My Experience Taking my Model Y down to 0%

[Dugdale]

My 2023 model Y LR 19" stock wheels from Fremont has 17k miles on it, the weather was decent (62F and sunny) so I ran my battery down to 0% (0 miles). I mainly did this to lessen my fears of running out of battery on a road trip.

I started with a full battery (100% charged from home), usually when I charge to 100% for a long trip the last 8% usually takes about 35 minutes, this time it took 111 minutes. I am guessing the battery needed a lot of balancing since it has been months since I've charged to 100%.

• 317 rated miles at 100% (the number at the top of the screen near the battery icon, I think Tesla calls it "Total estimated driving distance (or energy) available")
• 315 actual miles driven to 0% from Tesla "since last charge" trip meter
• 318 miles driven shown by my USAA insurance app
• 6 hours 56 minutes of driving over a couple days, highway and county roads mostly in the Denver area at around 60F (USAA app)
• 71kWh consumption of the battery (from Tesla trip meter)
• 224wH/mile averaged. 71kWh divided by 224wH/mile = 317 miles which is magically what Tesla estimated before I started driving.
• When I got to 0% I didn't notice any power loss, however I could see 4 dots on the right side of the Power Meter. 5% is when the dots started to appear.
• I received plenty of warnings that I was getting low, the last few miles I circled my local supercharger station.
• When I tried to supercharge at 0 miles I got an error message saying something like "charging stopped". I freaked out a bit and I started to think this test has ruined my battery!
• I tried another stall and it started charging at 165kW right away and within 45 seconds it was already at 250kW. From 4% all the way to 11% it stayed at 250kW which seemed really good considering I did not precondition the battery at all and it was 62F.
• The charging session took 1:22 from 0% to 100%. (Tesla estimated 55 minutes)
• +80kWh total for the supercharger session receipt which I think included some HVAC and watching Youtube while waiting.
• +76kWh actually went just to the battery (number shown below "Charging Complete" message at top of screen).
• After the supercharger session the new rated miles at the top of the screen dropped slightly to 316.
• As for degradation I am not sure how to calculated it. If it was rated for 330 new and now displaying 316, I guess that is -4.2%. But I used -71kWh draining it to 0%, but it received +76kWh to fill it back up so I not sure how to calculate that.
• After doing this test I do feel more confident about not running out of battery.

Did this hurt my battery? I watched this video from Jeff Dahn and he suggests (20 minutes into the video) a depth of discharge of only 25% daily for NMC batteries (which is about what I am doing.) Jeff indicated that every 500 hours they did a "check up cycle" from 100% to 0% during the 2.5 years of testing. I am not sure what that check up cycle equates to in miles, but I am guessing do a "check up cycle" every 17k miles is OK for the health of the battery.

"Tesla Model Y in San Ramon" by DestinationFearFan is licensed under CC BY-SA 4.0.
Admin note: Image added for Blog Feed thumbnail

 

[ewoodrick]

It didn't hurt your battery.

 

[holmgang]

1.5hr using 2.5kw power (~4kwh) for heating and computer seems about right.

 

[RickCRNA]

With reasonable care and attention, I feel confident about not running out of battery. Certainly didn’t need to run my MYLR battery to 0% for me to feel confident. Your exercise seems unwise per Tesla’s recommendations re: maintaining battery health.

 

[LostVector]

With reasonable care and attention, I feel confident about not running out of battery. Certainly didn’t need to run my MYLR battery to 0% for me to feel confident. Your exercise seems unwise per Tesla’s recommendations re: maintaining battery health.

Doing a 100 to 0 run every year is perfectly fine. No individual cycle of that depth is “good” for the battery, but at that rate it would take decades or centuries to noticeably impact the battery. There are many other reasons for the battery or the car to fail in that period of time.

 

[Mr.S3XY]

So, even with your battery indicator showing 0%, you still had another 20 miles to go for full depletion. You could theoretically add that to your available "mileage".

 

[Msicario]

My 2023 model Y LR 19" stock wheels from Fremont has 17k miles on it, the weather was decent (62F and sunny) so I ran my battery down to 0% (0 miles). I mainly did this to lessen my fears of running out of battery on a road trip.

I started with a full battery (100% charged from home), usually when I charge to 100% for a long trip the last 8% usually takes about 35 minutes, this time it took 111 minutes. I am guessing the battery needed a lot of balancing since it has been months since I've charged to 100%.

