limit on ramp should be 65 mph to allow merge at speed
• Minimize lane changes settings is re-set for each drive.
• Still uses torque sense to monitor driver attention.
New Problems• None noted.
Generally OK still.
• FSD on freeways is substantially better than old AP.
I have a turn left lane right outside my neighborhood where it will enter the lane early only if there is traffic. If it's the lead car it will enter the turn lane very late and be at some awkward angle like you describe.
11.4.3 was downloaded yesterday. Step backward from 11.4.2. More phantom braking, more jerky, still unresolved issues with roundabouts, much less smooth.
I have the impression that when you use a new version a couple of days it gets better. Hopefully this will happen with 11.4.3, but my first impressions are that it is a regression from previous version.
I have the impression that when you use a new version a couple of days it gets better. Hopefully this will happen with 11.4.3, but my first impressions are that it is a regression from previous version.
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sleepydoc
Well-Known Member
This 100%, I went from being able to do 0 intervention drive across DFW metroplex in medium to semi heavy traffic, to unable to drive 5 mins without having to take over due to getting in random turn lanes, unsafe ghost braking, and the car playing chicken on unmarked roads it used to nail perfectly
Yeah, this is driving me nuts, too. If you have a convenient way to completely cancel FSD (i.e. stalk), that will turn off the signal and you can immediately re-engage TACC, wait until past the trigger, and then re-enable FSD. OTOH, if you cancel via steering, which is more likely when you aren't anticipating an issue, the signal stays on until you correct it, but at least won't go the other way because FSD had corrected it milliseconds ahead of you.And sometimes even disabling the turn signal becomes a PITA with the right turn signal suddenly becoming a left turn signal then a right. Zero interventions my _ss!
sleepydoc
Well-Known Member
Several versions ago when Omar was having all these zero intervention drives many people speculated that it was only because he didn't care how much he inconvenienced other drivers.
The current version (at least 11.3.6) is much better in that regard and I routinely have zero intervention drives where the worst inconvenience other drivers experience is me coming to a full stop at a stop sign, but there are still plenty of times where it does things like turn on a blink twice for no reason, start to enter a turn lane then turn on the signal and exit it, etc. Can you complete the drive without helping the car at all? Probably but it depends on how much you're willing to confuse, annoy or inconvenience other drivers.
IME, the biggest offender continues to be lane planning which leads to inappropriate signaling, erroneous use of turn lanes and illogical lane changes. It's frustrating because the right course is generally obvious to a human but the fact that it continues to persist tells me that the solution is not as easy as it would seem. At least there has been slow but steady improvement over the last several releases.
11.4.3 is better than 11.4.2 for several of my edge cases. One is path planning is more human like when turning on to another road and lining up with the lane and at the right speed. That said, I do not think it is relevant to judge incremental minor version to version changes for each of our individual edge cases. Much more conclusive to compare major versions, like version 10 verses 11, and all of our impressions in aggregate. For instance in the last six months my intervention rate has dropped by 50% across all my test routes. It is getting better, and at a faster rate.
While some experiences hee seem to differ, mine is similar to yours, and I agree with your assessment of 11.3.6. I can't say the same for 11.4.2, though, it's bad, and if I'm being honest, 11.4.3 might even be worse than 11.4.2 in some ways, even if it is slightly better in others. I'd much rather still be on 11.3.6; 11.4.2 has made the last couple weeks longer all by itself.
Ok. What's the question?
I'm still on 2023.7.10 and would love to get an install notice with all the updates of the 2023.12 branch updates.
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