I wonder if anyone at Tesla is concerned at all that this is more and more the enthusiast reaction to their actions?
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- Thread starter PluggedINLife
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I wonder if anyone at Tesla is concerned at all that this is more and more the enthusiast reaction to their actions?
Who cares what enthusiasts think, when it gets more and more people in the door spending money and buying cars?
The only way this changes, is if it hits their pocketbooks (less sales or class action lawsuit).
It's been awhile since I've received a ton of vote downs so I'm about due. 
All the posters here in this thread are Tesla veterans. It should be of absolutely no surprise that Elon Musk is overly optimistic and sets really ambitious stretch goals. Consequently asking if Elon is going to be late if asking if the Pope is Catholic. Is this really a question?
I don't believe Elon to be dishonest (thanks for telling the world you don't think TSLA deserves its valuation - sometimes modesty DOESNT PAY)
I wish people would take some of the considerations to heart
- We are all very early adopters that take the brunt of the cutting edge.
- Autopilot will never kill you. The only person that can kill you is yourself. As long as you have a steering wheel the final responsibility is on the driver.
- Instead of focusing on what isn't here, focus on the progress made. I took delivery on 12-12-2016. I didn't even have cruise control. Two weeks go, I did all but maybe 5 miles on a trip to Vegas (turned off for local roads) with AP2 on. No problem at all.
- I think the real goal is to get AP2 and FSDC in good shape for the Model 3 launch. While Tesla doesn't want to piss off 100,000 drivers on purpose, they better not piss off 500,000 drivers. People who are coming over to Tesla for the very first time.
The only people who should really have a right to feel bad is those who leased. They have 1/6th lease over without AP1 parity and no say in the matter. I think Tesla should figure out a way to take care of them in a future lease/purchase.
Rest of us who are buy/hold AP2 cars, don't stress, have patience and drive cars how you've always driven them your entire life. The benefit of being rock bottom is you can only go up. Every month is Christmas with new things to try out.
I look forward to going to MyTesla and plopping down the upgrade to FSDC once we get some features that are unique to EAP that will add value to the driving experience.
All the posters here in this thread are Tesla veterans. It should be of absolutely no surprise that Elon Musk is overly optimistic and sets really ambitious stretch goals. Consequently asking if Elon is going to be late if asking if the Pope is Catholic. Is this really a question?
I don't believe Elon to be dishonest (thanks for telling the world you don't think TSLA deserves its valuation - sometimes modesty DOESNT PAY)
I wish people would take some of the considerations to heart
- We are all very early adopters that take the brunt of the cutting edge.
- Autopilot will never kill you. The only person that can kill you is yourself. As long as you have a steering wheel the final responsibility is on the driver.
- Instead of focusing on what isn't here, focus on the progress made. I took delivery on 12-12-2016. I didn't even have cruise control. Two weeks go, I did all but maybe 5 miles on a trip to Vegas (turned off for local roads) with AP2 on. No problem at all.
- I think the real goal is to get AP2 and FSDC in good shape for the Model 3 launch. While Tesla doesn't want to piss off 100,000 drivers on purpose, they better not piss off 500,000 drivers. People who are coming over to Tesla for the very first time.
The only people who should really have a right to feel bad is those who leased. They have 1/6th lease over without AP1 parity and no say in the matter. I think Tesla should figure out a way to take care of them in a future lease/purchase.
Rest of us who are buy/hold AP2 cars, don't stress, have patience and drive cars how you've always driven them your entire life. The benefit of being rock bottom is you can only go up. Every month is Christmas with new things to try out.
I look forward to going to MyTesla and plopping down the upgrade to FSDC once we get some features that are unique to EAP that will add value to the driving experience.
You most certainly did have cruise control. It was in all AP2 from the beginning. Nothing else though. White circle with speed.
True. I mean, it is not like Tesla has to resort to anti-selling future products or coming up with quarterly demand levers.
That is actually NOT how Levels 3-5 work. And that is one more thing Elon said ours cars would have...
It becomes harder to believe that, though.
What I find odd is how personal some people make this. What does my AP2 car experience have to do with anything, anyway. The broader picture matters.
And in that broader picture, Elon and Tesla have become less trustworthy. And that's not nice. It isn't nice even if I were to love every minute of driving my car.
Didn't your Dad tell you not to get a girlfriend that costs $100k+ in return for making that promise...
We was poor folk, monetary discussions rarely exceeded 3 digit numbers. And no k's following them either, this was before k's.
Well, I already "Married Up" when I snagged Mrs. Toe. The Model 3 will be my second marry up from my Kia Soul EV. Gonna be a very sad day when I have to part ways with the Hamster Mobile
. You never forget your first EV...
Well stated MX. I think a lot of what you see on this thread and a lot of other threads is simply a difference in philosophy between "glass half full" types and "glass half empty" types. Yes Elon sets unrealistic goals for his team, and yes, he tweets that things are coming sooner than they typically deliver them. This is new stuff that no one has ever done before.
A lot of people expecting absolute perfection on the day Elon first says something might appear because the car cost $100,000 are always going to be disappointed. If Tesla waited until every function was perfect before releasing it, there would be no cars on the road. They can only "get away" with this cause they can upgrade software over time. To not take advantage of that from a business standpoint would be 10x more stupid than what they are doing now. Naysayers complaints notwithstanding.