• 317 rated miles at 100% (the number at the top of the screen near the battery icon, I think Tesla calls it "Total estimated driving distance (or energy) available")
• 315 actual miles driven to 0% from Tesla "since last charge" trip meter
• 318 miles driven shown by my USAA insurance app
• 6 hours 56 minutes of driving over a couple days, highway and county roads mostly in the Denver area at around 60F (USAA app)
• 71kWh consumption of the battery (from Tesla trip meter)
• 224wH/mile averaged. 71kWh divided by 224wH/mile = 317 miles which is magically what Tesla estimated before I started driving.
• When I got to 0% I didn't notice any power loss, however I could see 4 dots on the right side of the Power Meter. 5% is when the dots started to appear.
• I received plenty of warnings that I was getting low, the last few miles I circled my local supercharger station.
• When I tried to supercharge at 0 miles I got an error message saying something like "charging stopped". I freaked out a bit and I started to think this test has ruined my battery!
• I tried another stall and it started charging at 165kW right away and within 45 seconds it was already at 250kW. From 4% all the way to 11% it stayed at 250kW which seemed really good considering I did not precondition the battery at all and it was 62F.
• The charging session took 1:22 from 0% to 100%. (Tesla estimated 55 minutes)
• +80kWh total for the supercharger session receipt which I think included some HVAC and watching Youtube while waiting.
• +76kWh actually went just to the battery (number shown below "Charging Complete" message at top of screen).
• After the supercharger session the new rated miles at the top of the screen dropped slightly to 316.
• As for degradation I am not sure how to calculated it. If it was rated for 330 new and now displaying 316, I guess that is -4.2%. But I used -71kWh draining it to 0%, but it received +76kWh to fill it back up so I not sure how to calculate that.
• After doing this test I do feel more confident about not running out of battery.

Did this hurt my battery? I watched this video from Jeff Dahn and he suggests (20 minutes into the video) a depth of discharge of only 25% daily for NMC batteries (which is about what I am doing.) Jeff indicated that every 500 hours they did a "check up cycle" from 100% to 0% during the 2.5 years of testing. I am not sure what that check up cycle equates to in miles, but I am guessing do a "check up cycle" every 17k miles is OK for the health of the battery.

Great information; Very helpfulThank you

 

[RickCRNA]

Doing a 100 to 0 run every year is perfectly fine. No individual cycle of that depth is “good” for the battery, but at that rate it would take decades or centuries to noticeably impact the battery. There are many other reasons for the battery or the car to fail in that period of time.

And what battery science facts are you basing your opinion on?

 

[Pianewman]

And what battery science facts are you basing your opinion on?

Tesla battery tests include a test that draws the battery down to 0%, lingering for "x" amount of time, and then charging to 100%, again, lingering long enough to balance the cells. This is how battery capacity is determined.

This isn't advisable on a frequent basis, but an occasional draw down to 0% does no harm to the HV battery.

 

[LikesToys]

I read on this forum many times that cycling the battery to less than 20% does no harm to it, yet never have I seen any scientific evidence to support that. I then see graphs - but to date they they really don’t mention anything specifically about drawing down low. I do see graphs about ‘aging’ of the battery, but thats a different issue. Given no facts to work with, I too follow the advice of Jeff Dahn who recommends staying above 25% (he sometimes says 30%) as the minimum for general day to day commuting. Then there’s the advice from Tesla in the manual to stay above 20%.

I do acknowledge that both Tesla and Jeff Dahn suggest that we use the car when we need to and charge based on circumstances - but that is for ‘tripping’ not day to day.

So here is my question, can anyone please link to a study that says draining the battery to low on a regular basis causes no issues - Thanks

 

[ewoodrick]

I read on this forum many times that cycling the battery to less than 20% does no harm to it, yet never have I seen any scientific evidence to support that. I then see graphs - but to date they they really don’t mention anything specifically about drawing down low. I do see graphs about ‘aging’ of the battery, but thats a different issue. Given no facts to work with, I too follow the advice of Jeff Dahn who recommends staying above 25% (he sometimes says 30%) as the minimum for general day to day commuting. Then there’s the advice from Tesla in the manual to stay above 20%.

I do acknowledge that both Tesla and Jeff Dahn suggest that we use the car when we need to and charge based on circumstances - but that is for ‘tripping’ not day to day.

So here is my question, can anyone please link to a study that says draining the battery to low on a regular basis causes no issues - Thanks

Do you see scientific evidence that it doesn't?

Doing a 100%-0% doesn't really harm the battery, but it's stupid to do it.

• You learn how the battery worked on that cycle, in those specific conditions. Probably won't do it the same way again.
• You wasted an entire charge cycle of the precious resource that you are worrying about.

And now that you have the information, what can you do with it? Very little to nothing.



This has been discussed ad nauseum for years and the only words of wisdom so far is to stop worrying about the battery, there really isn't anything that you can do to help or harm it.

 

[LostVector]

And what battery science facts are you basing your opinion on?

Most graphs show about 500-1500 100% DoD cycles to cause degradation to 80%. One or two of those cycles per year to calibrate the BMS is hardly noteworthy in that context. I plan on calibrating once or twice a year.

 

[LikesToys]

Do you see scientific evidence that it doesn't?

Doing a 100%-0% doesn't really harm the battery, but it's stupid to do it.

• You learn how the battery worked on that cycle, in those specific conditions. Probably won't do it the same way again.
• You wasted an entire charge cycle of the precious resource that you are worrying about.

And now that you have the information, what can you do with it? Very little to nothing.



This has been discussed ad nauseum for years and the only words of wisdom so far is to stop worrying about the battery, there really isn't anything that you can do to help or harm it.

You provided no information to support your argument - I am not going to take such an expensive purchase and risk is longevity based on nothing more than an opinion, where is the science to support your argument.

 

[LostVector]

Do you see scientific evidence that it doesn't?

Doing a 100%-0% doesn't really harm the battery, but it's stupid to do it.

• You learn how the battery worked on that cycle, in those specific conditions. Probably won't do it the same way again.
• You wasted an entire charge cycle of the precious resource that you are worrying about.

And now that you have the information, what can you do with it? Very little to nothing.



This has been discussed ad nauseum for years and the only words of wisdom so far is to stop worrying about the battery, there really isn't anything that you can do to help or harm it.

The voltage measurements at the top and the bottom of state of charge help to calibrate the BMS to represent the true capacity of the battery. It's worth doing every so often as a single deep cycle is hurting the battery by a miniscule amount relative to the total expected lifetime of the battery and car.

 

[ewoodrick]

You provided no information to support your argument - I am not going to take such an expensive purchase and risk is longevity based on nothing more than an opinion, where is the science to support your argument.

It provides harm in exactly the method that I mentioned, it uses a "cycle" up, for which there are effectively a limited number of cycles.

I've been driving EVs for about 9 years, my Model 3 is one of the oldest and I've never "babied" the battery. Tesla has built all of the safety and longevity controls into the battery control systems.

This isn't a Lead Acid battery for which going to 0 does hurt it.

If you were to do a little looking around, you may find that current research is suggesting that taking the battery to 0 and letting it sit for a little may rejuvenate the battery!!

And trust me, it's actually nearly impossible to take a Tesla battery to 0. Like I said, Tesla protects you. 0% remaining isn't battery at 0%.

And I'm fully electric, I have no problem with either of my Teslas.

 

[tangible1]

Do you see scientific evidence that it doesn't?

Doing a 100%-0% doesn't really harm the battery, but it's stupid to do it.

• You learn how the battery worked on that cycle, in those specific conditions. Probably won't do it the same way again.
• You wasted an entire charge cycle of the precious resource that you are worrying about.

And now that you have the information, what can you do with it? Very little to nothing.



This has been discussed ad nauseum for years and the only words of wisdom so far is to stop worrying about the battery, there really isn't anything that you can do to help or harm it.

anxieties die hard.
the bottom line is Tesla battery packs are very robust.
says 5 Million cars on the road.

 

[DarrenHD]

I read on this forum many times that cycling the battery to less than 20% does no harm to it, yet never have I seen any scientific evidence to support that. I then see graphs - but to date they they really don’t mention anything specifically about drawing down low. I do see graphs about ‘aging’ of the battery, but thats a different issue. Given no facts to work with, I too follow the advice of Jeff Dahn who recommends staying above 25% (he sometimes says 30%) as the minimum for general day to day commuting. Then there’s the advice from Tesla in the manual to stay above 20%.