I do software for a living, and spend a lot of time testing software. So being a "beta tester", even for the most expensive car I ever bought is something that I look forward to. I can certainly see how a lot of people do not look at it that way. They just want something that works as promised, with no problems, 100% of the time. The thing is, this is not your Grandfathers world. His Edsel had a few issues of it's own...
Edsel - Wikipedia
RT
Nope original AP2 cars had no cruise control at all, not even dumb "set speed" CC. It was added fairly quickly, but it wasn't there at the beginning.
This is my point exactly. Some people don't remember the PROGRESSION despite the tardiness of delivery. Tesla 'reasonably achieved' parity of a *15 BILLION DOLLAR MARKET CAP COMPANY, MOBILEYE, IN A MATTER OF MONTHS* - that is damn impressive!
As an aside when discussing company valuations for investors in the group, Tesla at 50 Billion is not horrible if Mobileye could was bought for 15 Billion.
I remember very clearly, the Tesla Model X as of December 2016 was not as 'safe' from a sensory and automation perspective as my 2017 Chevy Volt.
No working blind spot sensors. Can you imagine how potentially frustrating that would be going from Car A to Car X where Car X is 3X the price?
I use the word potentially frustrating because I knew not too much could be expected from Tesla on a brand new hardware platform and writing software from scratch.
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Agree with everything you said. Also, keep in mind that when Elon is tweeting, he's doing so based on his secret pre-alpha firmware that is months or years ahead of what the rest of us have. Back when HW2 was announced and they promised parity with HW1 by end of 2016, they were probably testing versions of HW2 that had the HW1 MobilEye chipset/functionality built in. When MobilEye refused (threatened to sue?) Tesla, there was no choice but to start from scratch. But amazingly, Tesla was able to re-build the whole thing in about 6 months.
Tam
Well-Known Member
Has anyone got any conventional/simple/dumb cruise control control function ever since AP2 comes out?
As annoying as the exaggeration, euphemized by some as optimism, is Musk's tendency to communicate only in cryptic tweets, leaving customers to speculate about what he means. It's demeaning to us.
Tesla, if you want your customers to be advocates for your products don't keep us in the dark about what's going on. Write a newsletter, or hold a customer conference call with Q&A like the investors' Earnings Call.
Tesla, if you want your customers to be advocates for your products don't keep us in the dark about what's going on. Write a newsletter, or hold a customer conference call with Q&A like the investors' Earnings Call.
They were still making that end of 2016 "expectation" in late December, when they were already delivering cars without the MobileEye chipset and embarking on the long process of writing the software from scratch. That's not optimism, its deception.
I agree ethically and legally they should have communicated the change. They instead decided to string customers along. Maybe they felt it was the lesser of two evils, something that customers would eventually forgive or forget. Investors are less forgiving however.
Here's the issue. I think its very possible that Tesla has a build of all promised features at end of 2016.
That software build would exists on Musk's car and other employee testing cars. The problem with development and bugs is deciding when something is "good enough" for release to the general public.
We are dealing with a 5000lb+ vehicle that transports human lives. Tesla has to error on the ultra side of caution when releasing updates to the general public.
Let's be 100% honest. The SECOND that local auto-steer is available, someone is going to try it on the twistiest, most poorly marked, two way mountain road possible.
Instead of having hands on the wheel, hypothetical wannabe Youtube star is going to be too busy trying to film a video discussing "the latest firmware". A 1/10000 corner case gets triggered on firmware that needed more testing.
Tesla Model S slams head on into another car. People die.
Tesla and the autonomous car movement is set back how long?
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As a "classic" no AP owner the issue I have is the updates are just as likely to make things WORSE as they are to make them better. Forget the promises of a better media player or phone integration or an API for apps (LOL - good one Elon, good one!) - how about just not making things crappier. I mean the recent debacle where they disabled re-circulate on the A/C at fan speed 3 or below is a good example. It was disabled for months for several of us before they quietly reinstated it with a subsequent patch release (that many of us never got and had to wait for a more significant release). Even now it is apparent that fan speed 3 isn't as strong as it used to be....ridiculous.
This isn't just "oh Elon, he's an exaggerator" stuff. Honestly, beyond the size of the current center console display is anything about the UI better than many contemporaries??? A media player with mediocre phone integration? No support for Android Auto or Apple Carplay? Comically small on-screen buttons given the size of the display? A brow....ser.....too....slow....to...u...404 error.
This isn't just "oh Elon, he's an exaggerator" stuff. Honestly, beyond the size of the current center console display is anything about the UI better than many contemporaries??? A media player with mediocre phone integration? No support for Android Auto or Apple Carplay? Comically small on-screen buttons given the size of the display? A brow....ser.....too....slow....to...u...404 error.
Well, cynicism and bitterness aside, if Tesla delivers this update and it's as Elon says, that would be wonderful. The smoothness of curve tracking is one of the most glaring remaining discrepancies between AP1 and AP2 real-world performance. The new steering algorithm will make a lot of people happy/happier.