I do acknowledge that both Tesla and Jeff Dahn suggest that we use the car when we need to and charge based on circumstances - but that is for ‘tripping’ not day to day.

So here is my question, can anyone please link to a study that says draining the battery to low on a regular basis causes no issues - Thanks

I won't link you to any scientific studies, but I can tell from my experience smaller discharges and charging to mostly between 40-55% has done no harm (and looks like some good) to my battery. Look at this graph and 2023-24 where I started doing smaller discharges and charging to 50 or 55% most of the time. This graph shows just shy of three years. 2021 Model Y SR. The car is rated for 393 km of range when new. I'm currently sitting with 3% loss or 380kms of estimated range. Not bad. 58800kms driven. Yes I do a few road trips per year where I will charge to 100%. And occasionally I charge to 70%, then let it go to about 40. Charge back to 50% or 55%. Rinse, repeat. I plan to keep the car for many years, at least until 2029 when the battery warranty runs out. Which is why I am trying to keep the battery healthy. It may save me 2-3% in the later years. Maybe more.

 

[mborkow]

The way these cars chew through tires, you’d think that’s what everyone would be obsessing about rather than the batteries (for which we don’t seem to see many replacements)

 

[Alonzo]

224wH/mile averaged. 71kWh divided by 224wH/mile = 317 miles

I also have a 2023 MYLR. It has about 2500 miles on it. I have it set to "Chill" and I drive it like an old lady, piddle around town never above 65 mph on the highway. The best I can achieve, even short term, is 270 wh/mile. Is it because mine is still new? Do you just turn the hvac completely off?

Thanks.

 

[zoomer0056]

My 2023 model Y LR 19" stock wheels from Fremont has 17k miles on it, the weather was decent (62F and sunny) so I ran my battery down to 0% (0 miles). I mainly did this to lessen my fears of running out of battery on a road trip.

I started with a full battery (100% charged from home), usually when I charge to 100% for a long trip the last 8% usually takes about 35 minutes, this time it took 111 minutes. I am guessing the battery needed a lot of balancing since it has been months since I've charged to 100%.

• 317 rated miles at 100% (the number at the top of the screen near the battery icon, I think Tesla calls it "Total estimated driving distance (or energy) available")
• 315 actual miles driven to 0% from Tesla "since last charge" trip meter
• 318 miles driven shown by my USAA insurance app
• 6 hours 56 minutes of driving over a couple days, highway and county roads mostly in the Denver area at around 60F (USAA app)
• 71kWh consumption of the battery (from Tesla trip meter)
• 224wH/mile averaged. 71kWh divided by 224wH/mile = 317 miles which is magically what Tesla estimated before I started driving.
• When I got to 0% I didn't notice any power loss, however I could see 4 dots on the right side of the Power Meter. 5% is when the dots started to appear.
• I received plenty of warnings that I was getting low, the last few miles I circled my local supercharger station.
• When I tried to supercharge at 0 miles I got an error message saying something like "charging stopped". I freaked out a bit and I started to think this test has ruined my battery!
• I tried another stall and it started charging at 165kW right away and within 45 seconds it was already at 250kW. From 4% all the way to 11% it stayed at 250kW which seemed really good considering I did not precondition the battery at all and it was 62F.
• The charging session took 1:22 from 0% to 100%. (Tesla estimated 55 minutes)
• +80kWh total for the supercharger session receipt which I think included some HVAC and watching Youtube while waiting.
• +76kWh actually went just to the battery (number shown below "Charging Complete" message at top of screen).
• After the supercharger session the new rated miles at the top of the screen dropped slightly to 316.
• As for degradation I am not sure how to calculated it. If it was rated for 330 new and now displaying 316, I guess that is -4.2%. But I used -71kWh draining it to 0%, but it received +76kWh to fill it back up so I not sure how to calculate that.
• After doing this test I do feel more confident about not running out of battery.

Did this hurt my battery? I watched this video from Jeff Dahn and he suggests (20 minutes into the video) a depth of discharge of only 25% daily for NMC batteries (which is about what I am doing.) Jeff indicated that every 500 hours they did a "check up cycle" from 100% to 0% during the 2.5 years of testing. I am not sure what that check up cycle equates to in miles, but I am guessing do a "check up cycle" every 17k miles is OK for the health of the battery.

Excellent experiment and post!